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It's Official: TiVo DVRs Have Been Discontinued

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#101 ·
Ending guide data would in effect end TiVo support entirely, as the units would be crippled from anything except manual recordings.

So I’d say ending guide data is really just a euphemism for ending TiVo service entirely.

That means cost saves in software development, network/servers, chat and phone support, billing, and the data costs.

So data is really just one bit on the scale.
 
#102 ·
cwoody222 said:
Yes.

Guide data has nothing to do with networking.
Click to expand...
This is not 100% correct. As someone with a lifetime Roamio who for whatever reason has not had a 'successful' daily connection to the TiVo service on guide data for more than two years, yet continues to get (more or less) accurate guide data out at least 12-13 days (with the data taking an insane 90-120 minutes to 'load", then 'fails'), here's what happens here when the box repeatedly doesn't get a 'successful' download:

At some point here (maybe 3 or 4 times a year), some algorithm kicks in, and you get an on-screen alert that you haven't had a successful connection for more than 30 days, and pretty much every aspect of the TiVo will no longer function until you do.

It won't record at all, not even manually. You can play back recorded content, but FF and REW and 30 second skip and 9 second 'go back' don't function, there's a buffer on live content but you can't go back in it, you can't schedule anything, it won't record anything from the guide or in the ToDo list, it won't connect to any network sources, Minis stop connecting.

If you click "Connect Now" from that alert, it restores functionality after the connection is done and the guide data loads, even if it's not 'successful'. But it HAS to connect, download data, load it into the TiVo even if it fails. If you just dismiss the prompt and connect from the Network menu, it doesn't restore functionality - you must connect from the prompt. Once you do and the failed load is done, everything works again.

When it first started happening, and TiVo still had a semblance of support people, the advice was to put in a new drive and just lose all the recordings. I didn't want to do that, so it's been running in stupid mode ever since.

This has been going on here for almost three years. It might be a preview of what will happen when the servers are shut off.
 
#103 ·
Sure, over time the equation will flip.

But for now, the cost of carrying the retail customer is really minimal. Any data massaging is automated - a few Perl scripts and it's done.

Support team is basically a half-monitored mailbox at this point.

It's fairly minimal. Even if there are, say, 50,000 subs @ $12/mo, that's $750k/month.

I agree - ending guide data renders TiVo DVRs effectively dead.

There's very little if any software development still happening - even TE4 hasn't been updated in 2 years now.

So it's all but effectively dead anyway. Just nobody's told the little fella.

Image
 
#104 ·
I seem to remember at one point in the past that the original Tivo guys said if they went belly up[ they would open source the code to allow somebody else to take over.
Has that ever been brought up again?
 
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#105 ·
zalusky said:
I seem to remember at one point in the past that the original Tivo guys said if they went belly up[ they would open source the code to allow somebody else to take over.
Has that ever been brought up again?
Click to expand...
That was a looong time ago, three companies removed, and in a completely different environment.
 
#106 ·
zalusky said:
I seem to remember at one point in the past that the original Tivo guys said if they went belly up[ they would open source the code to allow somebody else to take over.
Has that ever been brought up again?
Click to expand...
The original TiVo guys (who were very clever indeed) are a few companies ago.

Unless those terms were specifically included in each successive company sale agreement, the current owners only have responsibility to the current shareholders.

Waddaya think this is, the consumer oriented EU or somethin'? 😜 😁

If they are developing versions of the TiVo OS for use in other devices like TVs, they're not about to make any portion of the code public.

Years ago, I had this fantasy that the cablecos would love the superior TiVo OS so much, would buy the company, and just have a TiVo run box with built-in 'cablecard' decoders the way they do now in their crap set top boxes. Like DirecTV integrated their satellite receivers with TiVo in the DirecTivo. I just loved that device. But alas, the "Not Designed And Built Here" cableco crowd won out, and external cable cards were the way forward.
 
#107 · (Edited)
dougdingle said:
The original TiVo guys (who were very clever indeed) are a few companies ago.
Click to expand...
And long since left the company. While their original intentions for what might happen in the event of company failure (and failure is always an option, especially for startups during that period, when most startups failed (well, most startups still fail)) may be interesting in the abstract, the IP was always part of the company assets, and any remaining company assets would have been up to the controlling interests as to their eventual disposition (and the IP revenue were one of the things that kept TiVo going for much of its life, and the various IP is still producing revenue and restricting some companies choices in capabilities and UI as they would need to pay the IP holders for such use).
 
#108 ·
At one point the company that owned TiVo also owned the guide provider. Do they still?
 
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#109 ·
I don't think so. I remember when the guide provider was changed and the guide became horsefeces. The descriptions of content, especially movies, are just pathetic.

They sound like they were written by the same people who write up the flowery description blurbs on inflight movies.

The descriptions of movies are one of the worst features of the second generation TiVo Guide. Unbearable.
 
#111 · (Edited)
SullyND said:
At one point the company that owned TiVo also owned the guide provider. Do they still?
Click to expand...
The company previously know as Rovi (which provided guide data along with other solutions) bought TiVo (the DVR company), and then renamed themselves TiVo. However, while still under the same parent, they would still be operated as separate divisions/BUs (and as anyone who has been in such large organizations, each have to make their own numbers (revenue/expenses), and will be billing each other for services just like they are billing other external entities (although they might offer "friends and family" discounts)).
 
#112 ·
SullyND said:
At one point the company that owned TiVo also owned the guide provider. Do they still?
Click to expand...
No.

At some point TiVo merged with the company that owned the guide data (Rovi), but that company was bought by another company (Xperi) and then that company split into 2 companies: Adeia Inc and Xperi Inc.

Xperi owns TiVo: TiVo - Xperi
Adeia owns the guide data: Licensing | Adeia

 
#113 ·
morac said:
No.

At some point TiVo merged with the company that owned the guide data (Rovi), but that company was bought by another company (Xperi) and then that company split into 2 companies: Adeia Inc and Xperi Inc.

Xperi owns TiVo: TiVo - Xperi
Adeia owns the guide data: Licensing | Adeia

Click to expand...
Where is that Adeia link does it say they license guide data?

Adeia primarily licenses IP technology.

The Rovi guide business still rests with Xperi, I believe.
 
#114 ·
dougdingle said:
I don't think so. I remember when the guide provider was changed and the guide became horsefeces. The descriptions of content, especially movies, are just pathetic.

They sound like they were written by the same people who write up the flowery description blurbs on inflight movies.

The descriptions of movies are one of the worst features of the second generation TiVo Guide. Unbearable.
Click to expand...
Edit: Sorry did not mean to reply. Was trying to reply to a different member.
 
#115 · (Edited)
morac said:
No.

At some point TiVo merged with the company that owned the guide data (Rovi), but that company was bought by another company (Xperi) and then that company split into 2 companies: Adeia Inc and Xperi Inc.

Xperi owns TiVo: TiVo - Xperi
Adeia owns the guide data: Licensing | Adeia

Click to expand...
This creates two separate companies each with its own management and board of directors but with the same initial ownership base. That’s why I say yes they own it. Technically the answer would be no but it’s the same ownership right?
 
#117 ·
dadrepus said:
Does Tivo still sell their little android box/stick? I use mine when I go on vacation. works just fine.
Click to expand...
I have one too. It is more reliable than my chromecast was. Somebody earlier said that it was not available anymore either. I checked the Tivo website and it is not listed anymore. It looks like it is still available on amazon though.
 
#119 ·
dadrepus said:
Does Tivo still sell their little android box/stick? I use mine when I go on vacation. works just fine.
Click to expand...
TiVo is not selling any products directly to consumers. None.

That doesn’t mean the products no longer work, can’t be purchased elsewhere, or cannot be activated/tramsferred.
 
#120 ·
cwoody222 said:
Adeia primarily licenses IP technology.
Click to expand...
As I recall, Adeia is what many would call a NPE. Most (nearly all?) of the IP licenses that Xperi Holding had when the split occurred (October 2022-ish) went to Adeia, who makes money licensing that IP to companies using that IP. When Xperi Holding bought TiVo it was thought that it was mostly about the IP (as they were already mostly an IP licensing company), and adding more IP to the portfolio allows them to make even more money licensing a group of related IP together.
 
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