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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Now i know this is going aways back but I can't help but think that tivo as great as it is and as much as i appreciate the hd aspect has made very few improvements over the direct tv ultimate tv setup i had previously. I am not complaining i absolutely 100% love my tivo hd which works great. I follow this stuff closely now but didnt before as much when i purchased the ulimate tv microsoft setup. Below is a list of features that havent always been on the tivo or features i just plain miss.

1. Dual Tuner (have this in my tivo hd obviously)
2. Picture in Picture (this is a big one) also you could switch between the two very easily
3. Keyword search (this is a feature somewhat recently added to tivo but i always had it with ultimate tv, ulimtate tv obviously lacked amazon unbox)
4. A specific channel 1080 that just played your recorded content. This allowed you to switch from live to recorded content and not lose your place as is not really possible right now on the tivo.
5. My program guide showed which programs were going to be recorded and by pressing record twice i could set up a season pass which could be edited later ( i just switched to tivo recently so i cant remember if you can look at the guide data and see what is to record)
6. Much like tivo functions were constantly being added.

I expects parts of this post to get ripped to shreds since i did a fairly sweeping comparison between two very different technologies but i think that given the 5-6 year gaps between these programs tivo should have some of these feature.

My real question is that given all these things does anybody miss the ultimate tv even though it was made by microsoft. I hear people talk wistfully about the replay tv but never about ulimate tv. Any thoughts?
 

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I never had a UTV, but I'd like to reply to a few of your points.

2) With the ability to switch between two live buffers or to watch a previous recording while watching one live, I don't find this that useful.
3) I've always had keyword search capability on my TiVos.
4) I can stop watching one recording in order to go to live TV or another recording and then return to the previous one and pickup at where it was stopped.
 

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normychas said:
My real question is that given all these things does anybody miss the ultimate tv even though it was made by microsoft. I hear people talk wistfully about the replay tv but never about ulimate tv. Any thoughts?
We certainly looked at Ultimate TV back then but lacked the innovative Tivo only features (which btw are still lacking in non-Tivo DVRs')
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
JimSpence said:
I never had a UTV, but I'd like to reply to a few of your points.

2) With the ability to switch between two live buffers or to watch a previous recording while watching one live, I don't find this that useful.
3) I've always had keyword search capability on my TiVos.
4) I can stop watching one recording in order to go to live TV or another recording and then return to the previous one and pickup at where it was stopped.
I cant comment on #2 which is just personal preference #3 and #4 is interesting. I thought i might have been wrong on that point i think i just got confused when they recently started pushing the swivel search. My response was wow my ultimate tv even had that and i couldnt get that to happen last night while watching the redskins game and wanting to watch entourage episodes airing live during commercials. Had i paused it and switched back to the other tuner would it have stayed in the same place? If so that is very cool and i wish i had done that
 

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normychas said:
what features would you say other than hd which obviously didn't exist at the time
Let's see...

The thumbs up ratings system.
Tunable recommendations recorded automatically
The best guide ever
Wishlists - "keep three John Wayne movies in stock at all times that I have not seen recently.)

The way the fast forward and rewind reset to stop over shooting.

All the tricks that can be enable.

And of course the hacking experience which in the old days Tivo actually helped and supported.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
GrondramB said:
Let's see...

The thumbs up ratings system.
Tunable recommendations recorded automatically
The best guide ever
Wishlists - "keep three John Wayne movies in stock at all times that I have not seen recently.)

The way the fast forward and rewind reset to stop over shooting.

All the tricks that can be enable.

And of course the hacking experience which in the old days Tivo actually helped and supported.
I dont use the thumbs up thumbs down system but i admit it is original and very cool. I dont see a huge difference in the guide data and my old ultimate tivo had a fast forward and rewind reset to stop over shooting. In terms of tricks that can be enabled i only use the 30 second skip but would be interested to know what else you use. I was just saying i felt like the ultimate tv didnt get enough credit for being ahead of its time. These features have been incorporated over time long after ultimate tv failed so obviously i am in the minority in liking its interface. However, i was just saying i liked it very much even though i now like my tivo hd better. I guess i thought of this post mostly cus a lot of times i see feature requests for picture in picture or a seperate channel to watch recorded programs and i think to myself that its odd that these things were carried over from such an old platform. I see no reason y these things couldnt be incorporated into the tivo but obviously dont know the limitations of the tivo hardware. Just thought it was worth discussion and i cant make a fair comparison of all things dvr since i never owned a replay tv.
 

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normychas said:
...These features have been incorporated over time long after ultimate tv failed ....
I'm not sure that is fair. There isn't really anything discussed here that was in the Utilmate TV that hasn't been in TiVo for many many years, even back when Utilmate TV was around. None of these features are really considered new to TiVo.
 

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My first DVR Was the UTV(Because at the time Tivo did not have the 2 Tuners on yet and I think UTV was cheaper at the time), and i do thnk your right UTV did not get enough credit for being ahead of its time. Right now i would love to go back to UTV but I have cable so i use Tivo DT(One thing i loved about UTV is you could just pop in a bigger HD without all the "hacking" and prom mod stuff!!)

But one thing I LOVE about Tivo right now is Tivo.net.
 

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I've owned both UltimateTVs and DirecTivos and actually preferred the UTV interface over the Tivo's. Here are a few things that soured me on the UTV:

1. It was developed by Microsoft
2. The monthly fee was twice what a DTivo cost
3. It was abandoned by Microsoft within a short time after being introduced
4. There was little in the way of any hacks that could be added other than a larger hard drive and even then you were limited in your choice of drives
5. The monthly fee still goes to Microsoft (or at least a portion of it)
6. Did I mention it was a Microsoft product?

I really wish DirecTV had bought the design from Microsoft instread of developing their own DVR. The UTV is a proven product and I believe DTV would have had much better luck offering it to their customers than the POS R15.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
i meant to include a no microsoft complaining alas it is my own fault for forgetting to put it in
mr.unnatural said:
I've owned both UltimateTVs and DirecTivos and actually preferred the UTV interface over the Tivo's. Here are a few things that soured me on the UTV:

1. It was developed by Microsoft
2. The monthly fee was twice what a DTivo cost
3. It was abandoned by Microsoft within a short time after being introduced
4. There was little in the way of any hacks that could be added other than a larger hard drive and even then you were limited in your choice of drives
5. The monthly fee still goes to Microsoft (or at least a portion of it)
6. Did I mention it was a Microsoft product?

I really wish DirecTV had bought the design from Microsoft instread of developing their own DVR. The UTV is a proven product and I believe DTV would have had much better luck offering it to their customers than the POS R15.
I mentioned in my initial post that i was looking for reasons to dislike it other than it being a Microsoft product. As fun as it is to hate an enormous company i doubt very much that you dont own an xbox 360 or that you would discount the console just because it is microsoft. Yes they are big and yes they are a bit dishonest but you cant discount a technology purely because it originated out of microsoft. This was an instance where there big resources ended up not helping them and the box failed. It almost makes the opposite point big business microsoft haters make all the time in that they push small business out. also how is the fact that microsoft takes the revenue supposed to justify your hatred for something. Does tivo not collect on the 13 bucks a month i fork over. The question is always is the service worth it.
 

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normychas said:
3. Keyword search (this is a feature somewhat recently added to tivo but i always had it with ultimate tv, ulimtate tv obviously lacked amazon unbox)
Actually, TiVo has had Keyword searching since version 2.0 of the software, at least, maybe 1.3 - it has been years and I forget. 2001 or earlier.

What you refer to as a recent addition is Universal Swivel Search, which is another searching system, but the ability to search content by Keyword has been there since Wishlists were added very, very early in TiVo's life.
 

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normychas said:
2. Picture in Picture (this is a big one) also you could switch between the two very easily
I realize this is different from having it built in -- but your TV likely has picture in picture.
If you have another signal source (such as another Tivo, DVD player, VCR, or the TV's built in tuner if it's connected to an antenna/cable), you can use the TV's picture in picture to swap between the devices.

I just realized I actually haven't used my TV's PIP in a while(*). I used to use it all the time (for many many years after I had Tivo). I think that's largely since the original remote I had with the TV broke, and the replacement remote (even a Sony cheapo universal replacement) makes the PIP functions more inconvenient than the original remote.

I still like the feature though, and even with Tivo (i.e. I always have more than I want to watch already recorded), I still like it, and would want it to be a feature on future TVs I get.

(*) corrected while I wrote this when I realized I still use my XS32's PIP *VERY* often.. so I can watch something off of the XS32's hard drive while checking on the recording, or even doing similar stuff to what I did with my TV's PIP -- checking the To Do list on my Tivos (after changing the XS32 to be set to that input) and cleaning out stuff.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
mattack said:
I realize this is different from having it built in -- but your TV likely has picture in picture.
If you have another signal source (such as another Tivo, DVD player, VCR, or the TV's built in tuner if it's connected to an antenna/cable), you can use the TV's picture in picture to swap between the devices.
My tv doesnt have PIP and I think its a fairly uncommon feature these days. I don't see very many tv's with a pip and anyhow with hd and cable cards being the way they are i dont think its a very logical place to address the PIP. PIP could be handled by the tv very easily when you could just split your cable connection and connect the two cords to the tv and be on your way. With HDCP and the close to the vest manner in which cable "distributers" as they sometimes forget they are only distributers seem to see the future it makes more sense to handle PIP after the Cable Card authorization has been dealt with. This could absolutely be a software solution. As you suggest other sources (if the tv has PIP built in) could be used in this and while it would be fun to play my ps3 during commercials of redskins games what I would like more would be to be able to watch another show and know when the skins game is coming back from commercial. I also think PIP makes even more sense with bigger tv's and higher res tv. I cant imagine nobody else out there watches the cbs and the fox nfl game on sundays.
 
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