[Rob Helmerichs]

Could be fake wooden ingots that was used in a TV Show that fell through the sinkhole (and somehow got buried) that they found

Oooh, meta! Maybe they were the fake ingots made for THIS show!

(Which, honestly, would suddenly make this a much more interesting show...)

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

It's more believable that they could lift it than how they found it.

Yeah..."Oops, I thought this was where I buried the heroin. But it turns out it's where those other guys buried the Civil War gold!"

At least they didn't find Jimmy Hoffa's body...

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

One of the characters on the show agrees with me. This refers to the civil war gold

Plus another character who says people have been coming through as long as anybody can remember...

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

I'm one of those who can't for the life of me imagine why I like this show, but somehow I do. Judging from this thread, I'm not the only one.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

Speaking of incredibly stupid things that I just can't not watch, there's a new Netflix movie called Red Notice that makes La Brea look like it should win the Nobel Prize for Literature. Yet somehow it's perfectly watchable (well, three somehows: Dwayne Johnson, Ryan Reynolds, and Gal Gadot).

But MAN is it stupid!

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

Hell, 2021 might be a good reason to stay in 10,000 BC!

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

You have to suspend all logic but how is Lilly 2 people in 2021. She is Ella Jones who we know now is Lily but young Lily fell into the sinkhole in 2021 so how are they both in the same year at different ages.

Why is that a problem? It's like she was born in Miami, moved to Dallas, then moved back to Miami. How can she be in Miami at two different ages? Well, easily...she moved twice. Lily/Ella moved twice...once to the distant past, then to the not-so-distant past.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

That makes no sense, you have adult Lily and child Lily both in 2021 - moving back and forth to different states in the present is not even relevant to my comment. Lily came back up in 1988 and young Lily was born while she was here.

But again, what's the problem? She time-traveled. That's no different than space-traveling. Older her being alive at the same time as younger her doesn't present any kind of paradox whatsoever (unless older her kills younger her!).

It makes perfect sense. I think you're just confused by the very existence of time travel in the story, which is not uncommon. Even some science fiction writers get strangely confused...there is a well-regarded comic book writer who did a series the whole premise of which was that people who time-travel to the past can't die because they haven't been born yet. I assumed at first that it was the characters who were being that stupid (and was waiting for the moment when they would realize their fatal mistake), but it turned out to be true in the story...it was the writer who was confused by time travel, and didn't understand what would and would not constitute a paradox.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

I understand the paradox, but in most time travel they come and go, but in this case Ella (Lily) has now been in present day from 1988 to 2021. Now young Lily is about 12 so say born 2009, who are her parents? I am going to guess Veronica will play more of a piece to this puzzle since she has the same last name and also knows who the grandfather is and vice versa.

Again, what difference does any of that make? Older Lily coming back in the past won't change who her parents are in the present.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

But in this case younger Lily falls into the sinkhole in 2021 and goes back up in 1988. But since this sinkhole does not open until today, older Lily cannot be in 2021 yet when it opens.

Different sinkhole. They obviously don't have a 1:1 linkage in terms of when they open here and there.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

I appreciate the detailed reply - the issue is in time travel they usually go through time in some sort of weird science way or machine, but here it is a physical hole and young Lily falls into it -and so if she falls into the hole in 2021 she has not been able to come back up in 1988 because the current day hole has just opened.

IT'S A DIFFERENT HOLE!

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

But the boy (Josh?) and his sister Izzy will both die if Isaiah doesn't make it through the sinkhole and become Gavin? That doesn't seem consistent with allowing two Lily's.

Sure it is. If Isaiah doesn't go through the 1988 wormhole, then the kids will never have been born (because Isaiah won't grow up to become Gavin). And if Lily doesn't go through the wormhole, then she'll never grow up to become Ella.

So if Lily and Isaiah don't go through the wormhole, then everything changes. Which is why I assume they go through the wormhole.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

IIRC, they only care about getting Isaiah to the reverse sinkhole to "save his family", but aren't concerned about Lilly

Yeah, do they (the people in the past) even know Emma exists? Or that Lilly goes through? I thought it was just the Present People who knew about her...

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

Those are all different stages of her life. She passes from one to the next. getbak laid it out very neatly.

The first hole took young Lilly from 2021 to 10,000BC. The second hole took very slightly older Lily from 10,000BC to 1988. From there, she changed her name to Ella and lived a normal life until 2021 (and beyond, assuming she survives the show!).

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

There is a gap in logic here. Let's go back to Back to the Future. They can freely time travel at any point using the car, they do not have to wait for a specific event except the lightening storm or the train because of the car not functioning properly, but we are here in 2021, Lily and Ella are here in 2021. Lily only falls into the hole in 2021, the other holes on the map are all at different years except the Seattle one which is about to open. If Lily is still here in present day and does not fall into the hole until present day, then how was she able to come up through the 1988 hole and become Ella who has now been here for 30 years.

The Lily who is here in the present day isn't exactly the same Lily who will go through the hole in 10,000BC to 1988. Present day Lily is a few days younger than 10,000BC Lily. And present day Ella is a few decades older. They're just different stages of one person's life, who happens to have traveled through time a couple of times.

There's no reason two different ages of a person can't exist at the same time, assuming time travel is possible in the first place (which clearly this show posits).

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

I can comprehend that 2 Lilly/Emma can exist in the same year, the issue with this storyline is that the portal for young Lily does not open up until 2021. This is the only access point we know of so far where she falls in. If she cannot have fallen in until 2021 then there is no way for that Lily can go up to 1988 and become Ella. The answer may become aware to us when he see where Isiah and Silas came down, as it is clear Dr. Aldridge knows who they are.

No offense, but I think you're just one of those people who doesn't grasp time travel as a concept.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

Totally agree, but the interaction between DJ and RR was really good, even if the story was incredibly stupid.

Oh, I enjoyed it a lot.

But it was SO STUPID!

But I liked it.

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

Sometimes I'm just in the mood for something like that. Mindless fun. I wouldn't watch it again, but I enjoyed it.

Yeah, most of the time that level of stupid feels like getting punched in the face. But somehow, these people make it work. Both on this show, and especially on Red Notice.

I'm actually gonna kind of miss the show after the season finalé tonight!

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

At least we get some answers and I expect S2 will follow 1988 and 10,000 bce and leave 2021 behind as there's no one there we need to follow.

...although we may see what the 1988 crew was up to leading up to 2021 (could Josh and Riley have had anything to do with the origin of the sinkholes?).

We also need to find out who Grandpa was in the modern era, before he went to the distant past. And who Isaiah's parents were?

 

[Rob Helmerichs]

If you're upset about one TV show or movie being filmed in a place other than where it's set -- and having visible clues that give away the actual filming location -- I have some sad news for you about at least half of the TV shows and movies that have ever been made.

Not that YOU would ever notice such a thing!