Why isn't TiVo offering a streaming package/cloud DVR?

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by TitanTiger, Jul 30, 2019.

  1. Jul 30, 2019 #1 of 119
    TitanTiger

    TitanTiger Member

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    It feels like the physical hardware DVR working with a cable card is a dying business. Meanwhile, Sling, PlayStation Vue, Hulu Live and others are offering various packages of channels, cloud DVR functionality and such and it works on most major streaming platforms (Roku, Apple TV, Fire TV, etc).

    How is it that TiVo hasn't jumped into this, offering a channel lineup, plus a cloud DVR with their interface? Or if they didn't want to put it on those platforms, a small streaming box of their own sans the local storage, no need for cable cards, a TV package available plus apps for Netflix, Prime, Hulu, ESPN, etc?

    Do they really think staying tethered to the cable companies is the way to go? Are they prevented by existing agreements from offering a TV service themselves? If they aren't, would the cable companies attempt to block or no longer support existing TiVo hardware with cable cards? What is the hold up?

    I've been using Tivo for over 10 years now and I just hate the idea that one day this company might not be around, but I'm afraid it's what may happen if they don't reinvent themselves a little.
     
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  2. Jul 30, 2019 #2 of 119
    michael1248

    michael1248 Member

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    Great Question!!!
     
  3. Jul 30, 2019 #3 of 119
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I asked a higher up at TiVo about this once. He said they looked into it and it wasn’t feasible. These skinny bundles are typically offered by companies that already have an existing relationship with the content creators. TiVo doesn’t have that relationship. Even Apple has had issues launching a service like this and they’re the biggest company in the world.
     
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  4. Jul 30, 2019 #4 of 119
    Adam C.

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    There are already too many streaming services. It seems every other week a new one pops up. Over time there is no way these can all survive.
     
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  5. Jul 30, 2019 #5 of 119
    TitanTiger

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    Interesting. How then do they plan to remain relevant?
     
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  6. Jul 30, 2019 #6 of 119
    TitanTiger

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    I'm just not sure not doing anything, or keeping them beholden to existing cable companies is a winning strategy either.
     
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  7. Jul 30, 2019 #7 of 119
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I think their long term plan is to try to become an MSO supplier and ditch retail completely.
     
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  8. Jul 30, 2019 #8 of 119
    TitanTiger

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    This entire discussion explains to me why a purchase of TiVo by Apple didn't make sense then. Even though TiVo's user interface is great and better than navigating an Apple TV for instance, that's not enough to be of value to Apple. They would want some "in" with a content company to make launching their own TV service easier.
     
  9. Jul 30, 2019 #9 of 119
    ManeJon

    ManeJon Active Member

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    TIVO today is relevant because it is one interface that works with a variety of cable. In my area Spectrum only offers a 2 tuner dvr and no whole house - so TIVO is needed for me. A lot of people still want local "network" TV and the local cable companies own that franchise - so you have to go with them or do OTA.
    Who knows what the future or even tomorrow will bring.
     
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  10. Jul 30, 2019 #10 of 119
    TitanTiger

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    No offense, but I don't think "provides something for me that I need" is the same thing as relevant. Traditional cable is hemorrhaging subscribers left and right. Dish and DirecTV are talking about merging due to subscriber loss. What you're describing is a niche product that will continue to have a smaller and smaller potential group of buyers, not a successful, current, relevant one.

    The streaming services are beginning to more and more offer local channels. Even in my relatively small city in Alabama, all four local channels are available on Hulu Live. And YouTube TV continues to add more local stations as well.

    So TiVo continuing to hitch its wagon to someone else's horses, when the industry is moving away from horses and wagons to the automobile so to speak, seems like a dying strategy.
     
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  11. Jul 30, 2019 #11 of 119
    ajwees41

    ajwees41 Well-Known Member

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    Tivo has no content, so how would that work?
     
  12. Jul 30, 2019 #12 of 119
    TitanTiger

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    What content does YouTube TV own?
     
  13. Jul 30, 2019 #13 of 119
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    I've said this many times but I believe that in the not to distant future cable companies are going to spin off their programming into an OTT skinny bundle type app and convert their infrastructure to strictly an internet connection. This allows them to stave off regulations on the programming side while expanding their markets beyond their physical infrastructure. It's the only logical way that their programming business survives long term.

    When this happens if there is no open API that they're forced to adhere to then we'll be stuck with whatever "cloud DVR" each service decides to offer. We've already seen wildly different terms with the various DVRs offered with OTT skinny bundles. Some limit recordings to days, some weeks, some only let you record certain channels, etc... The days of recording all your channels and keeping those recordings forever are coming to an end.

    If TiVo is lucky they might end up the "cloud DVR" platform for one, or more, of these services. If not they'll die off. I'm not sure I really care either way. I don't really like Hydra so I'm not itching to convert to any new product or service where that's the primary UI. The TiVo I loved is dying with TE3 and I'm not sure I'm going to ever upgrade again beyond what I have right now.
     
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  14. Jul 30, 2019 #14 of 119
    Adam C.

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    The market for an OTA DVR seems to be growing. Amazon has the Recast that came out last year to serve that market, so clearly they think there is growth potential there. As a cord cutter myself, I can attest that my Roamio OTA has been a very solid performer for OTA recording over the past 2 years. The fact that it also has apps for the other services I use (Netflix, Hulu, Prime Video) make it a very good and logical choice for me, as I can get all of my shows in one place without having to switch remotes or TV inputs. I would also add that I have been very happy with the TE4 Hydra interface and I could see myself remaining a Tivo customer indefinitely.
     
  15. Jul 30, 2019 #15 of 119
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    OTA could be a viable retail business but there is a lot of competition compared to CableCARD and they're really price sensitive so I'm not sure TiVo's $15/mo for data thing is going to work.
     
  16. Jul 30, 2019 #16 of 119
    ajwees41

    ajwees41 Well-Known Member

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    they provide videos or rebroadcast tv via youtubetv, but Tivo doesn't produce content
     
  17. Jul 30, 2019 #17 of 119
    Adam C.

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    What is the $15/month fee? My Roamio OTA did not come with any monthly fees.
     
  18. Jul 30, 2019 #18 of 119
    Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    You bought one of those special ones from Amazon that included lifetime didn’t you?

    With most TiVos you either have to pay a monthly fee or pay for lifetime (aka all-in) separately. I just checked an the fees for an OTA only device is cheaper ($7/mo or $250/lifetime) but it's still a lot when you can get an OTA DVR from Amazon for a flat fee of $150.
     
  19. Jul 30, 2019 #19 of 119
    TitanTiger

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    YouTube doesn't produce content either. And we're talking about their ability to offer a streaming service that includes local channels in major markets, plus a bundle of cable channels, just like Sling, PS Vue, Hulu Live, and so on. But somehow they've managed to pull it off.

    Why couldn't TiVo do the same?
     
  20. Jul 30, 2019 #20 of 119
    TitanTiger

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    I'm just not sure there are enough people like you to make that a sustainable business long term.
     

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