WARNING - Before you go in for the HR20

Discussion in 'DirecTV TiVo Powered PVRs & Receivers' started by rrr22777, Oct 14, 2007.

  1. Oct 17, 2007 #61 of 133
    newsposter

    newsposter Poster of News

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    forget about the 50 for now...my wife cant even get her soap series link to record. even set to repeats, it just wouldnt pick up next weeks showings at all.

    wonderful for trying to resolve conflicts a week out once we get this machine running full speed
     
  2. Oct 17, 2007 #62 of 133
    Citivas

    Citivas Old Member

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    Cranbury,...
    If they really applied anything like the logical assumptions you are speculating on, they were making some pretty poor assumptions that also contradicted the use data that would have been available to them. Which is illogical or just dumb. Two things in particular:

    1. The DVR is not a personal media device, like an iPod, it is a household media device. So it needs to have capacity to handle programming needs for multiple people. The 50 limit may sound like a lot but how does 10 sound as a limit? That's how many programs you would be able to have in my household if we were all forced into a fair quota distribution.

    2. One of the great benefits of a DVR is deferred viewing, not just by hours or a day but as long as you want. In our household we have 3-tiers of shows. Tier 1 are shows we will typically watch the same week on a slightly deferred basis of a few days at most. Tier 2 are shows we save up in bulk to watch when all the other shows go on holiday or summer hiatus or repeats. And Tier 3 are shows we will probably never watch and allow to auto-delete but for which we have there just in case we (particularly the kids) are in the mood or need to kill time. We have well over 50 SP's on the 10-250, but about 20 of them are kids shows. The kids only get to watch a limited amount of TV, but these represent the subset of shows we have blessed that they get to pick among. On a fraction get watched before being overridden. OUr particular 3 Tiers may be unique, but the parttern of use is not -- i.e. people are recording more than they watch. That's one of the main benefits -- the ability to record a subset of the TV universe to make the need for live TV almost a non-issue. So doing the math on how many hours someone can watch a week is completely at odds with this.

    Now was there some complex technical reason D* needed to create a 50 limit? I have no idea. But to defend it as a logical feature limitation unrelated to a technical one is really silly. I would hope they put more thought into it than that.
     
  3. Oct 17, 2007 #63 of 133
    Jebberwocky!

    Jebberwocky! Guest

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    not to belittle your need for 50+, if you need them then you need them.

    I got around it by having multiple HD20's - also gives you additional buffers ;)

    Before I went to the HD DVR's, my wife had her own Tivo and the rest of the family (me) had the other two.

    Now we have units that are used to record specific channels (CBS and NBC, ABC and Fox, others)
     
  4. Oct 17, 2007 #64 of 133
    Citivas

    Citivas Old Member

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    Cranbury,...
    That is awesome to have so many units... It definitely would be nice.

    But that's not practical for most people, in terms of the additional monthly fees or the physical equipment costs...

    BTW, how do you split all the inputs into your TV? Are you using a splitter or different inputs? I haven't seen too many TV's with enough inputs to handel 3 decoder boxes plus all the other stuff (DVD, game consoles, etc.) all using HDMI or component.
     
  5. Oct 17, 2007 #65 of 133
    bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    Just to ask, did you just setup the series link and then checked the ToDo list right away? The episode you created the series link on should appear right away but just an FYI that it can take up to a day for the rest of the episodes that qualify to show up as it does that as background tasks later. That's why it's done in an instant when adding a new series link or reordering them vs. the Tivo which does the ToDo list rebuilt right away and thus you have the "please wait" on screen for a while.

    And if none of that applies, please go to DBSTalk and report your issue so it can be logged.
     
  6. Oct 17, 2007 #66 of 133
    bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    Probably an A/V receiver. Most will do either component or HDMI switching. I can plug 5 component devices into my A/V receiver which then all goes via one component cable to a single input on the TV. This leaves me with a 2nd input on the TV so in total I could have 6 component devices hooked up to 1 TV (it's old enough it doesn't have DVI let alone an HDMI connection).
     
  7. Oct 17, 2007 #67 of 133
    terpfan1980

    terpfan1980 It's Just TV TCF Club

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    I have to ask, out of curiousity, of those that are complaining about the HR20 missing recordings, do you ever put the unit into standby or is it 'on' 24x7 for you?

    Seriously, I'd like to know if perhaps the issue with the missed recordings is that the unit hasn't had time to catch up on background processes, index building, or other things that might happen if the unit spends more time in stand-by and less time thinking it is actively being used?

    I would add one note on the HR20 and missed recordings -- I believe that up to, and including the current national release for the boxes there had been a problem with manual recordings being missed. I set up a recurring recording for Sunday nites, 8pm (east coast time) for FOX and yet the recordings weren't happening for me (if you haven't figured it out, that would be a recording of The Simpsons, which otherwise records all the friggin' time, on both the TiVo boxes and non-Tivo boxes thanks to crummy guide data supplied by Tribune and company :mad: ). On the newest CE releases these manual recordings have been happening like they should, so apparently something that was broken was found and fixed along the way.

    Hopefully the newest CE versions will hit national release soon and then DirecTV can get back to addressing other issues -- like the low number of series link/season pass issue, and perhaps the DLB issue.


    Meanwhile, on the TiVo side, the HR10 that my wife uses in the living room has been much worse lately about missing recordings for unexplainable reasons. The box certainly doesn't owe me anything as it worked well for my time, and it works pretty well as an SD recording device *most of the time*, but it is not perfect and does have plenty of issues. Those issues could be all DirecTV's fault, or they could be TiVo's fault, or a combo of the two. All I know is that the issues with that box have been frustrating my wife and in turn me because I have to hear about it when the box doesn't work. :(
     
  8. Oct 17, 2007 #68 of 133
    Jebberwocky!

    Jebberwocky! Guest

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    monthly fees are not much, I got the three units for 19.95 (shipping)

    Previously I had a TV with only 1 input for HDTV - I used a switch that was for my XBox360 that had 4 component inputs and 1 output. It had a remote so I was able to incorporate it into my remote to switch automatically.

    I recently bouoght a new TV that has 4 HDMI inputs (52" Visio LCD 1080p) so I am using three of the inputs for my recorders and one of the two component inputs for the 360. Real sweet TV with an amazing picture.

    I have 5 cables coming from my basement switch so only 2 of my HD20's have dual turners.
     
  9. Oct 17, 2007 #69 of 133
    Fahtrim

    Fahtrim Member

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    I have 2 HR20-700s. Recordings are solid, no problems. If you're missing recordings I guessing there is something goofy in your install.

    2. 50 is plenty for me, with as fast as this thing is, you can delete and readd season passes easily 2 times a year for summer vs fall shows.
     
  10. Oct 17, 2007 #70 of 133
    Daniel

    Daniel New Member

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    But why should you have to? I have a DVR for that, it's called a TiVo. You should get one. :rolleyes:

    That being said, 50 season pass limit is a deal breaker in my house. Between the three TiVos we have over 200 season passes. We never watch live TV. If we might want to watch something, it gets recorded.
     
  11. Oct 17, 2007 #71 of 133
    JohnB1000

    JohnB1000 Well-Known Member

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    You know the answer to that right ?? To get the new HD channels, just like you had to buy a new TV that worked with HD or a new fangled VCR that would play DVD's etc. etc.

    I realize it's not over 200 but if you had 3 HR20's you'd be able to get 150 season passes :up:

    As I've said before, I'll bet the 50 limit is removed from DirecTV MPEG4 appears on a TIVO.
     
  12. Oct 17, 2007 #72 of 133
    fasTLane

    fasTLane Member

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    You can keep your new channels. This TivoHD is good to go and needs no excuse.

    Like a sip of premium wine, a little goes a long way here. ;)
     
  13. Oct 17, 2007 #73 of 133
    Sir_winealot

    Sir_winealot Seenyer Member

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    Well then, you'd both be wrong as evidenced by people who have the need for more than 50 SP's.


    :p
     
  14. Oct 17, 2007 #74 of 133
    Rigelian

    Rigelian New Member

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    I don't know if the 50 SP are a design flaw because I don't know what the trade offs would be if they designed the HR20's to exceed them. Meaning, given that I top out at 29 SP, any trade off to exceed the 50 SP limit would be superflous. For example, if the lack of a 50 SP limit on the HR10 is a cause of the long delay in reordering SPs, I would consider it a wise design decision. Others, who have a need for more than 50 SPs may legitimately reach a different conclusion.

    However, not knowing what design considerations went into limiting the SPs to 50 I don't know if anyone here has sufficient information to definitively state that this is a design flaw.

    I suspect that if anyone were to seriously address the issue they would first start off with the percentage of Directv users who exceeded 50sp on the HR10s in their old setups. Starting with that base, one might be in a better position to address the question.
     
  15. Oct 17, 2007 #75 of 133
    gio1269

    gio1269 "HR20 Army"

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    It's also evidence that people need to others things besides watch TV. :eek: My god, get a hobby or something....
     
  16. Oct 17, 2007 #76 of 133
    TyroneShoes

    TyroneShoes HD evangelist

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    "Standby" only does a few things, and PVRs do not behave significantly different whether in standby or not. About the only differences other than muting of the video and audio and front panel lights, is that the HDD might spin down on occasion. It will still spin up for recordings, downloads, suggestions, etc., regardless. Since they don't put a lot of ram in these things, most functions such as indexing page from the HDD as well. Bottom line, placing it in standby won't really affect how it operates, since it spins up the HDD whenever it gets the urge, standby or not.

    "Standby" might be a little greener. The old Replays were rated at 21 watts in standby and 25 watts not in standby. Theories balancing spin up/ spin down vs. constant spinning abound, but most agree that continuous spin up is likely better for HDD life than constantly spinning up/down.

    A PVR prioritizes its tasks, and placing it in standby will not likely affect that.

    Regarding missed or spontaneously deleted recordings, Tivo has a significantly-better track record than the HR20, the R15's, and the DISH and cable PVRs, but there are still reports on occasion. All I know is that I miss one or two recordings a year with Tivo (out of about 1000) while I missed 15-20 a year with anything else (except Replay) including 3 different DISH models. Reports seem to bear that out, there are lots of reports of non-Tivo PVRs losing (or even deleting after the fact) recordings, but never many with Tivo.

    What seems interesting about the missed recordings is that many never experience them, while some do, for all PVRs. This makes me wonder if it is not aggravated by unstable or dirty power. Some folks get better local power than others, and it would be interesting to see if those with better power have better results. Regardless, I think a UPS might help in any case. Also, when companies alpha-test equipment, it is usually under conditions that include very stable commercial UPS-quality power, so maybe the problem never comes up and seems insignificant for them, but once they get in somebody's media room in an area with questionable power, things don't go as well.

    It might be a credible theory. Thing is, it is a lot easier to just get a UPS than it is to try to prove or disprove it.
     
  17. Oct 17, 2007 #77 of 133
    innocentfreak

    innocentfreak Well-Known Member

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    I always love when people say that. Is it that tough to believe people can watch more TV than you and still do other things? Do you say the same thing to people who read more books than you? Listen to more music than you? Or is it just because it is TV?
     
  18. Oct 17, 2007 #78 of 133
    newsposter

    newsposter Poster of News

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    I checked it a few hours after my wife set it. Then the next day it was ok. However the delay is unnerving. I want to immediately know if i have a conflict, not have to monitor the history list every day( assuming that unrecorded will show up there?)

    My wife already told me she'd prefer to wait 3 min for a recording (tivo) and decide if the conflicted program was more important or not rather than babysit the machine.

    however I guess once you have you SLs setup, and you wait a few days, all should be well. It's just when you set one up you have issues.
     
  19. Oct 17, 2007 #79 of 133
    daperlman

    daperlman check the rhime

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    This is one of the advantages of the HR20 another is using the guide while watching recordings. One other great thing about it - it does SD and HD simultaneously (unlike the HR10-250).

    However, I have to disagree with people who don't think that there are serious problems with the hardware, software and support. I switched on 9/2 and Tuesday I got my third unit (#1 dead tuner, #2 completely failed to encode any signal). Now that I have one that works... I can say that the series/season pass feature is far less sophisticated. For example let's say you are watching a ball game and it asks if you want to record The Shield ep1 and you say no. It will not figure out ever record that ep unless you reschedule manually. I think that is a serious flaw.
     
  20. Oct 17, 2007 #80 of 133
    bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    Yep, that was it then. Just have to wait a day. Took me about a month to get used to it, now I never even give it a second thought. It's all what you are used to.

    As for conflicts, they will show up right in your ToDo list. For example over the summer I always had a triple conflict Tuesday nights. So in the ToDo list it would still list all 3 programs but the lowest priority would have a big red "X" next to it to indicate it won't record. And I'd see the later showing that evening also listed as it was picking that one up. Nice feature actually to quickly see conflicts.
     

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