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Today in LA our Fox 11 turned on the ATSC 3.0. My TivoHD and Roamio can only watch the KTTV-HD, but that channel has no guide data.
Question - Do you think the missing guide data will fix itself? I've already forced connection to Tivo, but no luck.
 

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Today in LA our Fox 11 turned on the ATSC 3.0. My TivoHD and Roamio can only watch the KTTV-HD, but that channel has no guide data.
Question - Do you think the missing guide data will fix itself? I've already forced connection to Tivo, but no luck.
They probably won't fix it until somebody files a report at TiVo. You might as well start the ball rolling yourself.

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Something similar happened here in Houston with KIAHDT (CW39) on Dec 2. They started broadcasting in ATSC 3.0 on their old frequency and switched the ATSC 1.0 feed from RF channel 34 to 35. I filed a report on Dec 3 and it was resolved yesterday.
 

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I noticed the change on fox 11 after it did not record thursday night football. My OTA roamio says that there is no longer a signal on 11-1, however, it appears there is an 11-2 which looks to be the hd signal. Am I correct in thinking that the old 11-1 is now the new atsc 3.0, and if I had a 4k tivo I would be able to see that?

My tivo hasn't quite gotten rid of all the 11-1 recordings it was going to record. I did a rescan as well. I'm hoping it will correct itself soon.
 

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I noticed the change on fox 11 after it did not record thursday night football. My OTA roamio says that there is no longer a signal on 11-1, however, it appears there is an 11-2 which looks to be the hd signal. Am I correct in thinking that the old 11-1 is now the new atsc 3.0, and if I had a 4k tivo I would be able to see that?

My tivo hasn't quite gotten rid of all the 11-1 recordings it was going to record. I did a rescan as well. I'm hoping it will correct itself soon.
TiVo does not have any DVRs (that I am aware of anyway) that will do ATSC 3.0. The Bolt and the Edge will do 4K, but only if the cable company provides a 4K QAM signal.
 

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I noticed the change on fox 11 after it did not record thursday night football. My OTA roamio says that there is no longer a signal on 11-1, however, it appears there is an 11-2 which looks to be the hd signal. Am I correct in thinking that the old 11-1 is now the new atsc 3.0, and if I had a 4k tivo I would be able to see that?

My tivo hasn't quite gotten rid of all the 11-1 recordings it was going to record. I did a rescan as well. I'm hoping it will correct itself soon.
I saw that 11-2 did not look like SD which it was in the past. I'm just going to change my pending recordings to 11-2 from 11.1 till they fix this.
 

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TiVo does not have any DVRs (that I am aware of anyway) that will do ATSC 3.0. The Bolt and the Edge will do 4K, but only if the cable company provides a 4K QAM signal.
It's going to take something similar to a tuning adapter when the time comes and it will only work with the Bolt and the Edge. There may be a new all in one unit coming from Tivo or Tablo down the line when the actual demand for recording Nextgen TV is large enough. :) Of course we could all be dead at that point..:eek::D
 

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After the rescan finished on December 9th there were two FOX 11-1 channels in the channel list. The first one listed appeared to be the new ATSC 3.0, the second was the HD channel which my TV was able to decode, however there was no guide data. This afternoon, December 11th, about 3:30 PST I forced my Roamio OTA to connect to the TiVo service (found in the Network Settings menu) and it updated the missing guide data for FOX 11-1. I believe it would have updated on its own during TiVO's next scheduled connect time. Fox LA reception and guide data seem to be back to normal.
 

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But it's important to note that, if the broadcast networks and their affiliates wanted to do this, there's really no need for them to embrace ATSC 3.0 and offer an enhanced OTA signal. Local stations can, and sometimes do, encode a different feed for delivery to cable operators vs. what they send to their OTA tower. A good example was this past summer when certain NBC stations offered a 4K live feed of the Olympics to Comcast, YouTube TV and others. Meanwhile, it was the same ol' 1080i signal that got beamed out OTA via ATSC 1.0.
Here's my cynical prediction. The broadcast stations are going to get to the first stage of ATSC 3.0, with shared transmitters that do a whole bunch of channels at 1080p, probably fairly heavily compressed, while keeping most of the ATSC 1.0 stations on the air. Then, cable will continue to compress the snot out of their "HD" channels that are barely HD, whether via repackaging ATSC 1.0, or re-encoding to MPEG-4, and then offer 4k versions of the networks as an upsell like they did for the Olympics, so that you have to have pay TV of one sort or another to get 4k. At least the ATSC 3.0 signals will likely be at least a bit better than ATSC 1.0.

I previously posted somewhere that OTA 3.0 and my cable look visually similar and the OTA 3.0 advantage is sound quality. Well, last night The Voice and People's Choice Awards OTA 3.0 looked noticeably clearer and better than cable.
It's going to depend on the market and the pay TV provider. ATSC 1.0 or QAM can be absolutely stunning given enough bandwidth, but they rarely are...
 

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So it's totally free to me, except for the one-time cost of a $10 client app some guy developed for Apple TV. I love having all my TV on one device via one remote!
Interesting. I still like my TiVo, but we'll see what happens with ATSC 3.0. It will be nice for Beijing though, as it was for Tokyo.

And the number of scripted series among the top 25-rated telecasts has declined a lot too. There were 14 back in 2015 but just 6 this fall, and they're all toward the bottom of the bunch.
What's even more interesting is I saw some statistics that something like the top broadcast show today wouldn't have made 10th place if it had the same viewership numbers a decade ago.

Broadcast viewing, at least in the under-50 demo, is now dominated by sports, specials, reality/competition and 60 Minutes.
60 Minutes really got on a roll when COVID started, and they've continued to do some really interesting stories. SNL though, sort of went downhill, since their main material got voted out of the White House.

Yeah, that could happen. But I wonder how long stations owner are going to give ATSC 3.0 to prove itself and become a profit center, rather than cost center, for them. As things stand now, I doubt that simulcasting the major network feeds on 3.0 brings in any additional incremental viewers they wouldn't have had if they only aired on 1.0.
Does it provide coverage benefits in hilly or heavily wooded areas? ATSC 1.0 wasn't a very good standard from a technical perspective. Also, if they all have one transmitter, they can say that they have NextGenTV without really doing much to support it.

In some cases, 3.0 viewers report that the picture quality is better but in most cases so far, it's the same or even worse. And many also complain about problems decoding the new Dolby AC-4 audio codec used on 3.0.
I'd suspect that it will end up being better once they work the kinks out, as it doesn't take much bandwidth to offer a better quality HEVC feed compared to the super efficient but also super compressed MPEG-2 feeds.

The whole thing increasingly has the feel to me of 3D TV or maybe HD Radio.
HD Radio is out there and working, and many cars have it, but you're right in that it doesn't generate a lot of buzz. Also, I didn't realize that they have HD Radio on AM until I got it on a ball game, but the range is terrible. I was driving back towards Hartford, and I had AM in MA, finally when I was within sight of Hartford, I picked up the HD Radio feed of the game. That was sort of interesting.

...then I could easily see broadcasters withdrawing from the experiment and converting those 3.0 towers back to 1.0. At least they could then support more multicast diginets (with some of them in 720p instead of 480i) to bring in some additional viewers and ad revenue.
Interesting idea. Just grind out some ad money on the diginets. They could get more diginets on 3.0, but with potentially a much smaller audience, so that may not work out. I think ATSC 3.0 is going to stick a little bit more than that, but I don't think it's going to really change the whole market or be that big of a deal to most people. I would have rather just had better quality ATSC 1.0, but no one really cares about VQ anymore on any broadcast or cable.

The much lower latency of 5G is what's supposed to be the key to using it in self-driving cars.
Color me skeptical. I just don't see where it would make any sense.

Striking deals with Ford, GM, etc. to build 3.0 receivers into their cars and offer them a lower-cost way (vs. 5G/4G) to distribute car software updates, maps and traffic data, and subscription entertainment services (music stations, on-demand video, etc.) is, I'm told, what they're really hoping for.
It seems way too niche. By the time they get such a contraption up and going, if it even works, the cost per MB of 5G will have gone down even more, and they can just use that, with Wi-Fi for software updates.
 
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60 Minutes really got on a roll when COVID started, and they've continued to do some really interesting stories. SNL though, sort of went downhill, since their main material got voted out of the White House.
Thank you. I can assure you it was a herculean effort, considering that within a 4 day period in March we did our last show in studio with a smaller than normal crew (people kept out due to possible Covid exposure), and the next Wednesday afternoon we received an email stating that we would NOT be allowed back in our production facility at all. We "crashed" (TV slang for last minute work) most of our pieces that spring with all of the story editing, graphics compositing, and show production being done from kitchen tables, kid's and guest bedrooms, basement rec rooms, and the like. Studio leads did come on green screen from an outside facility but were also composited by our graphic artist at home. We never missed a broadcast, never once compromising on content. To professionals, those first few months of shows must have looked horrendous, there were a ton of technical compromises. Most specifically editors color correcting and mixing their own pieces.

We continued with this till this past September. We now go into the studio solely to record the studio leads. All of the rest of our editing work is still being done at home.
 

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I should add, my effort was strictly the with the effort of putting the final broadcast together, including figuring out the studio portions, editing the tease, ender piece and credits, as well as working with the senior story editor and the dozen or so story editors. And then the real effort that I had very little to do with, all the correspondents, producers and their camera crews figuring out how to shoot interviews and other material under the most trying conditions of not being able to travel, social distancing, doing remote interviews by zoom with camera crews in both locations so you the viewer wouldn't realize it was a zoom interview.
 

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Thank you. I can assure you it was a herculean effort, considering that within a 4 day period in March we did our last show in studio with a smaller than normal crew (people kept out due to possible Covid exposure), and the next Wednesday afternoon we received an email stating that we would NOT be allowed back in our production facility at all. We "crashed" (TV slang for last minute work) most of our pieces that spring with all of the story editing, graphics compositing, and show production being done from kitchen tables, kid's and guest bedrooms, basement rec rooms, and the like. Studio leads did come on green screen from an outside facility but were also composited by our graphic artist at home. We never missed a broadcast, never once compromising on content. To professionals, those first few months of shows must have looked horrendous, there were a ton of technical compromises. Most specifically editors color correcting and mixing their own pieces.
Wow, that's fascinating. I guess I just figured it was being done in studio, as it is essential work, much like industrial production continued throughout the pandemic in many areas. I didn't notice any technical compromises, but I don't really watch 60 Minutes for the production value, but for the journalism and access to unique and interesting stories. That being said, it still must be a ton of work to sift through the footage and tie it all together into a ~15 minute story.

60 Minutes was one of the few shows still producing, and much needed in that time when everyone was otherwise isolated and wanting to know about the pandemic. I thought the overall quality of 60 Minutes went up during COVID, due to some of the timely reporting being done, as well as the Zoom-not-Zoom interviews when others weren't out doing interviews like that at all.
 

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Wow, that's fascinating. I guess I just figured it was being done in studio, as it is essential work, much like industrial production continued throughout the pandemic in many areas. I didn't notice any technical compromises, but I don't really watch 60 Minutes for the production value, but for the journalism and access to unique and interesting stories. That being said, it still must be a ton of work to sift through the footage and tie it all together into a ~15 minute story.

60 Minutes was one of the few shows still producing, and much needed in that time when everyone was otherwise isolated and wanting to know about the pandemic. I thought the overall quality of 60 Minutes went up during COVID, due to some of the timely reporting being done, as well as the Zoom-not-Zoom interviews when others weren't out doing interviews like that at all.
Plus, they have Anderson Cooper. :)
 

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I previously posted somewhere that OTA 3.0 and my cable look visually similar and the OTA 3.0 advantage is sound quality. Well, last night The Voice and People's Choice Awards OTA 3.0 looked noticeably clearer and better than cable.
Here in the DC area the ATSC 3.0 and 1.0 channels look equally as bad. The ATSC 1.0 channels are bitstarved with a bunch of sub-channels. And the five ATSC 3.0 channels are all sharing the same broadcast frequency.

I am using an HDHomeRun Flex 4K to access the ATSC 3.0 channels.
 

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Some may not care... but ATSC 3.0 is just a way for local TV stations to pull data from your TV. They say doing that will help them provide a better user experience. And folks think TiVo is bad to offering ads before DVR events. But hail ATSC 3.0 as the second coming... I may give it a try as long as Pi-Hole blocks the data pulls. It currently blocks Samsung from pulling data from my TV.

TV stations for now will use the extra space to just add more channels. Don't expect a better picture or sound anytime soon.
 

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but ATSC 3.0 is just a way for local TV stations to pull data from your TV ...TV stations for now will use the extra space to just add more channels. Don't expect a better picture or sound anytime soon.
Yep:
The U.S. broadcast TV could generate as much as $15 billion a year by 2030 from the provision of datacasting services enabled by ATSC 3.0, according to a deck revealed to investors Wednesday by Nexstar Media.
 

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How will ATSC 3.0 "pull" data from your TV? I can't imagine television manufacturers would spend a single fraction of a cent to put in a transmitter in addition to a receiver on the tuner board.
 

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How will ATSC 3.0 "pull" data from your TV? I can't imagine television manufacturers would spend a single fraction of a cent to put in a transmitter in addition to a receiver on the tuner board.
They'll pull it via the Ethernet jacks and/or Wi-Fi in your TV set. For separate tuner boxes they'll probably offer solutions and incentives like a better EPG to get you to hook up to your internet. My HD HomeRun tuners all require a LAN and internet connection whether 3.0 or not. And yes it's creepy but there will be hacks to get around it in many cases.
 
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