[Win Joy Jr]

Just got caught up on the season to date.

What. The. Heck? Mostly the on orbit emergency. I don’t care that Danny was an astronaut and military. At greater than 2G he was going to carry effective more than twice his weight up that ladder for at least half that climb. Plus having an available EVA suit in his size, with no indications of help to get into the suit or pre-breath O2 to purge nitrogen from his blood stream. Then rappel down the spoke to a greater than 3G at the ring, open a hatch and close a valve (which if it was an electric thruster why?) that the command level could not cut off the fuel supply at the tank?

And, a MCC console operator leaves for the moon in a week? EVA Suit operations being the bare minimum. Plus lunar alignment only provides launch opportunities 2 weeks each month (roughly).

There is a lot more to carp about, like Ed experiencing an injury that should have grounded him permanently.

And the use of the damaged hotel as the crew section for a Mars mission, where the vehicle experienced structural damage from the incident.

 

[Guy Fleegman]

...And the use of the damaged hotel as the crew section for a Mars mission, where the vehicle experienced structural damage from the incident.

Duct tape is stronger in this timeline?

 

[Win Joy Jr]

And if you blow up something in the same orbit, congratulations, you’re now in orbit with a bunch of debris.

Just came across this from last seasons discussions. @nataylor did you recall saying this when the ASAT test resulted in a debris field in the ISS orbit. Which ISS had to perform an unplanned Debris Avoidance Maneuver last week to dodge a piece of debris?

Got some lottery numbers?

 

[Saturn_V]

And the use of the damaged hotel as the crew section for a Mars mission, where the vehicle experienced structural damage from the incident.

I remember reading somewhere that centrifuge-habitats (a la "Endurance" from Interstellar or "Aires" from The Martian) on spaceships weren't practical. Something about Gyroscopic Precession. Not to mention the motion sickness that can be induced if the radius/RPM isn't large enough.

 

[ej42137]

I remember reading somewhere that centrifuge-habitats (a la "Endurance" from Interstellar or "Aires" from The Martian) on spaceships weren't practical. Something about Gyroscopic Precession. Not to mention the motion sickness that can be induced if the radius/RPM isn't large enough.

Precession is not an issue if you spin-down for acceleration. And there seemed to be plenty of fuel to spin up the wheel!

The solution to the second issue is implicit in the question. The Soviet 2G simulator back in the 60s was way smaller than Karen's wheel.

 

[kaszeta]

The solution to the second issue is implicit in the question. The Soviet 2G simulator back in the 60s was way smaller than Karen's wheel.

But the Soviets weren't building a hotel.

At the scale of the Polaris Hotel (~60m radius is a quick wag of mine), to get 1G you need to rotate at around 3.86 rpm (0.404 rad/s).

If you lightly tossed something (~1 m/s), throwing it with the direction of rotation will make it have an apparent reduced gravity of 9.0 m/s, whereas throwing it in the opposite direction it's around 10.6 m/s. You'd quickly notice that difference, and be disoriented by it, although astronauts could likely train and get used to it.

And going up ladders or elevators, if you went more than a creeping speed, you'd notice a strong sideways force.

 

[ej42137]

But the Soviets weren't building a hotel.

At the scale of the Polaris Hotel (~60m radius is a quick wag of mine), to get 1G you need to rotate at around 3.86 rpm (0.404 rad/s).

If you lightly tossed something (~1 m/s), throwing it with the direction of rotation will make it have an apparent reduced gravity of 9.0 m/s, whereas throwing it in the opposite direction it's around 10.6 m/s. You'd quickly notice that difference, and be disoriented by it, although astronauts could likely train and get used to it.

And going up ladders or elevators, if you went more than a creeping speed, you'd notice a strong sideways force.

Sounds to me like you have never been on a ship at sea. These things certainly are not deal-breakers, just stuff they'd have to get used to. The guys in the Russian simulator couldn't play darts or throw a ball, but those aren't requirements for survival.

 

[vman41]

Duct tape is stronger in this timeline?

Have you not read The Martian?

 

[DevdogAZ]

Just caught up on S2 and the first few eps of S3. Most of my comments have already been mentioned, but I'm surprised nobody mentioned the Soviet "blockade" of the moon with a single ship. Seems like that would be a pretty easy blockade to get around. Just insert into lunar orbit when Buran is on the other side of the moon and the two ships will likely never see each other. If Pathfinder and Sea Dragon were in orbit on the opposite side of Buran, then there's literally nothing Buran could do to stop Sea Dragon from delivering its cargo to the surface.

 

[Win Joy Jr]

Well, I guess I'll start it for last week's episode: From here on will be spoilers for S03E03 "All In"

They are really hitting home on Commercial vs NASA Human Space Flight, and how the "New Space" companies are throwing a lot of money at experienced NASA staff. But it also showed Karen didn't really know her audience. Alida is "NASA" through and through. Called it last season that Aleida was going to be a Flight Director. In this universe, privately owned space rocks are a thing.

Danny Stevens is becoming more of a train wreck embodying the worst traits of his parents. Danielle Poole was correct for bouncing him from her crew. Ed throwing him a lifeline before he had to come clean to his wife allowed him to continue dodging bullets, like not being formally arrested for trespassing at the home of his departed parents. His story may be finally having consequences to his actions. But has dar as we have seen, he is acting that this oppertunity was made available based on his capabilities and not as a result of his screw-ups.

Hated that the Margo being compromised storyline culminated with her being blackmailed to hand over the nuclear secrets to the Soviets. I can only hope that she went to the FBI and they delivered false info. If not, I see her downfall being very public. And maybe even dragging President Ellen Wilson down with her. As much as Margo was shaken by the von Braun scandal, Alida may face the same crisis if Margo falls.

Ed Baldwin. Not sure how his story will play out. He is running on ego, not thinking except in his "old NASA" mode. Bringing Danny Stevens onboard will not end well. Either by his learning that it was Danny who was involved in Karen's affair, or by his failure due to his mental state, or by Ed attaching his friendship with Gordo on Danny. Unless the ensuing 2 years had Danny back in recovery. Gordo and Tracy's legacy are very much albatross's around their kids necks.

Kelli Baldwin. Another "NASA" person who has the bigger picture in sight, the search for life. Not surprised she turned down flying with Ed, the Helios goal isn't the same as NASA goals. Kelli was able to drive Danielle into what the correct requirement of the mission should be, the science.

Karen Baldwin. Her pausing at the elevator shaft where Sam died tells me that he was more than just a business partner.

"The Race". Ok, dramatically, the (somewhat) concurrent launches of the 3 were for the dramatic plot, NASA COULD have a head start since they are leaving Lunar orbit while Helios is leaving Earth orbit, with the Soviets having to get off the ground first. Unless the Moon is on the opposite side of the Earth at launch. I might need to see if the tools I have access to can go back to 1994 Mars launch windows.

 

[DevdogAZ]

"The Race". Ok, dramatically, the (somewhat) concurrent launches of the 3 were for the dramatic plot, NASA COULD have a head start since they are leaving Lunar orbit while Helios is leaving Earth orbit, with the Soviets having to get off the ground first. Unless the Moon is on the opposite side of the Earth at launch. I might need to see if the tools I have access to can go back to 1994 Mars launch windows.

Seems like the Mars launch window would be more than just a couple of days, and if so, then there would be time to wait for the moon to be in the right position to be an advantage rather than having to launch from 250,000 miles farther away.

 

[David Platt]

Karen Baldwin. Her pausing at the elevator shaft where Sam died tells me that he was more than just a business partner.

Weren't they married? Or am I misremembering?

 

[DevdogAZ]

Weren't they married? Or am I misremembering?

They never indicated that they were married. Neither were wearing a ring. And it would be kind of odd (or at least worth calling out) if Sam married the ex-wife of one astronaut, then turned around and married the ex-wife of another astronaut (who was the best friend of the first astronaut). Especially when Ex-wife One and Ex-wife Two were also very good friends.

 

[Win Joy Jr]

Seems like the Mars launch window would be more than just a couple of days, and if so, then there would be time to wait for the moon to be in the right position to be an advantage rather than having to launch from 250,000 miles farther away.

My impression is the launch window for a Mars direct transfer is maybe a month every ~2 years? (I am not versed in interplanatary considerations) And depending on when in the window you launch will drive some trade-offs. I'll dig in to Mars 2020 materials for the window. Add in that they were launching from Jamestown base.

 

[kaszeta]

Seems like the Mars launch window would be more than just a couple of days, and if so, then there would be time to wait for the moon to be in the right position to be an advantage rather than having to launch from 250,000 miles farther away.

Compared to the interplanetary distance, that's nothing.

The big issue is actually velocity, and in that case the moon launch of NASA is slightly advantageous to the LEO launch of Phoenix[1]. delta-V from Moon to an Earth-Mars Hohmann orbit transit is around 3 km/s. delta-V from LEO to an Earth-Mars Hohmann orbit transit is around 3.6 km/s. That apparent Soviet ground launch has a much, much higher delta-V needed, around 13 km/s

If they are all launching around the same time, they are basically taking more or less same transfer orbit to get there. So far they are a bit vague on the actual details of the relative missions (and I expect the drama to win out over technical orbital mechanics[2]), so it's hard to tell more, aside from a few top-level concepts:

1. Unless the Russians are doing an Earth orbit rendezvous, they are going to be a very lean mission compared to NASA or Helios.
2. At least the NASA vehicle has the potential for aerobraking at Mars, which isn't really an option for the gigantic former space hotel.
3. Wonder if the NASA or Soviet missions have capability for spin gravity. At least the Helios mission can potentially great reduce complications on physiology (if you are sending an entire ring habitat, you can spend most or all of the transit at high enough apparent G to avoid most of the low gravity effects, and potentially even transition to Mars gravity towards the last part of the mission for familiarization)
4. We know that NASA's already got their resupply and base equipment enroute or potentially on the ground already[3], whereas Helios is taking everything with them. Don't know that the Soviet plan is.

[1] The biggest gain I actually see for a lunar launch is that they've nominally got better access to He-3 fuel.
[2] If you want a rather good SF novel with respect to orbital mechanics and their quirks, John Sanford's Saturn Run has competing manned missions to Saturn, and he got some very good orbital mechanics consulting on the topic.
[3] I'd have to look at what a Venus assist could actually do in this scenario

 

[Bruce24]

They never indicated that they were married. Neither were wearing a ring. And it would be kind of odd (or at least worth calling out) if Sam married the ex-wife of one astronaut, then turned around and married the ex-wife of another astronaut (who was the best friend of the first astronaut). Especially when Ex-wife One and Ex-wife Two were also very good friends.

Well we also have Karen sleeping with Tracy's son so married on not if AppleTV+ didn't want this show Telemundo would have.

 

[Anubys]

The implication was that the Russians were never going to make the window unless Margo gave them the information they needed. So the fact that they launched is supposed to tell us that she did give in to the pressure.

Up until that point, Margo could've said "we got back from the Russians as much as we gave, and I never gave them the sensitive stuff". Not she's a full-fledged spy/compromised.

 

[kaszeta]

Being a drama, I expect that the Soviets will have some sort of surprise that they pull that will apparently get them there first, and then both the NASA and Helios teams will try to figure out how to catch up.

 

[Win Joy Jr]

Weren't they married? Or am I misremembering?

I think I speculated about that last season.

 

[Win Joy Jr]

@kaszeta Thanks for doing the heavy lifting.