Upcoming complete channel realignment on FIOS

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by rashid11, Jun 23, 2008.

  1. Aug 4, 2008 #181 of 325
    ciucca

    ciucca New Member

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    Jun 29, 2004

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    I agree!!! If it is fixed for the NY zip codes what is the problem fixing it for the NJ zip codes?!!

    Another symptom of a dying company!
     
  2. Aug 4, 2008 #182 of 325
    mbhuff

    mbhuff New Member

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    Jan 24, 2004
    New York
    It depends on what you mean "fixed" for NY zip codes. We do have the new channels, but we have a number of duplicates and missing guide data.
     
  3. Aug 4, 2008 #183 of 325
    JacksTiVo

    JacksTiVo TiVo User since 2001

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    Jan 7, 2006
    New Jersey
    TiVo does not prepare the guide data, Tribune does it. All that TiVo does is take the data and distributes it to its 4 million or so subscribers everyday. My experience from 2001 is that all of my TiVo's have always received the lineup data during every successful daily call or Internet connection. If the data is incorrect blame Tribune, not TiVo.

    When you report an error to TiVothey contact Tribune to correct it. It is Tribune that takes 5 to 7 days to correct it.

    I believe the fault lies with Verizon not giving Tribune a heads up of the coming channel lineup changes.
     
  4. Aug 4, 2008 #184 of 325
    vazquezj324

    vazquezj324 now THIS is Colorado

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    Jul 2, 2008
    Colorado
    +1
     
  5. Aug 4, 2008 #185 of 325
    bigguy126

    bigguy126 Member

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    Sep 4, 2007

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    Here is the thing. Some of you people here can find NO fault with TIVO and will make excuses for them till the cows come home. As a TIVO subscriber, I should not even know that Tribune even exists. I pay my subscription to TIVO. Whoever or however they get the listing and channel lineups is immaterial. If they use a 3rd party or do it in-house does not matter. It is the KEY part of my subscription. If the lineups are incorrect, it renders my TIVO useless. The buck stops with TIVO!!

    If Verizon did not communicate the channel changes that is one thing, maybe for the first change. It was known (and reported) as early as 6/30 with Verizons first change in Indianapolis. The problem persisted with Portland and now New York and New Jersey. Fool me once shame on me, fool me twice (and more) shame on you!
     
  6. Aug 5, 2008 #186 of 325
    Mike in NJ

    Mike in NJ New Member

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    Sep 12, 2006
    NJ
    I completely agree. I have purchased a product from TiVo, not Tribune. Sure, Verizon may have been late with the info. But TiVo knows about the problem, they know where I live, and they know that I am affected. How about a proactive email to let me know what they are doing and the status of the problem?
     
  7. Aug 5, 2008 #187 of 325
    rcr2

    rcr2 It's you, not me.

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    Feb 3, 2007
    Monmouth...
    Umm - what can TiVo do to correct the problem?

    Really. If you look on Verizon's website for channel listings, it still states that Central New Jersey channel lineup is effective 8/26.

    But, my channels have already changed, and the lineup hasn't been fixed.

    Do you expect TiVo to find all the right channels for every Verizon market, create channel mappings for everything, re-input the guide data, verify every market is correct, and then send out the updates AND track on a daily basis if Verizon has updated Tribune properly (or Tribune has followed through on what it was supposed to do) in order to know when to take out the channel mappings on a per-market basis?

    When it's TiVo's fault, I hit them for it (failing hard drives and crappy support for pixellation issues, mainly) but be realistic about the technical issues around how channel guide data is managed in today's world.
     
  8. Aug 5, 2008 #188 of 325
    mbhuff

    mbhuff New Member

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    Jan 24, 2004
    New York
    BTW, after the re-alignment a number of my channels were showing as black screens (including WGN-HD, a lot of the new Cinemax channels etc). After waiting a week, I called Verizon support. They re-loaded the cablecards and now everything is fine. Now if we can just get the guide fixed, I'll be a happy camper.

    I agree that Verizon is at fault for not providing correct guide info to Tribune, but Tivo is ultimately responsible since they are providing the guide service to us. If I tried to open a support call to Verizon, it would take forever to find the people responsible that could fix this. Tivo should have a relationship with the major cable providers and at least have a mechanism to work through guide issues. I've been willing to cut them some slack due to the size of the change, and Verizon's obvious problems (sending out by mail the lineup change, then changing it again, and then once more), but after two weeks, this should be resolved.
     
  9. Aug 5, 2008 #189 of 325
    ciucca

    ciucca New Member

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    Jun 29, 2004
    Incorrect!

    This is 100% the responsibility of Tivo to their customers. They know these changes are taking place throughout the country. They are charging the monthly fee for the guide data basically. They need to be informed!

    The lineup change is no secret! Verizon told their guide supplier about it, I'll bet it is probably the same company Tivo uses.
     
  10. Aug 5, 2008 #190 of 325
    xfm

    xfm Member

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    Apr 1, 2005
    Plain and simple, a product or service provider is 100% responsible for the portions of their product that are supplied by subcontractors. If an integrated circuit fails in your microwave oven, do you look for recourse from the chip maker? No. You look to GE (or whoever). They are responsible because they have the contractual relationship with the end user. Those who think that TiVo's an innocent victim here are probably those who always have an excuse and point fingers at others when they fail to perform on the job. With a commitment comes an accompanying responsibility.

    After all this is no unavoidable 'act of god'-type event. FIOS customers were notified by 'snail mail' 3-4 weeks before the switchover. It is inexcusable that FIOS rolled out similar realignments across the country over the last month or so, and Tribune and TiVo are then still caught completely unprepared in the country's largest market -- metro NYC. Someone in the TiVo organization has the responsibility to monitor cable/FIOS providers to ensure an early awareness of upcoming changes that impact TiVo's ability to provide services to its customer base.

    One of TiVo's prime responsibilities is providing accurate guide information to their customers. Without it, the product becomes not much more functional than a 1980's vintage VCR (which now costs <$25 with no service charges).

    What is most disappointing here is TiVo's complete silence and lack of acknowledgment of this major faux pas and its effect on their customers. No messages, no emails, no postings on this forum or their web site. It's like they're so ashamed, they're sticking their heads in the sand until things blow over. I truly thought that they would offer a plan to affected customers, perhaps along with an apology and appropriate compensation for their customers' inconveniences.

    Very, very disappointing. Not the reaction of a quality company.
     
  11. Aug 5, 2008 #191 of 325
    kas25

    kas25 Member

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    Mar 10, 2003
    NJ
    100% agree.
     
  12. Aug 5, 2008 #192 of 325
    tivo33

    tivo33 New Member

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    Feb 25, 2002
    Great job. By the way 7 days now with no guide data. All the extra channels are great. But try using the up/down channel button to thumb through hundreds of channels, by the time you figure out what is on the shows are already over and it is time to start searching again!!!

    UGGGHH!
     
  13. Aug 5, 2008 #193 of 325
    vazquezj324

    vazquezj324 now THIS is Colorado

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    Jul 2, 2008
    Colorado
    I have to say I disagree this is 100&#37; TiVo's fault, which I already have stated at length. However, I do agree they should be more pulicly involved with the situation than they are. The proactive emails/webpages/DVR messages seem to be best suited for such matter.
     
  14. Aug 5, 2008 #194 of 325
    webin

    webin New Member

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    Feb 13, 2008
    Hillsboro,...
    You've been writing this same post for days now XFM. I don't see how maintaining this level of outrage is doing anything but raising your blood pressure and getting people to agree with your points. The way I see it, you have three good courses of action: 1) Continue complaining on these forums, blowing off steam whenever you boil over, 2) Get on the phone with Tivo technical support and in your calmest voice express how outraged you are, hopefully convincing them to be more public about their progress and devote more resources to the issue, or 3) Chill out a bit, take a few deep breaths (ok, maybe a lot of deep breaths), and live with what you have. Use TitanTV.com to check for what's playing, manually record shows you want to watch, and calmly wait for the problem to be resolved. I think 2 and 3 are the better options, personally.

    I agree that it's TiVo's responsibility to provide you with the guide data you pay for. For this lapse, they ought to take remedial actions (making refunds, extending service time, free Tivo Plushy). I don't agree that it's Tivo's fault. (I draw a big distinction between responsibility and fault). Verizon REALLY rushed to get the NYC market up and running, and as a result of that speed, and it occurring at the same time as the realignments, Verizon dropped the ball on some of their side responsibilities such as providing programming data to third party content-providers. That hand over has been so flubbed that even a week later, Tribune is still trying to sort it out and package it for Tivo consumption. I have no doubt in my mind that tivo representatives are working with both Verizon and Tribune to help get this data prepared. The delay isn't a result of a lack of oversight or management on Tivo's part, it's just a result of a having a complex and messy issue dropped in their laps (by verizon) too late for them to handle properly in time for the channel realignment.

    Let's say you live in a small town on an island. There's only one bridge into town. One day, a ship captain loses control of his vessel (maybe he was busy plotting his course and handing out duty assignments to his crew). As a result, his ship collides with the bridge and destroys it. Now you paid for that bridge with your tax dollars, and without it, you have no access into or out of town. The Dept. of Transportation didn't cause the collision, but they are responsible for maintaining the bridge, so they undertake getting a new one built as quickly (and safely) as they can. Maybe they hire a subcontractor to manage the construction. It's an awful situation, but it is what it is, and takes 2 weeks to get a new bridge in place.

    How do you handle that situation? Do you scream and moan and stay home for two weeks? Do you seek restitution from the Dept of Transportation because you weren't able to use the bridge you paid for? Do you complain to the DOT that the subcontractors aren't working fast enough? Do you blame the ship captain for the accident and hope they assist with the repairs?

    Or do you calmly assess the situation you're in, place blame on those responsible, assist those making it right, and find some other way around the obstacles you're faced with in life?

    In the long run, that last possibility is the only one that gets you on with your life.
     
  15. Aug 6, 2008 #195 of 325
    tivo33

    tivo33 New Member

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    Feb 25, 2002
    I spoke to Tivo CS last night and they told me that Tribune said it will be fixed within 48 hours. So I guess we will see at 7:30 pm Thursday?????
     
  16. Aug 6, 2008 #196 of 325
    xfm

    xfm Member

    128
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    Apr 1, 2005
    Webin,

    In my defense, one rant was early on in this fiasco, the other was almost a week into it. My last post was mostly to express amazement and disappointment at TiVo's lack of visibility and its total silence on this astounding failure to prepare. Quality companies take charge, execute a recovery plan, and, maybe most importantly, communicate with their customers to maintain credibility and confidence.

    I might agree with your analogy of the bridge and the island, but only if the ship's captain, three weeks before he crashed his ship into the bridge, sent a letter to all of the island's residents that he was going to do this, along with the specific date on which he would demolish the bridge with his sturdy craft.

    And, once the dastardly deed was perpetrated, I am certain the Dept of Transportation would contact the residents of the island, by semaphore flags or smoke signals in the event the power lines went down with the bridge, to inform them of the plans for bridge replacement and declare the island a disaster area, along with some assistance, in the form of a monetary grant, tax rebate, etc, to help them deal with the expense and inconvenience caused by this "unexpected" event.

    Let's not forget. this FIOS occurrence was no spontaneous 'accident', but a planned transition which mirrored similar previous transitions across the country, and was clearly communicated to Verizon's customers weeks before it occurred.

    As you say, 'it is what it is', but that doesn't mean that I need to curl up on the couch in a fetal position hugging my TiVo Guy plushy with my thumb in my mouth to await a resolution.

    I guess it's an East Coast-West Coast thing.
     
  17. Aug 6, 2008 #197 of 325
    webin

    webin New Member

    307
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    Feb 13, 2008
    Hillsboro,...
    Valid points xfm. I really do epathize with the situation you're in. I'm in the Portland market that was second to change, and my guide data was flakey for close to a week. I can understand how frustrating that can be.
     
  18. Aug 6, 2008 #198 of 325
    ciucca

    ciucca New Member

    270
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    Jun 29, 2004
    xfm is 100% correct!!

    This is another example of a once leading edge company sinking down the toilet.
     
  19. Aug 6, 2008 #199 of 325
    xfm

    xfm Member

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    Apr 1, 2005
    If I were in the first or second market to change as you were, I might be more understanding.

    It's the advance visibility available to TiVo -- they knew this was coming -- combined with the total lack of communication that really causes my dismay and disappointment with them.

    I've been a customer since their first year, 1999, and all along I've been one of their biggest boosters among my friends and associates. If TiVo came up at a cocktail party, I was good for at least 45 minutes of extolling the virtues of TiVo. I often stated that it was one of the two great inventions of mankind, along with the iPod.

    Maybe that's why I'm taking it as a kind of betrayal when I witness their apparent lack of concern for the customers as exemplified by their silence.

    Tomorrow will be a week with no explanation or acknowledgement, despite having multiple avenues to communicate their actions, plans, remedies.


    XFM
    1 x Series 3 w 1TB WD ext HDD
    2 x TiVoHD
     
  20. Aug 6, 2008 #200 of 325
    TheBar1

    TheBar1 Long Time Lurker

    168
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    Dec 26, 2001
    Northern NJ
    Has anyone had any luck getting TiVo to agree to issue a service credit on their account if you were impacted by this mess?
     

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