Tivo Sucks !!

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by ukaussi, Sep 7, 2006.

  1. ukaussi

    ukaussi New Member

    Jan 13, 2004


    Well ya just did so guess your snide comment is more infantile
  2. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

    Jan 2, 2004
    I guess if that makes you feel better ......................
  3. ukaussi

    ukaussi New Member

    Jan 13, 2004

    The whole idea is to ensure a broad specrum of views gets posted in the forums.

    I posted in the heat of the moment and apologize if I offended anyone but TIVO did the same thing to me just over a year ago to my series 2 box. It got hosed after a software upgrade so as I had spare time I copied the image from my other series 2 to the "allegedly" broken hard drive and it worked fine after that. This proved it was a software problem and not a hard drive problem.

    Then the other box got hosed and TIVO was persuaded after 3 months of discussions to exchange it.

    I am in the minority but most people with the same issue are persuaded that it is a hardware issue and they just blindly agree and pony up the money.

    My wife is having the BS from the manufacturer issue with her Range Rover in that it has been in the shop 40 days after only 8 months and the manufacturer just expects you to put up with it and dump the vehicle or trade it in at a huge loss. In this case Lemon Law is being persued as we are protected.

    So, sorry, I won't bug you all again unless I get other news.

    I may pull the drive and bring it into work to do a fixup on the file system manual using linux so we shall see.
  4. tmorehen

    tmorehen New Member

    Dec 25, 2005
    Actually, the fact that the image from the other Tivo works points to a hard drive problem, not a software problem. Most hard drive failures are in the form of weak bits, which are created during a write operation. That's why most Tivo failures occur after a software upgrade. Re-writing the operating system to the drive often reinforces the weak bit, fixing the problem, at least until the next software update.

    It's unlkely to be a software fault, as the image from the other Tivo should have the same software and the same fault. The two Tivo's should have had identical downloads - error checking virtually assures that.

    BTW what was your failure mode. Did booting stop with one of the standard errors that indicate unauthorized changes to system files?
  5. ping

    ping New Member

    Oct 3, 2005


    That proves nothing of the sort. Software upgrades often reveal problems with the inactive partition. Copying an image to that drive may again leave the bad blocks in the inactive partition.
  6. ukaussi

    ukaussi New Member

    Jan 13, 2004
    Well it does prove it because there have been a number of software upgrades since that time so the inactive partition at the time has been used since, most likely a few times and that TIVO is heavily used
  7. ping

    ping New Member

    Oct 3, 2005
    That also proves nothing, because not every bit of the boot partition is crucial to operation, but once you have a bad one that is, well that's when it gets stuck on boot (like yours).

    Sorry, but for it to have been a software problem, it would have had to kill all boxes (or all SD-400 boxes if it was a software bug that was confined to that hardware configuration).
  8. ukaussi

    ukaussi New Member

    Jan 13, 2004
    Sorry, I don't mean the actual software is bugged as everyone would be crashing etc. I mean the install program or procedure is poorly written so that when it installs it cannot deal with any issues
  9. MickeS

    MickeS Well-Known Member

    Dec 26, 2002
    It's been discussed here before, and I sort of agree with you. The only way to get around it would be to have the update program run a disck-check beforehand, and say to the user "sorry, the disk is bad, please replace it". Not sure if that's a better or worse alternative. I do know that the installation would take a lot longer.
  10. JYoung

    JYoung Series 3

    Jan 16, 2002
    Los Angeles
    Unless you run a diagnostic utility, you don't know if the hard drive is bad or not.

    My personal belief is that the failure rate has gone up due to the use of Maxtor drives by TiVo.
  11. greg_burns

    greg_burns Now in HD

    May 21, 2004
    If they drive detects bad sectors doesn't it mark them as such and not use them in the futrue. If you copy an image over top, it wouldn't use those bad sectors. Can harddrive self heal themselves, or do you need to run diagnostic software on it first.
  12. sommerfeld

    sommerfeld Lucky (?) 200 member

    Feb 26, 2006
    Sometimes; if the system overwrites a bad sector, the drive will typically substitute a good sector. But this only happens if the OS/filesystem/... is willing to overwrite that sector, and very often it will need the old (and now unrecoverable!) contents before it can write the new contents.

    So, in practice, sometimes you get lucky but most filesystems have critical blocks where a bad block means you get stuck, needing some sort of diagnostic tool to zero out the block and then prune out the damaged part of the file system.

    Clever filesystem design can make a big difference - for instance, Sun's ZFS will store multiple copies of critical metadata blocks. See "Ditto Blocks, the Amazing Tape Repellant", http://blogs.sun.com/bill/entry/ditto_blocks_the_amazing_tape ; as long as at least one good copy remains it can be used to repair the other copies.
  13. ukaussi

    ukaussi New Member

    Jan 13, 2004
    Sorry, not true as can be seen in many other electronics products used today.
    Every tried updating the firmware on a DVD player etc. Sometimes people get issues.

    We have 200 Blackberry users and not every 7280 takes the firmware upgrade

    NONE, of the SD-400's in the country are IDENTICAL, unless maybe they are brand new. Every one will be different due to the software previously loaded and how much stuff you have and season passes etc
  14. classicX

    classicX Don't scream.

    May 10, 2006
    Miles away...
    It depends on if the drive can do that. That's also something the OS can do.

    But that doesn't help when retrieving information, only when writing to the drive. Once a sector is marked bad (either by the drive or the OS), any new information will be remapped to a new sector. The information on the bad sector may or may not be readable without using a tool to repair, and even then it might not work.

    A hard drive diag tool might also....

    FUBAR the drive in the process! :eek:

    So it's not necessarily a software issue, it could've been just a bad write during the upgrade, a minute vibration affecting the write head, a corrupt upgrade file, or heck, even cosmic rays. If the data in the sector is wrong, it doesn't matter if the drive is good, there's nothing you can do.

    Which is probably why after a reload it began working again.
  15. bicker

    bicker bUU

    Nov 9, 2003
    With a mouth like that, y'gotta wonder how that little kid will grow up. :rolleyes:
  16. dazzlinblu

    dazzlinblu New Member

    Mar 15, 2005
    TIVO boxes OBSOLETE and they won't upgrade!

    I bought 3 Tivos since they began, I've been happy -- 2 with lifetime service, one with 3 years' service (this one still has a year and 4 mos. left), but I CANNOT USE ANY OF THEM if I want to see HIGH DEFINITION T.V.! I was told try selling them on eBay - because EVEN CUSTOMER SERVICE admits THEY'RE USELESS!

    I am going to report them to the Better Business Bureau as they should upgrade their equipment as opposed to telling you to sell your old equipment and buy a new DVR from them (for $199.00 for the box PLUS the cost of the service which is no longer lifetime service unless you catch them on a good day).

    When someone asks should i buy tivo? or is tivo good? i say DON'T BUY TIVO!!! DON'T DO IT, YOU WILL MOST LIKELY GET SCREWED -- at least cablevision upgrades your dvr when technology changes! thanks for listening, please be smart and DO NOT BUY TIVO!
  17. ebockelman

    ebockelman PR#6

    Jul 12, 2001
    I realize I'm feeding a troll here, but please do tell - How would you expect that upgrade to work?

    Are you reporting your TV manufacturer to the BBB for not offering an HD upgrade for those as well? Do you report your computer manufacturer to the BBB because technology moves on?
  18. webin

    webin New Member

    Feb 13, 2008
    I'm surprised someone with this level of intelligence was able to find and resurrect a thread from 2006. It's like Internet Fruitcake... old and moldy, but still being served up daily.
  19. visionary

    visionary HAVE BRAIN WILL USE!

    May 31, 2006
    Norfolk Va.
    Good point, what about the tv set you are using now to watch the Tivos? Isn't it also not going to work, where is its free upgrade then? You do realize they do plan to let the old Tivos operate the converters so it will work, it won't be an HD picture, but it was not before and you liked it to buy that many Tivos, so what is the problem???
  20. swinca

    swinca Menace to society

    Jun 19, 2003
    Jaw-ja y'all
    Yep, all of that on his/her first and only post.

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