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Winter Olympics 2018

Discussion in 'Now Playing - TV Show Talk' started by Hcour, Feb 8, 2018.

  1. TAsunder

    TAsunder Debates Ghee vs Gi

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    I'm sure they are great at playing the victim. Meanwhile every other country is looking at it and thinking maybe they should get into doping because this isn't all that bad since the name of the country is still there for everyone to see.
     
  2. murgatroyd

    murgatroyd Don't stop believin'

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    Dick Button had his own issues, but when he was talking tech, he was superb at commentary on singles skating. One year someone at ABC had the genius idea of putting Kurt Browning (yes, from Canada) in the booth with Dick for the men's singles competition. It was Kurt's first time at US Nationals (no surprise there) so he was surprised by the "let's crank it up to 11!" atmosphere at Nationals. And since Dick had an 'audience' for his tech talk, Dick went off on all sorts of skating geekery about what the guys were doing wrong with their jumps, with levels of detail he didn't always do when he was paired with Peggy Fleming or with just Terry Gannon (or whoever the other sportscaster might be). It was great.

    Google says Scott Hamilton is 5' 3" and Tanith is 5' 6", which sounds about right. By contrast, Dick Button is (according to Google) 5' 10" and Johnny Weir is 5' 9" (they must have counted in his hair, too). Tara Lipinski is 5' 1".

    Good luck with that. Apparently there have been backstage tradeoffs about which athletes were allowed to go in exchange for others staying behind.

    This is Russia we're talking about. Innocent athletes? LOL

    This isn't punishment at all. Russian skaters are still there, getting overmarked for presentation, and taking space on the podium which other athletes have earned. Nothing has changed.
     
  3. Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

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    But now, for me, anything involving Russia and that name is automatically suspect and tainted. Does any country really want that? Or Putin, who lives on appearance?
     
  4. Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

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    And so, again, the athletes get punished, and the sexual assault victims a second time?

    Perhaps the athletes themselves should take their organization over.
     
  5. TAsunder

    TAsunder Debates Ghee vs Gi

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    I don't want to derail any further, but if we can gut USOC and many or most or all NGBs and replace them with something that isn't likely to be corrupted so easily, then I'd be fine with that. I doubt they could get it in place by 2020. Anything that allows the current structure to remain unscathed isn't good enough. It's clear to me that it's a systemic problem that extends beyond gymnastics.
     
  6. Steveknj

    Steveknj Lost in New Joisey TCF Club

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    I think it was usually Chris Schenkel who did the figure skating for ABC when they had the Worlds and Nationals on WWOS and the Olympics. Dick also skated as a time when the short program was actually doing ordinals (I think that's what they called them) which were just technical moves not set to music (sort of like patterns on the ice). So Dick was exceedingly technical because half the programs he used to do as a skater were technical in nature. What I always liked about Dick is he was an elegant guy and you could tell he was into the beauty and elegance of the sport.
     
  7. murgatroyd

    murgatroyd Don't stop believin'

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    You're talking about compulsory school figures. See Compulsory figures - Wikipedia

    They were eliminated from international competition in July 1990.

    One of the reasons Scott Hamilton has his gold medal from Sarajevo is that he had built up such a commanding lead after the compulsories (figures) and short program that it didn't matter when he messed up in his long program. He had so much cushion, the others couldn't overtake him.

    Brian Orser vs. Brian Boitano in figures with commentary by Button:


    When they show Boitano, you get a good look at the tracing and how he has to skate over the top of his previous tracing. (The judges are in the way for Orser's figure, so you can't see it as well.) And you can see how fiendishly small the figures are. It was expensive for people to skate figures, because they had to get completely clean ice to practice on ("patch ice").


    Dick Button in his day was in a whole other category. He was a beast of a skater. He went to Europeans and won Europeans, and then the ISU made up a rule so that no one else could come over and do that ever again.

    Dick landed the first double axel in competition and the first triple ever, a triple loop. He also competed in pairs as a junior.

    He invented the camel spin and was the first skater to perform a flying camel spin (i.e. where you jump into the spin).

    One of my favorite skating photos is of Dick doing a split jump with stunning extension. You can see it in this NPR story: Dick Button: A Cutting Edge Behind The Olympic Mic

    It shows what Dick's skating would have been like in practice, where he wasn't hampered by that ridiculous jacket that he's wearing in the videos.

    The videos which are out there don't capture the full effect of his skating because we aren't seeing him in context; we can't compare him to his contemporaries.


    Dick Button - Wikipedia


    P.S. ordinals are part of the scoring system, as in the team event, where they take the raw numbers and convert them into rankings.

    In the old system, the ordinals were placements with 1 being best and the lowest score won, like golf.

    In the team event, they did placements in the other direction, assigning 10 points to 1st place and then adding the points together from each segment.
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
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  8. jsmeeker

    jsmeeker Notable Member TCF Club

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    On yeserday's Olympic Ice, Scott Hamilton was asked who was the best ever. He said it was Button. Because he was so good plus he basically invented all the moves that everyone does today.
     
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  9. murgatroyd

    murgatroyd Don't stop believin'

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    Well, obviously not, otherwise the jumps wouldn't be named for Axel, Lutz, Salchow, and Rittberger (who invented the loop jump -- in some countries they call it after him). But I know what Scott meant.
     
  10. jsmeeker

    jsmeeker Notable Member TCF Club

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    I sorta paraphrased that too. (Scott's comments). Was probably more like invented or "perfected" or made popular . Something like that.
     
  11. murgatroyd

    murgatroyd Don't stop believin'

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    It's really hard to convey in a small sound bite just how dominant Dick was in his day.

    I caught a bit of one of the news/talk segments on the Olympic channel this morning (probably Winter Olympics Daily) where Jimmy Roberts was talking with a bunch of other sportscasters who don't necessarily follow figure skating all the time. I didn't catch their names because my recording was messed up. One of the guys was saying that anyone who doesn't respect figure skating obviously hadn't gone to the practices and seen the pairs practice. First he reminded everybody about how much air the women get in the lifts and the twist. Then he talked about the women who fall (like after the throw jump) and how they just get up and keep skating again. And how the audience thinks oh, she's okay. No, he said, she's not okay! It HURTS.

    At least somebody has a clue that there's concrete underneath the ice sheet.
     
  12. mrizzo80

    mrizzo80 Well-Known Member

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    Is hosting the Olympics still considered a premiere assignment? I feel like when I was younger it was, but it doesn't feel like it still is these days.

    Didn't Bob Costas used to interview athletes in studio? Is Mike Tirico doing that?
     
  13. Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

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    I was just amazed by the artistry of the Olympics athletes last evening, between the ski jumping and half-pipe boarding (those folks are suicidally crazy), cross-country skiing (the pure power of the winner, in steaming by the then-leader in an uphill climb), and pairs ice skating. During the latter, I kept on stopping the action and re-playing the maneuvers in slow-mo (thank you, TiVo!), to try to understand the near-impossible physics, with a male partner skating to his female partner and then raising her, while still skating and turning, over his head using a single arm, all in a fluid movement no more apparently complex than my eating with a spoon; and the obvious pure muscle core strength of the woman as she is being lifted, spun and held aloft. And they make it look like it's a natural piece of cake.
     
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  14. jsmeeker

    jsmeeker Notable Member TCF Club

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    The figure skating pair from the DPRK are good. Handling what must be incredible pressure well considering they must have zero experience with real international media.
     
  15. Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

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    I thought they were impressive as well, esp. given their very political international debut. I guess the fear of being sent to a concentration camp if you fail in a lift or throw is a good motivator. ;)
     
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  16. murgatroyd

    murgatroyd Don't stop believin'

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    If you feel like digging into the physics sometime, you might like Kenneth Laws' book Physics and the Art of Dance. Physics and the Art of Dance

    Apparently in an earlier book. Laws discussed figure skating more, but this edition sticks more to ballet. Still, al lot of the same principles will apply. I wish someone would do a book like that which was all skating.

    If you can, try to catch the segments that Scott Hamilton and Tanith White are doing during Olympic Ice. They broke down the entry to the twist earlier this week.

    One-armed lifts are crazy. If you want to see some of the moves in more detail, you can look around for videos of skaters from the junior ranks -- they won't be skating as fast as the seniors, so it might be easier to see what they are doing.

    I still remember the Olympics Festivals from the early 90s, which was a showcase for up-and-coming skaters. Here's Jered Guzman and his partner Natalie Vlandis, who went on to win the 1996 US Junior championship. Yu can see Jered press Natalie up into the lift and then drop the arm so he's holding her up with just the one hand. He's 12.



    But my favorite junior skate of all time was from Johnnie & Tiffany Stiegler, a brother & sister pair who tore up the joint in 1994 with their Swan Lake program. You can get some good looks at the star lift, and watch how Tiff holds the landing edge after the throw jump. Start at 1:48 to skip all the intro stuff.

     
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  17. danderson400

    danderson400 Member

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    When i watched figure skating back when i was a kid, it was usually Jim McKay with Button and Fleming- then he retired, and they used Al Michaels and then Julie Moran before they settled with Terry Gannon
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
  18. Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

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    Many thanks--will be looking into it all! Watching the Pairs Freestyle right now. :)
     
  19. cmontyburns

    cmontyburns Excellent.

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    murgatroyd always rocks her Olympic posts. :)
     
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  20. cmontyburns

    cmontyburns Excellent.

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    Wow, that German pair... that was really pretty.
     

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