Westworld - S01E05 "Contrapasso" 10/30/2016 *spoilers*

Discussion in 'Now Playing - TV Show Talk' started by DevdogAZ, Oct 31, 2016.

  1. DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    So did I understand correctly that Arnold created the park, tried to kill himself, Man in Black saved him, and then Arnold reinvented himself as Robert Ford and told the lie that they were partners and Arnold died in a tragic accident? And that happened 34 years ago and Dolores was the only host around at that time? I'm assuming they're just talking about the Dolores programming, because surely the Dolores flesh and bone body hadn't been invented yet, since MiB talked about how the early hosts were all mechanical and they switched to flesh and bone because it was cheaper.

    The stuff with the maze is getting much more bizarre, and much more interesting. I'm very interested to see what that is all leading toward.

    Who would be putting a laser satellite transmitter inside a host in order to smuggle out data? And what data would that host have access to that would be smuggled out? Just the code that operates the hosts, or something more global?

    Looks like this was the episode that led to all the stories last year about the very extreme nudity clause the extras had to sign:

    ‘Westworld’ Extras Must Agree To Genital-to-Genital Touching; SAG-AFTRA To Monitor

    Did the electronic contraption that brought the bird back to life also wake Maeve up, or did she wake up independently of that?

    What changed in Dolores between a couple episodes ago and now, where previously she had trouble pulling the trigger, and this time she takes out like 4 guys without blinking an eye. It seems the Arnold stuff deep inside her is taking over, and she's even keeping secrets from Ford when she's been given the "Analysis" command. That's pretty cool.

    Also, when they first spotted Pariah and Slim was telling them about it, who else expected him to say, "You will never see a more wretched hive of scum and villainy."
     
  2. kaszeta

    kaszeta $nullstring TCF Club

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    Yeah, when we first saw the orgy scene, I wondered if they had found the door into Roman World, since that looked right out of Caligula (1979)

    And either there are at least two timelines, multiple versions of Lawrence, or they worked overtime turning Lawrence around and redeploying him.
     
  3. dianebrat

    dianebrat wait.. I did what? TCF Club

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    They never even remotely implied any of that.
     
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  4. cherry ghost

    cherry ghost Well-Known Member

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    This episode really confused things for me. The last two episodes had me convinced there weren't two timelines, but now I'm not so sure. Logan talking about the park " hemorrhaging cash" and "buying them out" makes me think that timeline can't be 34(?) years after the park opened.
     
  5. Rob Helmerichs

    Rob Helmerichs I am Groot! TCF Club

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    Why not? Old companies go under all the time...
     
  6. kaszeta

    kaszeta $nullstring TCF Club

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    And to settle something, since about half of the internet gets this one wrong: in the last episode, and on HBO's own web site, it's "El Lazo" ("The Loop", can also mean "knot" or "trap"). Not Alonso or Alonzo.
     
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  7. DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    OK, I rewatched and I got a bit of it wrong, but not all of it. I'm basing it on three different conversations. There was a conversation between Ford and Dolores:
    Then there was this conversation between Logan and William:
    And then there was the conversation between Ford and Man in Black:
    So Ford was implying to Dolores that he is Arnold (Do you remember the man I used to be?). Logan is saying that his team of lawyers can't find any evidence of Arnold, not even a picture. Man in Black is saying that Arnold died but also wondering aloud whether Ford is a host that Arnold created before he died. So either they are pointing to Arnold having reinvented himself as Ford, or Arnold creating a host (Ford) to carry on his legacy. I think it's unlikely that Ford is a host, because we saw evidence that he used to be much younger, and people who work with him would notice if he never aged over the course of 30+ years. So I think that leaves the most logical conclusion from these conversations that Arnold and Ford are one and the same.

    The piece I got wrong was I misunderstood MiB when he said "The man I'd be asking died almost 35 years ago. Almost, but not quite, thanks to me." I missed the line in the middle about "Almost took this place with him." So it seems MiB thinks Arnold died, and then MiB likely provided a lot of the funding for the park to continue development. That would explain why he's a VIP and gets free reign of the place, even getting people in HQ to make snap decisions to allow his cigars to blow open locks and heads.
     
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  8. TAsunder

    TAsunder Debates Ghee vs Gi

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    We've seen a picture of Arnold, even if others haven't.
     
  9. dianebrat

    dianebrat wait.. I did what? TCF Club

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    No, he's not implying that at all in my view, I saw the same scene, read the same dialog, and completely disagree, he's saying two thing, first he's saying "Do you remember Arnold?" and the second question, ""Do you remember the man I used to be?" is asking her if she remember himself from before, most likely before he became the cynical man he is today. Those 2 questions are separate.
     
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  10. AlphaDelta

    AlphaDelta Member

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    We've seen a picture that Ford says is Arnold. He could be the Westworld plumber for all we know.
     
  11. TampaThunder

    TampaThunder Well-Known Member

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    I'm just hoping that all these loose threads get woven into a fine fabric! :D
     
  12. ClutchBrake

    ClutchBrake Pass the gravy!

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    I figure when this is over I'm either going to want to binge it all at once immediately... or be completely pissed and not want to ever watch it again. :D
     
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  13. DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    Well, I'm not the only one reading it that way. Read this EW.com recap:

    'Westworld': Here's our theory-filled recap of a nudity-stuffed episode
     
  14. DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    Another observation/theory:

    When Ford is interviewing Dolores, at one point, he pays particularly close attention to her right hand. Later, we see Elsie discover the transmitter in the woodcutter's arm. Later still, we see Dolores having a hallucination of pulling a wire out of her arm.

    Is it possible that Ford is the mole that's planted the transmitter and beaming data out of the park, and that Dolores also has a transmitter, which he was checking on when he was examining her hand?
     
  15. kaszeta

    kaszeta $nullstring TCF Club

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    I was thinking something similar: the fiber in Dolores' arm looked similar enough to the one in the woodcutter I'm wondering if she's wired.

    (Although that would be interesting, since that Dolores is in the "old" timeline if you are buying into the two timelines hypothesis)
     
  16. dswallow

    dswallow Save the Moderatоr TCF Club

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    I want to know more about the smart nitro-glycerin. There's no way that could be safe to have around guests; and if it were even there at all, it'd have to be something monitored and known-to-be-putting-guests-nearby-at-risk. And thus where that storyline seems headed is a bit more difficult to believe can work (i.e, using the hosts needing repair as a way to get improvised explosive devices behind the scenes to damage the factory/repair center).
     
  17. DavidTigerFan

    DavidTigerFan No, not Detroit. TCF Club

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    I thought guests couldn't get hurt? Logan got the crap choked out of him (would he have died?) and also got the crap beat out of him by the confederados (implying that they were gonna kill him).

    I should really watch this show when I'm more awake. I missed all of what you guys are seeing. Definitely going to have to watch all these again.
     
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  18. BrettStah

    BrettStah Well-Known Member TCF Club

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    Me too! Ive been watching it the night it airs, and im groggy by then.
     
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  19. DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    When Man in Black pulled his knife and threatened to cut Ford open, Teddy immediately reacted and grabbed the knife away from MiB, even slicing his hand in the process. This is what's known as the "Samaritan reflex" that's built into the hosts and is supposed to kick in whenever a host senses that a guest/human is in danger and cause the host to protect the guest/human. I'm not sure whether that reflex wasn't working in those two situations with Logan, or if the danger simply hadn't gotten serious enough yet. Perhaps if the soldier host had been allowed to choke Logan for another second or two, it would have automatically stopped on its own.
     
  20. TAsunder

    TAsunder Debates Ghee vs Gi

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    They can be hurt to some degree - the bullets leave welts, for example. Didn't look like a very effective choke since it went on for a while and he was conscious the whole time.
     

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