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What's the going CPM rate nowadays for preroll?

Did TiVo hire an army of sales reps to sell directly to advertisers in various markets?

Or are they just leveraging a back-fill ad network? (Substantially less revenue there)

how much revenue do we actually think this will bring in? They have less than 1M retail customers as of now. (Not all of which are eligible for ads)

if they're using an ad network I can't see them making a ton of money.

If they hired sales staff, that's a large cost and investment that they'd need to ensure they cover with generated sales.

Is there anything in their recent investor reports to give an idea of their anticipated revenue?
This needs to be corrected as it is not 1 million retail customers but 1 million retail devices connecting to the service, which includes minis. Most retail owners have multiple retail devices so the actual number of retail owners is around 200,000 or less. I think the actual number of retail devices is around 960,000.
On the MSO side they count households so the actual number of devices is a lot higher. The last count I heard for MSO is like 6 million households and that number is from a few years ago. The number of MSO customers is growing and the number of retail customers is dropping so there really is no money in retail.

Since Rovi was Gemstar TVGuide they used to have ads on their TVGOS guides that were embedded in retail guides. There was a add pane on the left side of the guide. The cost of TVGOS (TVGuide on Screen) was included in the cost of the retail devices, and they then decided to add the ads in later to increase revenue to cover the cost of operating the consumer guide side of the business. The MSO side had the IGuide and PassPort Echo UI and they had the small ads in those guides.
Now Rovi bought TiVo so they are now doing the same with the retail side of the business. Hopefully they do not do what they did to us TVGOS users and give a 6 months notice that the service was ending and pull the plug. There was users that were threatening law suits back then but nobody ever done anything about it as the cost was to high to hire lawyers and litigate the case. There was a few that took their Sony DHG dvrs and through them in the lobby of their headquarters so Rovi would have to recycle them. Some users like me wrote corporate letters pleading our case to keep it going but that was no help either. It just ended up as a cost cutting measure to please the shareholders at the end of the day.
 
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According to TiVoTed these are things needed to keep out of pocket cost down going forward as the consumer side has not changed much in the past 20 years:
TiVo inserting short advert before playing a recording
If to many of us retail owners either opt out of these ads or roll back to TE3 then there will be consequences for all retail owners going forward.
 

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Going with your made up numbers we have 10% of ~300,000 customer is 30,000 retail customers forgoing a new purchase they may never have made anyway. That is small compared to the 7+ million OEM cable company subscribers who pay monthly and will watch the pre-rolls happy that auto-Skip removed the other 16 minutes of ads.

Honestly the only reason TiVO didn't start serving up ads sooner is because of the Patent $$$ coming in. That's gone and something needs to replace that recurring revenue stream. Feel free to suggest one.
The MSO boxes don't have skip mode as it will violate the retransmission agreements they have with the content owners. The MSO remotes have their Ondemand button where the skip button is.
https://www.secv.com/cdocs/TiVo_Leave_Behind_4.6_DVR-Mini.pdf
 

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Supposedly that wanted the tech for the failed Google Fiber TV. And then there is this too.
SageTV to go open source (four years after Google acquired the media center/DVR software) - Liliputing
In the battle with Amazon who knows what Google will acquire. But if they bought both Tivo and Pace...Amazon might sweat a little. And you would have Tivo's with enough memory and power for live streaming apps.
Arris bought Pace in 2016.
ARRIS Completes Pace Acquisition
 
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Arris also bought Digeo years ago, who made Moxi DVRs, quite a good product, and then ran them into the ground. Moxi had an HD interface before TiVo did.
Yes I actually had the 3 tuner Moxi with two mates but sold them as soon as Arris bought them. Arris sold the Moxi UI to Espial a few years ago. My cable company was using the Arris Whole Home solution (Moxi UI) but just switched to TiVo.
TiVo was actually my last choice as I originally was using TVGOS embedded devices like the Sony DHG, Windows Media Center with extenders, and Moxi. If it wasn't for the lawsuit settlement with Dish I think TiVo would have been long gone as they were really behind when it came to the HD UI, the use of client or extender boxes. I never liked TiVo Central as it seems there is always to many button pushes to get to things. With TVGOS there was a action bar at the top of the guide and you can access everything from there. There was also a master list of channels that downloaded to the guide and you can enter the channel editor to turn on the channels if your cable system added new channels.
Another thing I did not like about TiVo Central, especially with TE3, it is not an overlay menu and requires a HDMI handshake as it broadcasts in 720p. TiVo finally changed this with TE4.

Like I said I ended up with TiVo in the end as it is the only device left to consumers that uses CableCards. I had to buy my two CableCards years ago, paid $125 for each one. As long as I keep them active SECV will keep them going. I started using them in 2004. If I decide to stop using them then they are done so If I try to go back to cable I would then have to rent new ones.
One thing I learned over the years is these consumer owned guides and devices never really took off with the masses as the buy in cost was always to high or as in the case with WMC was to complicated for the average person to use even though WMC came with all XP, Vista, Win7 devices. TiVo is having the same problem as the buy in cost is way to high and I do feel that there is an unfortunate end coming just like what happened to TVGOS, WMC, and Moxi.
 

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This the my absolute #1 sore spot. Their guide data is flat out putrid, for lack of a better word. From generic episode descriptions to "to be announced" to completely WRONG guide data, it PO to no end. And it continues to get WORSE. IMO, it is just pure laziness on the company's part for allowing this to happen. But if you look at their history, even before buying TiVo, they don't seem to care because somehow they have managed to still make money in spite of their laziness.

I've gotten rid of the guide and pre-roll ads via PiHole but I can't do anything to improve the guide data. So I have been seriously considering the Spectrum World box. I know it is inferior to TiVo but they have better guide data and better integration with their original programming and on-demand.

I am at the point now that I really don't want to be giving TiVo any more money to promote their laziness/arrogance(I am a monthly sub).

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Spectrum gets its guide data from TiVo/Rovi/Gemstar TVGuide.
Our Customers | TiVo
 

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When Rovi was Gemstar/TVGuide they tried supporting TVGOS with ads and it did not work. So they pulled the plug on the consumer side and kept the cable side going.
I can see the same thing happening here since their efforts to prop up the consumer side “does not move the needle”.
 

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It just brings in consistent subscription fees month after month and year after year. ;)
It is not the subscription fees that they are talking about. There is about 200,000 households in the US that have retail TiVos in them. That number is not growing. Also most of these retail owners are old loyal owners that don't like any changes and cause TiVo to be stuck in the mud. Those that refuse to move to TE4 because some minor feature is missing is a good example.
Besides the majority of the US population is not going to pay hundreds of dollars for a DVR. Maybe if it was $50 at Walmart and didn't need a cablecard they would have a lot more customers.
I think the end of line is coming for retail TiVos. At some point they will announce they are shutting down the consumer side and just keep the cable side going as that is what Gemstar/Rovi did in the past with TVGOS.
 

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My base Roamios are now getting the gray arrow and black screen before the recordings start. Noticed the gray arrow before the start of my NCIS recording. Recording of Love it or List it just had a black screen. Didn't see any ads.
 
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All I am getting is the grey arrow with no ad so you can't skip it. Also I get the grey arrow with recordings from the premium channels like HBO.
 
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So far all I get is the grey arrow and I can see the outline of the live TV box in the upper right corner. After about 3 to 5 seconds the recording starts to play. I never see any ads nor does my box freeze up and reboots.
 
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You will. That's the pattern...grey arrow with empty box...then eventually the ads come and eventually your box restarts. What fun!!
I am wondering why some owners boxes restart and some don't. I was thinking the cause was how robust the owners ISP is. I assume if the box can't get the ad in a set time it causes the box to reboot. So far I have not had my two base Roamios reboot. If they start doing that then I will have to call in and have the feature removed. Otherwise I am not going to waste my time with TiVo's CSRs as I rather have bamboo shutes driven under my finger nails.
 

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Even via text?
Yea I guess chat wouldn't be to bad if it comes to that. I will see if I have any issues with the ads if and when they do appear.
My Roamio plus is connected by Ethernet on an Xfinity 300mps gateway. It should be able to handle the pre roll hiccup.
I think it will be more affected by the lag time and not the speed. If the packet delay is to long then it probably times out and then reboots.
 

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I choose to keep the overall superior interface of TE4, with CEC remote control and hands-free auto comskip, and will contact TiVo as often as necessary to remove the pre-roll ads and probably install Pi-Hole to make it (and the TiVo+ ads in the guide) a non-issue, too.

This is the way I'd rather enjoy TiVo in it's final months of existence. Rather than miss out on features that I use and appreciate, out of some sort of misplaced "principle" that accomplishes nothing.
I have to agree consumer TiVos are approaching the end so enjoy it while is lasts. I have been contemplating not watching live or recorded TV anymore and just have internet and phone and then watch movies on BD and use some streaming services like Vudu and Amazon Prime which I already have. Although I may mess around with and antenna since I have some time on my hands right now.
 

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If you get it working, can you run a cable down the hill? :) But seriously, I'm testing all my "Favorites" for streaming ability. So far, MSNBC looks the best for real time viewing.
That is how Service Electric got its start.:) Outside of the TV Everywhere that comes with our cable subscription what streaming services are you using to get channels like MSNBC as I will be willing to give it a try. I do have a Roku Ultra. Also I see there is a number of channels free this month and HDNET Movies is one of them. So is Showtime, which I have a subscription to so I wonder if they are going to give me a discount.
 

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TiVo is no longer the TiVo as you know it. That company was bought by another company and now it looks like there maybe another sale in the works so it may change hands again. The current company is moving away from hardware and is just doing the software side of the business. The model that is being used is some hardware manufacturer can license to use the UI and then sell their hardware to the public but there isn't any one getting into the DVR business.
I can not give an end date but considering what is going on with the current retail side of the business I can safely say we are much closer to the end than the beginning. Just this week it looks like the company, Espial, that ended up with the Moxi finally crippled the remaining consumer Moxis. They can not even view live TV with them.
Moxi HD DVR - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
This is our likely future.
 

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I actually got an ad last night with the recording of the Conners. It was pretty quick and it appeared to be for TiVo+ channels. Didn't have a chance to skip it as it went by to fast.
 

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The ads I see are only for the TiVo plus feature. Most of those channels is Xumo which ironically is being bought by Comcast. So I guess this is going to be another bust for TiVo.
 
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The only ad I seen since the update is one for a series season finale on Fox network. Other than that it is just the grey arrow and then the recording starts.
 
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