Why isn't TiVo offering a streaming package/cloud DVR?

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by TitanTiger, Jul 30, 2019.

  1. Jul 30, 2019 #21 of 119
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    Most of those companies have existing relationships with content providers. Even Sony own one of the biggest movie studios in the world. But there are notable companies missing from that list as well. Apple and Microsoft have both said they're interested in offering such a service, but neither exist yet. And those are multi-billion dollar companies with huge clout in the industry. If they can't get it done what hope is there for TiVo.

    Silicone Dust used a 3rd party service to provide their skinny bundle and look what's happening there. They've lost channels and now the 3rd party company is being sued out of existence because they didn't have the proper rights to do what they did.
     
  2. Jul 30, 2019 #22 of 119
    Adam C.

    Adam C. Active Member

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    Yes, bought it on Amazon in April 2017 for $349 including lifetime service. I never knew this was a special Amazon deal. But you're right I would not pay extra fees to Tivo when other devices such as the Recast have no such fees.
     
  3. Jul 30, 2019 #23 of 119
    ajwees41

    ajwees41 Well-Known Member

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    where would Tivo get the money?
     
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  4. Jul 30, 2019 #24 of 119
    Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

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    TiVo did look into selling a cloud (or cloud-like?) DVR, its Mavrik device. There still was a physical device in the user's home for the receipt of the local signal, but the content was stored in the cloud and could be accessed out-of-home. TiVo dropped the device well into the process. Had TiVo gone forward, it would have been interesting to see if the device/platform, over time, could have grown to accept 3rd-party services and streaming content.

    TiVo Mavrik Takes On Tablo For Television Streaming
    TiVo Mavrik Is Dead (and all of retail is in jeopardy)
     
  5. Jul 30, 2019 #25 of 119
    bobfrank

    bobfrank Active Member

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    I have to agree with you here. The old Tivo interface was far superior than anything else on the market, including the cable company DVRs. If the next Tivo model requires TE4 with no ability to upgrade to TE3, and I'm pretty that's what will happen, I will just go with the cable company DVR when my current Tivo's finally die.
     
  6. Jul 30, 2019 #26 of 119
    Adam C.

    Adam C. Active Member

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    I don't think most people care where their recordings are stored, whether it be in the cloud or on a hard drive. Like you said, either way there is still a physical device in the home. Most Tivo's are able to stream live and recorded content anyway even though there is no cloud DVR.
     
  7. Jul 30, 2019 #27 of 119
    BigJimOutlaw

    BigJimOutlaw Well-Known Member

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    For what it's worth, they were working on some sort of free ad-supported VOD service (think tubi or pluto) and could be looking at premium VOD as well. But live TV, probably not.

    Getting into competition with their MVPD partners would be a major sticking point.

    I think they'd much rather partner with the vMVPDs, rather than take on the headache of becoming one. They appear to be moving towards running their UI on Android TV. If/When that happens, their app potential increases tenfold. They could theoretically partner with YouTube TV and others to be an aggregator and suggestion engine just like they do with upcoming tv, Netflix, Amazon, etc. I believe that is where their heart is at.

    Given all that, I don't think an nVidia Shield-like streaming box is out of the question.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2019
  8. Jul 30, 2019 #28 of 119
    gigaquad

    gigaquad Tivo Image Master

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    I didn't read all the replies, but for me and a lot of people that grew up in the tech boom, we PREFER to have a local copy of whatever we're watching. you never know when a company will go belly up and leave you hanging mid-season.

    Actually, you see similar things today with these all-powerful streaming companies losing contracts on shows people are in the middle of watching, like Netflix and friends or the office. I despise having a company control my program viewing, software, etc.

    What a man giveth, a man can take away.
     
  9. Jul 30, 2019 #29 of 119
    trip1eX

    trip1eX Well-Known Member

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    TV itself isn't moving to the vMVPDs. IT is moving to the SVODs.

    So if I were Tivo I would not attempt to become a vMVPD. IT would (be) a dead end that would become all too apparent in a few years. Nevermind the competition that is already there. Such a move would be a money loser.

    Instead I think you just ride out the current business as long as possible. And look into selling yourself to another company that can use your tech/services.
     
  10. Jul 30, 2019 #30 of 119
    Darrell Patton

    Darrell Patton Member

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    Cobra Kai, Step Up High Water, Impulse, Wayne, Weird City, Broke, Lifeline, Origin, Champaign Il, and more.
     
  11. Jul 30, 2019 #31 of 119
    mattyro7878

    mattyro7878 Well-Known Member

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    It was my understanding that all OTA devices have no monthly fee. Am I wrong??
     
  12. Jul 30, 2019 #32 of 119
    Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

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    Current TiVo boxes denominated "OTA" in the box name (e.g. Roamio OTA, Bolt OTA, Bolt VOX OTA; and as distinct from the Bolt 500GB, which can do OTA or cable) include Only the current "Roamio OTA" and "Roamio OTA VOX" models (denominated as such in the model name) include a TiVo One-Pass/Lifetime subscription in the box purchase price, and there is no monthly/yearly fee. The one vestige point: the Roamio OTA originally did not come with Lifetime and you couldn't even buy it for it--that only came later. And so, if buying a Roamio OTA, one should verify if it comes with a One-Pass/Lifetime subscription or not.

    The "Bolt OTA" model has the option of buying a lower-cost One-Pass subscription for it (the same One-Pass subscription as for other TiVo boxes, simply priced significantly lower for the Bolt OTA model).
     
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2019
  13. Jul 31, 2019 #33 of 119
    ej42137

    ej42137 Well-Known Member

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    Only the Roamio OTA includes Lifetime; the Bolt OTA requires a separately purchased service plan. Although listed on the TiVo website, the Roamio OTA new production is out of stock and I doubt it's going to return there. Although they still seem to be selling refurbs.
     
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  14. Jul 31, 2019 #34 of 119
    TitanTiger

    TitanTiger Member

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    Yeah, I know most of them have existing relationships with content providers, but YouTube TV is a pretty obvious exception.
     
  15. Jul 31, 2019 #35 of 119
    TitanTiger

    TitanTiger Member

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    Where does any streaming provider get the money? How does YouTube TV get the money?
     
  16. Jul 31, 2019 #36 of 119
    TitanTiger

    TitanTiger Member

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    Anyone can produce their own *new* content. Apple is doing that. Netflix has been doing it. No reason TiVo couldn't do the same.

    What we're discussing is the contention that TiVo can't offer a skinny bundle of cable channels because they don't have an existing relationship with content producers or cable providers like Sling (owned by Dish), PS Vue (owned by Sony), Hulu Live (previously majority owned by Universal, now owned by Disney), etc. But there are services out there who don't have that such as YouTube TV and they are managing to be a player in the game. Seems like TiVo could pull that off to.
     
  17. Jul 31, 2019 #37 of 119
    ashipkowski

    ashipkowski Member

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    YouTube TV is part of Google, which is one of the most profitable companies in the world, and their rates have been rising regularly as their costs mount. TiVo's pockets aren't as deep as Google's by any means, and at this point the content providers 1. already felt threatened by them and 2. have come to see control over their own content as important, and so are less likely to give it away as cheaply.
     
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  18. Jul 31, 2019 #38 of 119
    TitanTiger

    TitanTiger Member

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    I'll give you the Google money advantage, but I fail to see how content providers would feel threatened by TiVo. Despite our love for TiVo's offerings, they are not a major threat to anyone. If anything, Google/YouTube is far more of a threat and they would be reticent to give them any content with which to build their streaming service.
     
  19. Jul 31, 2019 #39 of 119
    NashGuy

    NashGuy Well-Known Member

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    At the root of it, the answer to your question is this: the content that consumers want to watch has more value in the marketplace than the UI in which it's presented. TiVo does not own any content. They do not own any national cable networks or local broadcast stations. They do not own a movie or TV studio that produces films and series that they own. All TiVo owns, really, are a bunch of patents that describe UIs and features that make for a better user experience when it comes to finding and watching other companies' content on our screens. But TiVo licenses those patents out to lots of companies, so it's not like customers MUST use a TiVo device/app/service in order to have a decent user experience when watching video.

    As I've posted elsewhere, the economics of the TV industry are shifting so that there's really only good money to be made by those companies that OWN content. Companies like Disney, AT&T/WarnerMedia, Comcast/NBCUniversal, Netflix, CBS/Viacom, Amazon and (soon) Apple. Content is king. Over the next few years, companies that don't own content -- Charter, Verizon, Cox, Altice, RCN, etc. -- will get out of the business of running cable TV services. Even Sony, which owns Sony Pictures, isn't a big enough content owner to really matter; their PS Vue streaming cable TV service won't survive unless they sell it off to someone. (Amazon would be a likely buyer.)

    TiVo really has NOTHING to bring to the table in terms of running their own streaming cable TV service because they don't own content. Sure, they have a nice UI with Hydra but it's not anything that consumers outside of this forum really care or know about.
     
  20. Jul 31, 2019 #40 of 119
    ajwees41

    ajwees41 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think anyone said content providers would feel threatened by TiVo, but were would Tivo get the money to acquire the content?
     

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