Video output has wrong colors

Discussion in 'TiVo Stream 4K' started by wizziwig, May 25, 2020.

  1. wizziwig

    wizziwig New Member

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    Looks like there are some serious issues with the video output of this device when connected to a SDR TV (Samsung F8500 Plasma). Most likely also wrong with HDR but I'll let someone else investigate that. Attached are examples of output from a reference grade device like the Fire TV Stick 4K vs. the Tivo Stream 4K. I verified the output of the Amazon device exactly matches what is in the source file. You can obtain my near-black shadow detail calibration pattern here. This pattern has grayscale steps representing every possible near-black value from 16 (black) to 27 (5% white). Every step should be shown distinctly and only differ from previous step by one value: 16, 17, 18.....26, 27.

    On the Tivo Stream 4K, this pattern is incorrectly displayed. Values from 16 to 25 all get output as 25. This means you have elevated blacks shown as 25 instead of 16 and all shadow detail darker than 25 is crushed to 25. There is also some weird color dithering going on.

    If you toggle the hidden "Dolby Vision Disable" setting as explained elsewhere on the forum, you end up with this sequence instead: 16,16,17,18,20,21,22,22,23,24,26,26. While black level is correct, many of the steps are displaying the wrong value. No weird color dithering.

    Order of the 4 attached images is:

    *Fire TV Stick.
    *Tivo with hidden Dolby Vision setting disabled.
    *Tivo with default settings.
    *All 3 images tiled into a single image and gamma lowered to make the patterns easier to see on lower contrast display devices and/or in high ambient lighting.


    FireStick4KDefaults_8bit_ycbcr.png DolbyOff.png DolbyOn.png

    CombinedGammaAdjusted.png
     
    nlitend1, aaronwt, osu1991 and 3 others like this.
  2. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    Yes. I guess the fact that the Stream 4K can't output SDR with an HDR capable TV is really messed up for a TV only capable of SDR. TiVo should have already fixed this. You would think they would have at least had an option for SDR output only? It's crazy that TiVo would release the Stream 4K without an SDR option.
     
  3. mattyro7878

    mattyro7878 Well-Known Member

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    connection begins with an hdmi input. how many standard def tvs have hdmi inputs? component inputs began the "progressive scan" 480p craze.
     
  4. powrcow

    powrcow Active Member

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    SDR is Standard Dynamic Range, or simply a non-HDR TV, correct?

    I have a very old 1080p Sony HDTV that is "just good enough", and I think this problem explains what I'm seeing. If I watch a 4:3 show on Netflix, like Cheers, the letterbox on the sides (pillarboxes?) aren't black but a dull dark grey.

    Viewing the AndroidTV or TiVo Stream menus, the black looks black there. But blacks in the video portion of Cheers are blacker than the pillarboxes, which is why I noticed it.

    Thanks for the images. Guess I'll play around a bit.
     
  5. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    I would think HD not SD. All my TVs have been HD since 2001. And since 2005 they have all had HDMI inputs.
     
  6. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    We're not talking about 480p. You're confusing SD (standard definition) with SDR (standard dynamic range or 17 million colors at 4k resolution). HDR is 69 billion colors at 4k. When the Tivo stick starts with 69 billion colors and squeezes it down to a display that can only handle a tiny fraction of that, the picture suffers. This is the crux of the issue. Other devices don't convert SDR up to HDR. They leave SDR at SDR levels as they should, and the colors don't get messed up.
     
  7. Jun 8, 2020 #7 of 19
    Alberto Hamade

    Alberto Hamade New Member

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    Same problem here, during a 2.35:1 movie, when the movie is dark, the bars are grey.
     
  8. Jun 8, 2020 #8 of 19
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    That's because either the TV either doesn't have local dimming zones, doesn't have enough zones, or the zones are not placed properly to give you completely black bars.
     
  9. Jun 8, 2020 #9 of 19
    Alberto Hamade

    Alberto Hamade New Member

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    Yeah, that's a hard no. The local dimming on my TV works perfectly fine with everything else. Vizio m60-c3
     
  10. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    Seems like I read that an HDR (Dolby Vision?) on/off setting was added in the software update last week. Toggle that setting and and see if that fixes it.
     
  11. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    Then it either doesn't have enough zones or those zones are not placed properly. Of course this is also assuming the picture is calibrated properly.

    For instance my 2018 TCL 6 series. It's zones are tall and narrow. Which is not the best thing to have when you have narrow aspect ratio content with black bars. Their 2019 6 series changed how the zones were laid out. So the 2019 sets do much better with those black bars.
     
  12. Alberto Hamade

    Alberto Hamade New Member

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    Again, no. Every other device works fine on my tv, the only device I am having problems with is the Tivo Stream 4K. The devices working fine are, at a minimum, XBOX ONE X, PS4 PRO, AMAZON FIRE STICK 4K, ROKU ULTRA 2017, CHROMECAST ULTRA... the list goes on. Only Tivo STREAM 4K has this problem.
     
    aaronwt likes this.
  13. Alberto Hamade

    Alberto Hamade New Member

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    That toggle is useless for TVs like mine, which does not have HDR.
     
  14. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    Time to send it back. Like I did with both of mine.
    But at least mine did show HDR10 and Dolby Vision properly. Assuming it wasn't from content where the Stream 4K erroneously forced it to be shown in a different dynamic range.
     
  15. wizziwig

    wizziwig New Member

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    Please read the first post again and look at the images. Nothing the TV can do can make your letterbox bars appear black when the Tivo is sending it gray bars at luminance 25 instead of 16. 16 is reference black in the HDMI YCbCr standard. Garbage in, garbage out. This is for SDR TV watching SDR content. Everyone suffering from this, please return the device.
     
  16. md wass

    md wass New Member

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    Were you able to return it without any shipping charges/service charges?
    The recent firmware "update" added a few new issues to mine, thats it for me..
    I'm tired of "fixing" this thing every day or 2, so it needs to go back, but I've heard you pay return shipping/service charge to return it..

    Thanks!
     
  17. nlitend1

    nlitend1 New Member

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    Aug 2, 2020
    To clarify, you're saying that even with DV disabled the colors (white/black steps/intervals) are not correct?

    Your last statement about "Everyone suffering from this, please return the device". Is that saying that it only affects some of the devices?

    I have a SDR tv and have disabled all HDR through dev options etc. The picture looks reasonable but some colors still appear slightly off and large white areas appear "blown out" and bleed into the surrounding area. I do not have this trouble at all with my 4k firestick. Any advice? Is it worth RMAing the device or is this a defect in product design? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Thank you!

    Nlitend1
     
  18. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    They gave me a full refund for both units. I had no shipping or service charges.
     
  19. Alberto Hamade

    Alberto Hamade New Member

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    May 8, 2020
    I can't believe this is still not fixed. I had to sideload HBO max and Peacock on my Fire TV 4K because I can't stand using this TIVO on my SDR tv.
     

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