TIVO Units Rebooting, anyone else have same issue ?

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by arcusjim, Jun 11, 2018.

  1. brobin

    brobin Member

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    Feb 14, 2014

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    It's probably not your hard drive because I had the exact same thing happen a few nights ago with the same message about one day's worth of info which was bogus as was yours. I've also noticed that when pressing play it takes up to 10 seconds for the show to start. And last night when I hit the skip button it froze and rebooted - twice. Someone should teach the folks at TIVO about the old adage "If it ain't broke, don't fix it." It seems that a new version, chock full of debilitating "improvements" is being sent almost every day. The auto skip feature is the only reason I went to TE4 and I'm seriously thinking of going back to TE3. Not sure whether to call that an upgrade or a downgrade.
     
    Dan Cour likes this.
  2. JKR123

    JKR123 Active Member

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    Feb 10, 2019
    I totally agree. At this point I would actually call going back to TE3 an upgrade. I’ve had nothing but weird issues and quirks happen to my boxes running TE4. I actually feel as though a lot of the issues came after their ad and guide changes but that may just be a coincidence. Some issues I have reported to TiVo support and others I have just learned to live with. I just wish they would do a better job with their QA testing before rolling out software updates.
     
  3. jeffsinsfo

    jeffsinsfo Member

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    Oct 15, 2005
    San Francisco
    Unfortunately I woke up this morning to a rebooting Roamio, meaning it made it through one day without a spontaneous reboot. I tried forcing a connection and it failed at the point of loading the data (it indicated it completed the "call"). It then indicated it would try again in another half hour.

    Since my kickstart 58 earlier this week didn't seem to be doing anything (unless a message saying "installing an update...this will take a few minutes" displaying for several hours is doing something), I pulled the plug on that and it rebooted normally. Right now I am running a kickstart 54. At least I can tell this one is doing something although it sure is slow. It "passed" the first few tests relatively quickly but gave me an estimated time of 735 minutes to run the Extended Test. So far it's been running for 592 minutes and it's 80% done.

    It's interesting that some others who have Roamio Pros are struggling with daily (or more frequent) reboots lately. I am still running TE3, though, so I cannot blame my problems on Hydra/TE4.

    i have thought about calling TiVo but I'm afraid that will be just a waste of time. Other than when I've called to buy equipment or activate a device I have never had a good experience when calling TiVo or, for that matter, when submitting an issue via the web. (For my amusement I just looked at my support history on the website and not a single issue of mine was ever addressed by them; some issues still say they are waiting my response which isn't true as it's obvious the last communication was from me to them, and others were just closed without any response from TiVo.)
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2020
  4. JKR123

    JKR123 Active Member

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    Feb 10, 2019
    Mine just rebooted a few minutes ago again. And of course I was in the middle of taping two shows. Maybe I had it trying to do too many things at once. I was taping some shows on it, viewing a movie from it via another TiVo in another room, and I was copying a movie from it to a third Tivo box. (Should I find a TiVo anonymous support group about my Tivo addiction? Ha ha)

    I haven’t gotten a chance to clean up my hard drive yet to know if that is causing my issues but like the previous poster stated, it is curious that several of us with Roamio Pros have begun experiencing these frequent reboots. I am reluctant to call TiVo support as well. The last few times I tried to report an issue they went through what seemed to be generic scripts like do service connections, reboot, repeat, run guided setups, etc. and then when the issue wasn’t resolved they said I could swap out the machine for another one rather than turn it over to the next level support team. Since I didn’t want to lose my recordings I never went with the swap option. However, if there is a widespread issue affecting a lot of people, if we don’t report it then they will not be aware of it. It is hard to know what to do.
     
    Dan Cour likes this.
  5. jeffsinsfo

    jeffsinsfo Member

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    Oct 15, 2005
    San Francisco

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    I abandoned the kickstart 54 after it reached 20 minutes beyond the estimated total time for the Extended Test and had been displaying 90% for far longer than was sensible given the time it took to complete the first 90%. The initial tests all said "pass." I forced a connection after a reboot and it connected and loaded data after my second attempt. About a minute after it finished loading the data, it spontaneously rebooted again. I don't know if it had attempted another connection because I wasn't looking at that screen, but as soon as it finished rebooting I disconnected the ethernet cable. I am guessing that if it has no way to attempt to connect to TiVo's servers then it won't make an attempt and maybe it will keep working until I plug the ethernet cable back in and it connects again. This is just a theory at this point, though, and time will tell if it keeps working for longer than a day without being connected to the internet.
     
  6. TishTash

    TishTash Active Member

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    Merrick, NY
    It’s a crap shoot. Once, it involved the SkIp function. Having TiVo turn it off resolved the issue (for a while).
     
  7. jeffsinsfo

    jeffsinsfo Member

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    Oct 15, 2005
    San Francisco
    I've been poking around on this site this evening and ran across a few posts mentioning how Western Digital changed their Red drives from CMR to SMR without disclosing it to consumers. Apparently the SMR technology is prone to early failure when used in environments with constant read/writes (such as a TiVo). Lo and behold it looks like the Red drive i bought last winter to do my upgrade is one of the affected drives. Could it be possible that I'm not having problems playing recordings and making new recordings but the daily loading of program data is triggering these reboots due to a problem with the hard drive? Do those daily updates always access the same area of the hard drive?
     
  8. Sarcasmic

    Sarcasmic New Member

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    Sep 2, 2020
    Chiming in...

    My tivo roamio plus has rebooted 5 times in the last 2ish hours... I have not modified the unit (hard drive) and I've noticed it happens when making the network connection and downloading new info. I also got the 1 day of programming info message once. It is ethernet connected and on software version 21.9.7v10-848-6-848. This just started today.

    I do run an ad blocker on my network so I don't get the preroll ads and I have disabled it and tried again but it still reboots on downloading.
     
  9. JoeKustra

    JoeKustra in the other Alabama TCF Club

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    Dec 7, 2012
    Ashland, PA...
    It's probably trying to download the new update, 21.10,1.v8 which is not that large. I would power cycle the box and perform a manual connection. It will perform a service connection within thirty minutes after a restart. Maybe you can beat the automatic update.
     
  10. Sarcasmic

    Sarcasmic New Member

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    Sep 2, 2020
    So I just did a manual reboot instead of just letting it reboot itself while downloading and this time it updated and shows software version 21.10.1v8. We'll see how things go.
     
    JoeKustra likes this.
  11. brobin

    brobin Member

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    Feb 14, 2014
    BTW, you can call Tivo and ask them to turn off the preroll ads and they'll be gone w/in 72 hours.
     
  12. TishTash

    TishTash Active Member

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    Merrick, NY
    Only if you stick to your guns. The overseas CSRs may be ignorant, but they’re also obstinate as well: They’ve obviously been instructed to play hard-to-give-in when it comes to pre-roll ads.

    That said, what does seem to work is what’s happening here: If you insist that the ads are causing your TiVo unit to reboot, they usually throw in the towel. If that does stop it, it’s a win-win!
     
  13. Sarcasmic

    Sarcasmic New Member

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    Sep 2, 2020
    I did, they fought back hard but eventually "gave in." They never actually turned them off but told me they had. After a few weeks I looked up how to do it myself and haven't had 1 since.
     
  14. Sarcasmic

    Sarcasmic New Member

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    Sep 2, 2020
    So my Roamio hasn't rebooted itself yet and we're around 12 hours later, woohoo!
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2020
    TishTash likes this.
  15. dglion

    dglion New Member

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    Dec 9, 2012
    Lake San...
    I have a Roamio Pro running software version 21.19.7.v10-840-6-840 and am having the same problem, short freezes then reboot. I called Support and told “Zack” the problem. He put me on hold for a few minutes, then came back and said he was having trouble accessing the system and would call me right back. That was 2 hours ago, not holding my breath on that call back. I have disabled the Skip function but it’s still rebooting.

    I have a Roamio basic running side by side with the Pro, no problem with it. Both have hardwire connections to the router. I hope they push a fix soon.
     
  16. brobin

    brobin Member

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    Feb 14, 2014
    How do you turn off pre rolls by yourself? When I asked they didn't quibble but I'd rath
     
  17. Sarcasmic

    Sarcasmic New Member

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    Sep 2, 2020
    With an ad blocker... I got the info from these very forums.
     
  18. jeffsinsfo

    jeffsinsfo Member

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    Oct 15, 2005
    San Francisco
    My recent attempts to trouble shoot the endless reboots:

    For the past week, I kept my Roamio disconnected from my network except for two times when I connected it to force guide updates. Each time it was reconnected, I would have to force a connection more than once before I would finally get one that would progress to actually loading the data versus hanging and then rebooting at the "preparing to load data" (or sometimes even "connecting") step, and I learned that I had to pull out the ethernet cable as soon as it started to load data or the TiVo would attempt another connection while it was loading and then I'd be back to square one.

    This morning I pulled the 6TB WD Red drive I had copied/expanded from the original 3TB Roamio drive late last year. I put the original 3TB back in, reconnected everything, and forced a connection. It worked properly the first time. I forced a second connection which completed successfully as well, though there was no need data to load. No reboots yet and it's been powered up and connected to my network for the past hour.

    Some odd things I noticed:

    1. Before forcing a connection with the original drive installed, it said my last successful connection was 5/20/20. This drive has not been in my Roamio since early December 2019, though, and the replacement drive had been successfully connecting post-May 20, 2020. I have no idea why or where that May date came from but given that the OS resides in memory on the Roamio, not on the hard drive, I assume this date was recorded somewhere in the OS.

    2. When forcing a connection with the replacement drive installed, I would notice that blue progress circle would occasionally pause/hang. Sometimes it would resume moving after a few seconds and other times a reboot would happen. With the original drive reinstalled, I do not see any pauses/hanging in the blue progress circle when forcing a connection.

    At this point, I am leaning towards thinking that the WD drive I used for the upgrade is the cause of my reboots. I bought the WD Red drive based on recommendations on this forum, but I think this was before it was widely known that WD had started using SMR technology in that line even though they were marketing them as suitable for NAS. I suspect this early hard drive failure is due to the unsuitability of this technology in an application like a TiVo. Or maybe I just messed something up during the expansion and the problem didn't show up for several months. I'm far from an expert on any of this stuff -- what I know I have learned by reading other posts in this forum or elsewhere on the internet.

    I have purchased a CMR drive and will attempt another copy/expansion and see where that leads me. Unfortunately there are many recordings from the past several months that are on the 6TB drive that I would like to keep, so I am going to be attempting the clone/upgrade based on that drive.

    I don't know whether any of the above will apply to others experiencing these frequent reboots, but if you put a different hard drive in your TiVo (even if you just used one of a small enough capacity that the Roamio could format it itself) you might want to see if the model number of your drive uses SMR or CMR technology.
     
    krkaufman likes this.
  19. jeffsinsfo

    jeffsinsfo Member

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    Oct 15, 2005
    San Francisco
    Thought I'd give an update:

    The Roamio successfully stayed on for over 24 hours with the original hard drive in it. No reboots following my forced connection.

    I cloned the upgraded hard drive to another one during those 24 hours. Things were looking good initially when I put the new hard drive in the TiVo. I forced a connection and it completed. I watched it during the process and at no point did I see that blue circle animation pause or hang. I watched a few seconds of a few different shows and they both played. Unfortunately, I went to play a third show and after a couple of minutes the video froze for a few seconds, then resumed for a few seconds, and then the box rebooted. So at this point I am still trouble shooting. I am attempting to run a kickstart 58 on the new hard drive since I could never get it to complete successfully on the other upgraded drive; maybe that will make a difference. But at this point a simple replacement of an upgraded hard drive is not making a difference (though it didn't reboot during the connection and data loading process like the other hard drive consistently did).

    So at this point all I know is that everything is working fine with the original hard drive but my Roamio is experiencing reboots when either of my replacement hard drives is inserted.
     
  20. jeffsinsfo

    jeffsinsfo Member

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    Oct 15, 2005
    San Francisco
    Update: I was able to leave the Roamio with the replacement hard drive connected to the internet for several hours yesterday without a reboot, so fortunately I was able to transfer a lot of shows. Unfortunately I not only had a reboot while it was still connected to the internet but I had a second one after it had been unplugged for over an hour.

    This morning I decided that since the new hard drive is 2TB larger and I'm not likely to mess up things more than they already are, I put that drive back in my computer to expand it to its full capacity using mfsadd/mfsaddfix. After that I put it in the TiVo and as soon as it booted up, it rebooted. I then decided to do a Kickstart 58. Just like before, it didn't complete this routine -- it just sat on "installing an update" for over three hours. I pulled the plug and restarted. That was 15 hours ago and it's been connected to the internet all day without rebooting. I've managed to pull more shows off the hard drive and so I not only deleted those from the Roamio but I also decided to just delete some things that are on TV frequently enough that it's difficult to justify saving several seasons of shows. All in all I probably deleted about 400 shows. I don't know whether the lack of rebooting will hold and, if it does, whether it's due to me pruning the shows, me having a lower percentage of the hard drive full (now under 50% versus 68%), or whether it just took the new hard drive a while to "garbage collect" bad data cloned from the other hard drive. At any rate, I'm cautiously optimistic at this point since this is the longest my Roamio has gone without rebooting (without the original hard drive in it) for the past two weeks.
     

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