TiVo Online Not Working Bolt+

Discussion in 'TiVo Bolt DVR/Streamer' started by buildersboy66, Aug 5, 2017.

  1. Sep 24, 2017 #21 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016

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    Neither in home nor out of home are working (both worked previously). In any event, the proper behavior for a piece of software that can't do its job due to network problems is to display some message to the user like "network problems prevent me from working". It doesn't do that.

    I don't have any simple bozo network problems : I do networking for a living.
     
  2. Sep 24, 2017 #22 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016
    Since I figured I might have a better chance debugging the problem myself vs reporting it to Tivo, I did a little bit of investigating. It appears (not certain -- could be a red herring) that the problem is in opening a WebSocket to online.tivo.com. Code seems to be generating the URL by concatenating two strings, however one of the strings has the value "//undefined" (like perhaps a comment left in the code somewhere??) so the resulting URL becomes "//undefined http://online.tivo.com..." which understandably fails to load.

    I see the error for this WebSocket open request in the JS console right at the time the streaming session fails to open:

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  3. Sep 24, 2017 #23 of 119
    atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    Rochester NY
    Well all I can tell you is it isn't system wide as it works for me. There appears to be a subset of people having issues as there are a few posts around about this. What that means is an unknown could be a problem with the specific TiVos, certain TiVo servers they are connecting too, some setting on the computers, some setting on their routers, or something else entirely.

    Regarding it being a bozo network problem, well you don't have a network problem until you do, I had to replace a switch that looked fine all the lights indicated everything was working ok, but the TiVo plugged into it had network issues, and other items (a receiver, computer, and Roku) did not appear to be having problems. Once the switch was replaced the issues with the TiVo (a base Roamio) were gone and yes I tried different ports first.

    If you want to decide it is a TiVo problem and not trouble shoot anything else, you might end up being right, but I would trouble shoot as much of your own stuff as you can - just cause you never know.

    Edit: I see you decided to do some debugging while I was typing this response. Interesting results. Hopefully it leads to other people having some ideas.

    Good Luck!
     
  4. Sep 24, 2017 #24 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016
    Well by "Bozo Problem" I meant the kind of thing you mentioned first (use wired not wireless, connect to the same switch...). I've tested for the problem on multiple machines in multiple network configurations. THe whole "must be connected to the same switch" folklore that you see from Tivo drives me nuts. You may as well shake a bunch of dry seaweed over your router. Total nonsense.

    Continuing the debugging : I captured the network traffic with Wireshark and noticed the Tivo client is issuing multiple name resolution queries (it tries NMB, LLMNR and DNS) for the name "undefined" so I think it is likely that whatever led to it thinking its peer's network name should be "undefined" may be the root cause. Confusingly, the client _does_ succeed in identifying the IP address for my Bolt, and successfully makes HTTP requests to it for things like its list of shows.

    Reading the network traffic was somewhat illuminating : tivo's client sends debug logging (in the clear, no less) to the mothership so you can get some idea of what it is up to.

    I tested the off-network case. It doesn't work, but it fails with a sensible error message saying that off-network streaming isn't supported. Perhaps I was dreaming when I had it working before, or was using a VPN, something like that.

    Anyway, the debugging continues..
     
  5. Sep 25, 2017 #25 of 119
    billygoatpig

    billygoatpig New Member

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    Well, now the Bluestacks Tivo app doesn't work anymore for me. So now I have no way to watch my Tivo from my computers. It only works with the app on a real, physical smartphone or tablet. I'm really beginning to dislike my decision to go Tivo.
     
  6. Sep 25, 2017 #26 of 119
    BobCamp1

    BobCamp1 Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't work inside or outside the home for me.

    And yesterday, outside the home streaming was intermittent.
     
  7. Sep 25, 2017 #27 of 119
    billygoatpig

    billygoatpig New Member

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    Aug 28, 2017
    I've got a NUC that's a few years old that runs a Plex server. It's never not worked inside or out of my network on any device, including computers and laptops. Is there something about streaming that's really hard to do and the Plex guys are just better at coding this stuff? Or does Tivo just not really care? This issue is mystifying.
     
  8. Sep 25, 2017 #28 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016
    I tested Thunderbird today in case it was a browser-specific problem. After a tussle to get Flash installed, it proved to have the exact same symptoms as Chrome. The JS console shows the exact same errors too : failed attempt to open a WebSocket to the host "undefined".

    fwiw one thing that could be different vs others here is that I have _two_ bolts on my network. In case you're wondering they both have the problem.

    I also tried rebooting the Bolt in case that helped.
     
  9. Sep 25, 2017 #29 of 119
    billygoatpig

    billygoatpig New Member

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    Aug 28, 2017
    I've rebooted my Bolt, rebooted my router, rebooted computers, used fresh Windows installs, and now not even Bluestacks is working on PC. Tivo does not want to send streams to anything that isn't a Tivo Mini, or an actual phone/tablet. It's incredibly annoying because when it was working it was incredibly convenient to be able to have TV on in my office on a spare monitor. Incidentally, this morning I used a VPN to sign up for Youtube TV, and since we only use our Tivos to watch TV (since pretty much every other device does a better job at other things like Netflix, Plex, etc), I'm now tempted to cancel Tivo, sell my boxes, and just go with Youtube TV. Tivo never seems to have it's **** fully together, and on top if this issue, the whole thing with Minis needing to be wired into the same router as the Bolt or you have to buy repeaters is pretty absurd. I'm kinda over it. How much longer can Tivo really be in this game anyway. Writing is on the wall, seems to me.
     
  10. Sep 25, 2017 #30 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016
    Unfortunately I live in a place where the network stations are not available any other way than OTA, so I need Tivo.

    Note that the thing about Minis/Bolts plugged into the same router is utter nonsense. I have minis and bolts in different locations 10 miles apart, working fine. Packets are packets. They probably do a latency/QoS test but if you have good WAN connectivity it passes.

    There is/was a specific issue with Tivo and IGMPv2 snooping on some switches. Possibly this is the origin of the router myth. I don't know the details but you can see evidence of it in switch vendors' knowledge bases -- they say to disable IGMP snooping on switches if you want Tivo to work because Tivo expects IGMP packets to be broadcast out all switch ports while somehow not tipping the switch snooping code off.
     
  11. Sep 26, 2017 #31 of 119
    BobCamp1

    BobCamp1 Well-Known Member

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    ... and last night, running the Tivo app on the Nox Android emulator worked fine (Bluestacks sucks). The night before, it was intermittent.
    It NEVER runs on a PC web browser anymore.
     
  12. Sep 26, 2017 #32 of 119
    billygoatpig

    billygoatpig New Member

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    Aug 28, 2017
    Thanks for the heads up. Just installed Nox and Tivo app and it's working! Let's see how long this one lasts.
     
  13. Oct 4, 2017 #33 of 119
    mcaaronice

    mcaaronice New Member

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    May 15, 2010
    Just got a Bolt, same problem with Tivo Online. Window pops up, but circle just spins. Same on Firefox as Chrome. Looked at the Chrome dev tools console and seeing the websocket error. Really wanted this to work, seems great!

    WebSocket connection to 'ws://undefined:1500/' failed: Error in connection establishment: net::ERR_NAME_NOT_RESOLVED
     
  14. Oct 5, 2017 #34 of 119
    JoeKustra

    JoeKustra in the other Alabama TCF Club

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    Ok this morning. BTW, I have flash installed but not enabled. It let's me know, but I don't need flash to check the guide.
     
  15. Oct 5, 2017 #35 of 119
    billygoatpig

    billygoatpig New Member

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    Aug 28, 2017
    Checked Tivo Online this morning out of curiosity. And behold! Something is different! Different in that it's even worse. Now I can't change my box. And even though I haven't been able to watch anything in My Shows, up to now I've at least been able to see My Shows. Now I just the message "Access all of your streaming videos and recordings here!". And there's nothing there. Has Tivo just given up on online?
     
  16. Oct 5, 2017 #36 of 119
    atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    Rochester NY
    I don't use online.tivo.com much but just did some tests and was able to stream shows from my Bolt to my PC without issue and also able to switch between my Bolt and base Roamio without issue (could not stream from my Roamio as my stand alone Stream is unplugged). I am using an older Win 10 PC and used the Chrome browser. Of course streaming is still not support for the Microsoft edge browser, but I could logon and view the My Shows list, the guide, could the Manage features, but could not switch to my Roamio, when I tried it appeared to switch but the My Shows list was still from my Bolt.
     
  17. Oct 5, 2017 #37 of 119
    sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    I have multiple TiVos and some are not online right now. It seems on some of the pages it defaults to the TiVo that isn't online and doesn't give me a drop-down to select other TiVos. On other pages it gives me a drop down to select the TiVo. This makes the site awkward to unusable.
     
  18. Oct 5, 2017 #38 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016
    I have spent some time debugging this (same exact console message and symptoms). Some additional info:

    Trawling back through the mess of promise JavaScript code (ugh...need to take a shower now...) I _think_ the reason it ends up trying to open a connection to a host named "undefined" is that the response to its earlier "slsServiceEndpointList" query sent to sls.tivoservice.com returns an empty object. Looking at the code, I think this is supposed to contain a list of servers to contact later, including the correct "Middle Mind" host name. Because that object is empty and the code that parses it does not cope gracefully with the empty response, the host name ends up as the JavaScript value "undefined". This is subsequently converted to a string and ends up in DNS queries which of course fail since there is no host called "undefined", at least not on my network ;)

    If you look at the other JavaScript console messages you'll probably see stuff about defaulting to the "DEV" environment (meaning it failed to get a server list so concludes you're a developer testing the code).

    Initially I thought perhaps the bug was to do with the horrible mess of promises, that they'd failed to deal with a case where one promise is resolved ahead of when it was on the developers machine (or behind). Basically a race condition that meant the server host name data didn't arrive until after the code that uses it. However, with more debugging I'm reasonably sure that isn't happening. Rather the Tivo sls service just returns a valid but empty response which is handled and results in the subsequent train wreck. As to why the response is empty I'm not sure. The only parameter passed to the request is the "tid" ID (I think this corresponds to the box you're streaming from). So either the box failed to resister something with the Tivo mothership, or Tivo has some systematic problem for example one of their memcached servers is bad (hence only some users see this problem).

    I'm going to take a deep breath and try reporting this to Tivo... don't hold out much hope since every single trouble ticket I've opened there has I think been closed by a Perl script pretending to be an AI bot...
     
  19. Oct 5, 2017 #39 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016
    Support ticket 07302854 created.
     
  20. Oct 5, 2017 #40 of 119
    dboreham

    dboreham Member

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    Jan 19, 2016
    I'm not convinced you need Flash at all these days (although the site code checks and warns if disabled). This based on the fact I see the site streaming with the HTML5 <video> tag.
     

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