TiVo Community Forum banner
361 - 380 of 431 Posts

· I am Groot!
Joined
·
58,993 Posts
If having the CGI character on screen was such a problem, it seems like it would have been much easier to just cut all the scenes where she's being Lawyer Hulk. Showing her in the office and in the courtroom as She-Hulk was totally pointless. They should have saved the SH character for when she was going to do something with her powers, not for when she was just doing regular, everyday work.
If they were able to plan ahead, sure, that would be the way to go. But it sounds like a lot of the budget cutting was done on the fly...
 

· Give 'em Hell, Devils
Joined
·
59,054 Posts
If they were able to plan ahead, sure, that would be the way to go. But it sounds like a lot of the budget cutting was done on the fly...
Except the quote from the head writer says, "Once we got into pre-production and production itself, once somebody had to sit down and start figuring out the cost of everything, it was like every week, I was told, 'Can you cut more She-Hulk scenes? Can you change more She-Hulk scenes to Jen? Can she be Jen in more scenes?'" Gao explains.

So it seems like it became known as an issue in pre-production and that should have clued them in that maybe random office scenes with She-Hulk sitting at a desk weren't worth spending the CGI budget on.

Plus, having worked at law firms, I always thought it was a super odd choice for the managing partner who hired her to expect her to be in She-Hulk form all the time in the office. Law firms are generally fairly conservative and wanting a big superhero sideshow walking around the office just seems really strange. I could see if a particular client wanted to meet with She-Hulk then she could change for that meeting, but most lawyers spend the majority of their time in the office just sitting at their desk writing, talking on the phone, etc. The percentage of time actually meeting with clients face-to-face (or even over video conference) is generally very small.
 

· I am Groot!
Joined
·
58,993 Posts
Except the quote from the head writer says, "Once we got into pre-production and production itself, once somebody had to sit down and start figuring out the cost of everything, it was like every week, I was told, 'Can you cut more She-Hulk scenes? Can you change more She-Hulk scenes to Jen? Can she be Jen in more scenes?'" Gao explains.
Which suggests that the budget-cutting was going on even when they were in production.

Which is a pretty crappy way to run a show...just establish a budget and stick to it. Don't come in during filming and say "Nope, gotta cut some more." Doesn't really seem like the Marvel way of doing things...I hope that's not a bad sign of the direction they're headed.
 

· Give 'em Hell, Devils
Joined
·
59,054 Posts
Which suggests that the budget-cutting was going on even when they were in production.

Which is a pretty crappy way to run a show...just establish a budget and stick to it. Don't come in during filming and say "Nope, gotta cut some more." Doesn't really seem like the Marvel way of doing things...I hope that's not a bad sign of the direction they're headed.
Yeah, I agree it was poorly handled - especially if, as the writer says in that article, her original direction from Feige was they had carte blanche to put in as much She-Hulk as they wanted to.

But my point is that if it became clear, as early as pre-production, that they were going to need to reduce the number of CGI shots, it seems the obvious place to trim would have been the office scenes rather than any outside the office scenes.

Unless Jen working in the office as She-Hulk is something from the comics so they kind of had to keep that in.
 

· I am Groot!
Joined
·
58,993 Posts
Unless Jen working in the office as She-Hulk is something from the comics so they kind of had to keep that in.
Well, it was in the TV story...the only reason they wanted her in the firm was because she was a super-hero. Stands to reason they'd want her to be, well, in her super-hero form.
 

· Give 'em Hell, Devils
Joined
·
59,054 Posts
Well, it was in the TV story...the only reason they wanted her in the firm was because she was a super-hero. Stands to reason they'd want her to be, well, in her super-hero form.
Right, but that's what I said above. If she needs to change into superhero form to meet with clients, that makes perfect sense. But to just be in the office, sitting at her desk, talking on the phone, etc., in that form 100% of the time is really dumb. And apparently really expensive. So extra dumb.
 

· wait.. I did what?
Joined
·
15,512 Posts
The opinions of people who didn't like it are just as worthy as those who did like it. I haven't seen thread craps, just opinions of people who didn't think it was all that good. Not everything deserves a medal.
There are ways to do that without just coming in and going " it stinks" which happens far too often in franchise show threads, it's become SOP that folks come in and just vent on how bad it was week after week. A large number of of the complaints in this thread are about how it "doesn't meet expectations" and for a short stand-alone series it's not the best criticism.

IMNSHO this show crapping in this sub-forum has really diminished my desire to come into these threads as of late.
 

· Cat God
Joined
·
17,529 Posts
Right, but that's what I said above. If she needs to change into superhero form to meet with clients, that makes perfect sense. But to just be in the office, sitting at her desk, talking on the phone, etc., in that form 100% of the time is really dumb. And apparently really expensive. So extra dumb.
I’m pretty sure having She-hulk sit behind a desk or in a courtroom (or even walking) wasn’t as expensive to make as having her in a fight scene with other CGI baddies. Especially in scenes where you couldn’t see her whole body, like sitting behind a desk.
 

· Give 'em Hell, Devils
Joined
·
59,054 Posts
I’m pretty sure having She-hulk sit behind a desk or in a courtroom (or even walking) wasn’t as expensive to make as having her in a fight scene with other CGI baddies. Especially in scenes where you couldn’t see her whole body, like sitting behind a desk.
Well sure, those CGI shots would be less expensive than full-body, full-motion fight scenes. But they're still more expensive than just filming Tatiana sitting at the desk. If cost was an issue, and apparently it was, why waste the CGI budget on sitting behind a desk, even if it is cheaper than other possible CGI shots?
 

· Excellent.
Joined
·
23,877 Posts
There are ways to do that without just coming in and going " it stinks" which happens far too often in franchise show threads, it's become SOP that folks come in and just vent on how bad it was week after week. A large number of of the complaints in this thread are about how it "doesn't meet expectations" and for a short stand-alone series it's not the best criticism.

IMNSHO this show crapping in this sub-forum has really diminished my desire to come into these threads as of late.
I think you are spot-on most of the time but off the mark here. As someone who has criticized the show in the this thread -- I've also been complimentary of it -- I have tried to explain why it wasn't working for me, not just dump on it. So have many others. It's all good fodder for discussion, which is the entire point. In fact, in your only comment post in the thread (I think), you've just offered (really implied) the "I liked it" version of the very thing you are objecting to. I'd be interested to hear why -- not as a challenge, but as a contribution to the discussion and to give us more to think about and hash out.
 

· Excellent.
Joined
·
23,877 Posts
Now that it's over and everyone is clamouring for something different, looking back at the series (I was in to initially). I would've liked it more if it was actually a lawyer show set up in the MCU and had more episodes in the court with super cases. The shape shifter, immortal and leap frog courtroom scenes were all interesting and would have liked more of that...also someone here mentioned her own issue with that parking garage and property damage, take that case to court.
Creator Jessica Gas said in an earlier interview that they sat down to write what sounded like exactly the show you are asking for, and then realized they didn't know how to write a courtroom show. So they pivoted.
 

· Excellent.
Joined
·
23,877 Posts
Basically the plot, as it was, was a mess. It just was. They admit as much in episode 9, but then pretend that it was on purpose because the “writers” wanted to do a cookie cutter Marvel show.

Hand waving away poor writing as intentional doesn’t negate the fact that the writing was still bad.
I have no problem with trying something different, but the show didn’t seem to know what it wanted to be.
I was going to take probably a couple of paragraphs to write what you summed up in five sentences. I agree. Example: it doesn't really work for a show to literally tell you it is being subversive in not ending with a superhero battle when the entire previous episode was a superhero battle. Or to tell us that having all these heroes coincidentally in one place at the same time is dumb, and then have Bruce show up in the revised ending anyway, and Daredevil literally drop from the sky. I get that the latter is a payoff to Jen asking KEVIN to have him come back, but then is the show trying to be on both sides of the joke? Meta inside of meta? That's Deadpool territory.

None of those things need be problems but they require a consistency of tone and some groundwork to actually pay off rather than seeming random. I think the show didn't really know how to do that, which has been my main issue with the bulk of the first season.

All that said, and I've said this before, notwithstanding my general befuddlement with the show, there was stuff to like and that it did well. It handled Jen and Matt so well in the previous episode that it felt natural and fun for them to be sitting at brunch with Jen's family at the end of the finale. I could have watched a whole episode of that, and it made me actually interested in Marvel continuing that relationship as a running plot in their franchises.
 

· Excellent.
Joined
·
23,877 Posts
I watch all streaming shows with subtitles, and the subtitles spoiled it a little for me. When they were in the writers room and talking about seeing "Kevin," the subtitles wrote it as "K.E.V.I.N." which gave away that it was going to be some sort of AI/Robot/something other than Kevin Feige.
Not the same but related: Benedict Wong was in the credits, and since he had not appeared in the episode, I knew he was going to be in a credit tag. And knowing that, it was pretty easy to predict he would be busting Blonsky out of prison.
 

· Registered
Ruler of an Unown UI
Joined
·
3,857 Posts
Honestly, I enjoyed it. For me this is just a fun show that breaks the fourth wall, and I'm willing to let them go where they want or need to go with that for whatever reasons. It was a fun ride, I like all the actors, and I laughed or at least chuckled a couple times through every episode.

I agree the subtitles ruined the Kevin surprise. And am I the only one wondering when and why Matt Murdock passed the California bar? But again, it's a silly show so whatever. I'll save my complaints for something truly worthy... like La Brea, lol.
 
  • Like
Reactions: cheesesteak

· wait.. I did what?
Joined
·
15,512 Posts
I think you are spot-on most of the time but off the mark here. As someone who has criticized the show in the this thread -- I've also been complimentary of it -- I have tried to explain why it wasn't working for me, not just dump on it. So have many others. It's all good fodder for discussion, which is the entire point. In fact, in your only comment post in the thread (I think), you've just offered (really implied) the "I liked it" version of the very thing you are objecting to. I'd be interested to hear why -- not as a challenge, but as a contribution to the discussion and to give us more to think about and hash out.
Much appreciated...
I've noticed this behavior more and more recently, it results in a piling on of negativity, the last round of "the finale bites" pushed me over the edge.
In the non-franchise threads it seems that posters are more balanced with their negativity, but the franchise threads have a different attitude IME.
 

· Registered
Ruler of an Unown UI
Joined
·
3,857 Posts
Well, in the comics universe he spent some time living in San Francisco... ;)
Interesting, thank you! I had only googled California and LA. Apparently stories about DD in SF came out in 1972 and 2014. Those stories don't sync with what we've seen on Netflix, which may or may not be MCU cannon, but OK that's one way to explain it.

He was appearing pro hac vice, due to the relative rarity of available lawyers specializing in superhero related matters.
Thanks! This would more easily fit into the Netflix backstory, and mentioning those three words sure would have delighted all the courtroom drama nerds out there. But as mentioned above, Gao said they don't know how to write a courtroom show, and this may be a good example. I doubt they consciously avoided either explanation.
 
361 - 380 of 431 Posts
Top