When do Tribune get the data for new channels?

Discussion in 'TiVo Series 1 - UK' started by Raisltin Majere, Sep 18, 2007.

  1. Raisltin Majere

    Raisltin Majere The 96 YNWA

    1,668
    58
    Mar 12, 2004
    Devon
    LFCTV is launching on Thursday and there's no guide data for it yet. I'm concerned there won't be any,or am I being premature?

    Thanks
     
  2. cwaring

    cwaring VM Tivo User

    9,015
    0
    Feb 11, 2002
    Knaresboroug...
    Well, I would tell you that it's up to the stations to make sure that Tribune not only firstly gets the guide data but also uses it. Others might say that it's up to Tribune to make sure they get the data for all new channels, etc :)

    Of course, Pete The Zone Channels Champion will be along shortly with his tales of derring do and how he was single-handedly responsible for getting a channel on the EPG, as he does at any given opportunity ;):D
     
  3. Raisltin Majere

    Raisltin Majere The 96 YNWA

    1,668
    58
    Mar 12, 2004
    Devon
    :D

    Thanks Carl.

    I thought I'd get some advice before approaching the club. I'm not sure who's responsibility it is at the mment.
     
  4. woody

    woody New Member

    1,120
    0
    Jan 26, 2002
    Somerset. UK
    IIRC, like Carl said, the station has to provide the details, not tribune go chasing it.
     
  5. cwaring

    cwaring VM Tivo User

    9,015
    0
    Feb 11, 2002
    Knaresboroug...
    I'm sure Pete will point out that, even if the channel do provide the details, Tribune don't always use them. Not sure whether that's the complete story of course :)
     
  6. OzSat

    OzSat Very Nice Moderator

    5,053
    1
    Feb 15, 2001
    Oxfordshire, UK
    I've not been able to get listings for Liverpool FC - so I doubt Tribune have.
     
  7. Pete77

    Pete77 New Member

    7,968
    0
    Aug 1, 2006
    Not Far...
    I'm prepared to try and help out on this despite my longstanding and well known inability to appreciate almost any variety of sports that involve teams of 11 or 15 men running up and down a muddy pitch for 90 minutes kicking round or oval shaped balls. I quite like the sport involving a team of 11 men who use a bat to hit a funny small red shaped ball with a seam.

    My advice would be as follows though:-

    (a) Approach Liverpool FC saying you are a keen fan and that you record programs on Tivo which is similar to Sky+ but better.

    (b) If you can then secure the support of Liverpool FC to also supply listing data to Tribune so that they can be on Tivo (basically the same data they will produce for Sky from the same computer spreadsheet at their end should be fine) then mention that success here and I will PM Raisltin with the email addresses of a couple of contacts at Tribune in the US (especially a rather enthusiastic lady called Amy) who may be able to get this sorted out.

    Staff at Tribune in the US seem a little more susceptible to the argument that they ought to be covering all channels that are also willing to provide data to Tribune than Ken Carter at Tribune's European office. Ken is on record in an email to me last October as saying "We only supply channels for which we have a paying customer. No one is willing to pay us to edit the channels you mention. At such time as a customer pays us to add them we will do so."

    Now Ken has never explained to me exactly who is paying Tribune for the channels that they do provide and whether it is just Tivo or if he is implying that may be some how Sky pays Tribune something to carry listings of any of their channels that are part of their subscription packages. If of course only Tivo is willing to pay for new channels listed by Tribune then you have to ask why Tivo omit paying for some new Freesat channels as they do seem to be paying for plenty of other equally obscure subscription Sky channels to have listings. And clearly LFC has a lot of fans who are very dedicated to catching every game.

    Basically it only worked out for Zone Thriller because Zone was already supply Tribune for other channels (although channels they had acquired from other companies like the Horror channel) so their PR man George knew all about Tribune and had contacts there and was more than happy to add Zone Thriller to their feed to Tribune. However for TrueMovies I'm not clear exactly what was happening but I believe that was restored to the Tivo EPG because Tribune had a previous relationship with Chartshow, who own TrueMovies, and it was only through neglect that the feed had been allowed to fall away. So when I gave a small friendly kick by the way of an email to the top EPG person at Tribune in the US Ken and co at Tribune Europe seem to have been persuaded they ought to get this feed going again.

    However given the fact that major recent news channel additions like Al Jazeerah, France24 and Russia Today have no Tivo EPG listings and that at present Tribune even seems to be resisting adding details for the new Zone Romantica (I believe because Tribune are probably now in a "this is a legacy service we are doing the absolute minimum on" mindset) then I don't hold out that much hope for LFC but if you don't ask then you don't get.........................
     
  8. TCM2007

    TCM2007 New Member

    3,947
    0
    Dec 25, 2006
    Most of the channels you list, including Zone Romantica, as not being on the TiVo EPG are also not available on Diguiguide, which suggests to me that there are issues with sourcing them.
     
  9. cwaring

    cwaring VM Tivo User

    9,015
    0
    Feb 11, 2002
    Knaresboroug...
    Well, given that TMS are not a charity, or doing this for altruistic purposes, I think he has a point :D
     
  10. Pete77

    Pete77 New Member

    7,968
    0
    Aug 1, 2006
    Not Far...
    Digiguide actually has listings for all of the following Freesat stations that Tivo (Tribune) does not have:-

    167 Information Tv
    168 Information Tv2
    186 Legal Tv
    195 Propellor Tv
    197 Life One
    273 RealEstate Tv
    274 Real Estate Tv+1
    277 Wedding Tv
    278 Wedding Tv+1
    280 Horse & Country
    293 Living in Spain
    325 Movies4Men
    327 Movies4Men2
    516 Russia Today
    912 Playboy One

    So your argument that Tribune's non listing of EPG data for all of these channels is purely due to problems sourcing the data simply does not hold water.
     
  11. Pete77

    Pete77 New Member

    7,968
    0
    Aug 1, 2006
    Not Far...
    OK but then who is paying Uncle Ken to happily add listings without any chasing on our part for Five US, Five Life, More4, Pop Girl, Motors Tv and various other recent real channel additions that are not just +1 variants (which require negligible further work by Tribune).

    And who is paying Digiguide to carry the other Freesat channels listed above that Tivo/Tribune can't currently be bothered to have listings for?
     
  12. TCM2007

    TCM2007 New Member

    3,947
    0
    Dec 25, 2006
    I've never even herad of those channel, let alone made any arguments about why or why not Tribune doesn't have them!

    You were talkking about Zone Romantica, Al Jazeerah, France24 and Russia Today. I confess I missed Russia Today on the Digiguide list, but those others are not on Digiguide, which I repeat suggests that they are not easily available.

    Of course it's unlikely that Tribune will go out of its way to get listings for a channlels whose TiVo-owning audience is likely to be in single figures at best. I don't know what proportion of TiVo owners have Sky, but that segment will be the ones who are most likely to have jacked it in and gone for Sky Plus, so I'd guess it was well under 5,000 by now. Given the tiny % of the Sky audience these channels get, a phone box would confortable hold them.
     
  13. TCM2007

    TCM2007 New Member

    3,947
    0
    Dec 25, 2006
    Me. Diguiguide is a paid-for service.
     
  14. Pete77

    Pete77 New Member

    7,968
    0
    Aug 1, 2006
    Not Far...
    Yes but Digiguide only charges around £8 per annum and Tivo is still charging Raisltin, Carl and others £120 per annum for their sub. So surely you would expect the Tivo service to be far more comprehensive and accurate at over 15 times the price. :eek:

    Of course certain Tivo members, like yourself TCM, who have had lifetime subs from new in 2000 have now only paid around £29 per annum for their annual Tivo Sub (not factoring in loss of interest on the £200) but that's still over 3 times as much per annum as Digiguide charges you.......................

    So what's Tribune's excuse for less comprehensive coverage than Digiguide then? :confused:
     
  15. AMc

    AMc Active Member

    2,623
    0
    Mar 22, 2002
    East of England
    Hazarding a guess - Tribune & Tivo came to an arrangement about costs and services in 1999/2000 and the bulk of that agreement continues in place. There are many more channels on all platforms. When an obscure channel with virtually no audience doesn't actively contact Tribune to provide good data in a timely fashion Tribune have no contractual obligation with Tivo to chase the channel.
    When a major channel adds a +1 or add on (e.g. C4+1 FiveLife) then Tribune add it to Tivo because there are plenty of other people paying for data feed too.
     
  16. TCM2007

    TCM2007 New Member

    3,947
    0
    Dec 25, 2006
    Basic market economics Pete. If Digiguide doesn't provide the listing for channels I want, I'll stop buying it. The same does not apply to TiVo's EPG where i have no choice beyond junking TiVo altogether.

    Of course the £10 a month does not purely pay for the creation of the EPG as you well know, nor does Digiguide's data have the same metadata as TiVos.
     
  17. cwaring

    cwaring VM Tivo User

    9,015
    0
    Feb 11, 2002
    Knaresboroug...
    Erm... the channels themselves, or their agents :confused:

    Plus, with DG, there's nothing to stop a user creating their own programme info for any given channel, in fact they actively promote it as [User Channels.
     
  18. Pete77

    Pete77 New Member

    7,968
    0
    Aug 1, 2006
    Not Far...
    Wrong. You are paying Carl - £120 per annum. Compared to only £8 for Digiguide. Surely you feel annoyed at paying £120 per annum and not even getting £8 worth of channel listings.

    But I didn't pay Tribune for the listings to get them all myself. I could use a DVD recorder if I wanted to do things the hard way.
     
  19. Pete77

    Pete77 New Member

    7,968
    0
    Aug 1, 2006
    Not Far...
    Well your only choice is to sell your Tivo and recover a good part of your Lifetime Subscription that way.

    Raisltin and Carl do of course have the privilege of stopping their subscription if they are dissatisfied but they have had to pay a great deal more in total to enjoy having that privilege. ;)
     
  20. Pete77

    Pete77 New Member

    7,968
    0
    Aug 1, 2006
    Not Far...
    I still think that the fact that Digiguide are covering certain channels Tivo aren't on Freesat might be used to embarass Tribune in to adding them.

    Contrary to what TCM claims about France 24, Russia Today and Al Jazeerah English being obscure channels the business plan of these channels is to be available in English speaking territories worldwide including USA, Canada, UK, Australia and NZ plus in the many other places where there are large English speaking communities - even if as a second language.

    Also adding a news channel is very little work as it can basically be done on a template and reviewed once every month without going horrendously wrong, whereas a channel like BBC1, or Five etc has to be reviewed and amended weekly.

    The only reason for Tivo sticking to the original deal on Lifetime Subs in the UK is because if word spreads that they suddenly pull out of existing markets and leave existing users in the lurch they won't easily be able to sell any Lifetimes in Australia, China, India or wherever else. With the internet if a company loses its reputation it loses it globally. Lifetime subs make sense in the early days both to bring in cash to defray high startup costs in a territory and to bring in initial users at lower cost to then have good feelings about the product and recommend it to their friends and relations.
     

Share This Page