Tivo - Lack of Innovation

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by stedmakr, Feb 8, 2010.

  1. innocentfreak

    innocentfreak Well-Known Member

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    I would say some of the companies are getting into it though. Look at the RVU alliance for example, where you can pretty much set up a central hub and any device in the alliance will be able to access that content.
     
  2. janry

    janry New Member

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    Isn't RVU Alliance led by a content provider (DirectTV)? TiVo is somewhat handcuffed by the content providers since they can set the copy protect flags.

    I have built my own limited video distribution system with a TiVo HD but with the movies locked by Comcast makes the content more limited than I'd like.
     
  3. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

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    the original statement was "significant chunk" - since we are talking tens of millions of dollars I though such a statement should be challanged. So anyone can backpedal to "they spent some money" and of course they did. But lets not forget the original opinion that the R&D on rating ads was taking significantly from other R&D which is completely unknown.

    yes Samo we know that, as you have pointed it out before. What is unknown is how much of the R&D budget is on the ad rating that TiVo does. is that also a small part of the R&D budget and thus covered by the small amount of revenue or is it a "significant chunk" of the R&D budget. That is the unknown data in this.
     
  4. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

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    this is the double edge sword TiVo faces. the broad market is not looking to spend a lot of money for a whole media system. The concept above could be and is done with HTPC but avaerage person finds that too complicated. Sadly many average consumers find the TiVo too complicated to hook up to broadband and install software on the PC etc.. TiVo also faces the chip problem - to keep costs down it can not get custom or early runs of chips from Broadcom. It designs to the limit of the chip and a cheap CPU and memory.
    The early radical thing TiVo did was to innovate the technique for recording analog signals to the hard drive with cheap off the shelf hardware. Digital did that advantage in as now you can lay the digital stream right on the hard drive with cheap off the shelf hardware and no patent needed. That was the big idea in the Moxi - lets make a purely digital play and make the design of the DVR way easier.
    TiVo has had a very hard time growing up past its early great idea for analog recording. The mainstream cheaper chipsets from broadcom are just starting to get functionality like flash that will allow TiVo to step up the features and look and feel. It will not be a monumental leap though as cost is still a distinct factor reigning in any maker of 3rd party DVRs. So TiVo failed to innovate early enough in digital recording and ended up at the hard end of the FCC and cable cards that are not 2 way. It now goes through the same pain with tru2way. Streaming and better whole house delivery of media both visual and audio would have given them a route to go while the digital untangled itself but at what cost. I would pay more for such features but I am not the average DVR consumer who hassles over hooking up the network to my DVR.
     
  5. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

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    better than replay and Digeo worked out ;)
     
  6. heySkippy

    heySkippy oldweakandpathetic

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    That last thing Tivo needs is that steaming pile of crap tacked on.
     
  7. janry

    janry New Member

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    Yep, we are a select group. We are biased towards technology. But, we are not typical. I am over 50 as are most of the people I socialize with. Most of us have plenty of disposable income, but very few of the people of this age group want or understand this technology. Younger people may want and understand it (but still I bet a minority of their age group), but they don't as often have the disposable financial resources.
     
  8. Jeeters

    Jeeters Registered Snoozer

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    They used to do this several years ago with the "Showcase" feature... It would inform you of new and returning series premieres, special TV events, listings of series premieres at the beginning of every TV season, etc. They slowly phased it out and the "TiVo Showcase" is now just advertising space.
     
  9. bschuler2007

    bschuler2007 Frustrated owner

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    Tivo is almost dead IMHO and is probably just resting on it's patents. The Xbox360/PS3 media features are sooo much better. In an age when a 12 year old can hook an Xbox 360 up to a home network in 1 afternoon and stream all formats of movies and music from his PC.. a $250 box with a monthly subscription that is full of annoying ads seems to me to be a huge FAIL.

    Don't get me wrong, Tivo currently has some neat features, and recording live TV it is still the best at.. but it cannot compete hardware wise with an Xbox 360. Plus it's considered legacy hardware or even unknown by the next generation of kids who cannot even understand it's use. I mean, why not just download your show or show's season without commercials and restrictions or just watch it online? And without the next generation.. it will quickly die.

    I think that is why Tivo is focusing more on becoming the cable companies DVR. It will allow Tivo to live awhile longer till it becomes increasingly obvious that it is as old school as a VCR is now, but just more annoying with ads.
     
  10. Mgalin

    Mgalin Member

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    I've owned several Tivo's over the years, all the way back to 1999.. I'm a geek and a tivo fanboy for years.. I'll continue to happily pay a premium for it.. For now, because generally, the experience and the UI are stupid proof.. Especially for OTHERS in my family. . But i'll tell you what changes the game in my mind..

    1 DVR for the house.. 1 Media hub, multiple view only devices.. Sorry, two tuners isn't going to cut it anymore. This was OK in 2002, but they gotta step up the offering to compete with U-Verse.. I have weekly fights with my wife on stuff that is missed.. that forces me down the Hulu route. And don't you dare tell me to get another tivo, pay for subscription, cable cards and the lack of collaborative scheduling.

    Conflict management SUCKS. We need visual representation of conflicts, on the guide. Like every cable other DVR.

    Streaming - I'm a big PyTivo user... If bluray players can stream content off UPNP, DLNA, Bonjour shares why can't Tivo.. Streambaby, Sorta.. the framework is there.. Poor execution..

    I really don't give a crap about Youtube, Podcasts and Weather.. I have a Pc for that, it's a better experience there. Everyone who's got a Tivo probably has a laptop in their lap anyway.

    Slingbox - Echostar is building slingboxes into their DVR's.. Crap... Cmon Tivo! You got the smart people working there to learn how to placeshift! Hulu wont' be free forever.

    Many of us have gotten really pissed off having to pay a couple hundred bucks to MOVE our lifetime subscription to upgrade hardware.. I did it for the S2 and the HD.. If you want people to pay for it and become profitable, you HAVE to differentiate from Cable. DVD/BluRay will be around for the concieveable future.. So why leave it up to those boxes to do this netflix/amazon thing! tivo making enough money on it? I'd assume probably not!

    I know all of you are going to flame me and say, get off the Tivo island and get a Media Center box... well.. Still, Tivo is still the easiest to use and is stupid proof! And i really don't want to patch my Tivo on a monthly basis and reboot it weekly.. so...

    Let the flames begin!
     
  11. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

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    so two tuners is not enough but the only solution you will take is a 4 tuner in one box TiVo? Do you think they will do that for the same price as a two tuner? Is sticking to just one DVR of any sort really worth the fights? heck stick a tuner card in the PC you watch Hulu on and record some shows with media center. Keep it simple and it will work just fine.
    I have written TiVo on this one - this is likely the single biggest improvement they could make on a TiVo
    second biggest improvement would be streaming of any show to or form a TiVo DVR.
    you have been around long enough to know TiVo makes no money on the hardware.
    well not sure about the netflix amazon thing - Tivo does do that - do you wnat them to stop it?

    and actually the newly configured Moxi with 3 room vieiwng and ability to record 3 things sounds like it is a perfect fit for you. the Moxi can also use play-on add in to display Hulu on your TV screen
     
  12. MickeS

    MickeS Active Member

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    I agree with the above posters about the lack of recording/conflict info in the guide. I don't really use the guide much, but when I do it would be great to have that. It's an odd omission by TiVo, IMO. Though I would refuse to call it "innovation" to put it in there, it's something that should have been added years ago. :)
     
  13. BigJimOutlaw

    BigJimOutlaw Well-Known Member

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    a) I said a "good chunk". b) I didn't say the data mining was taking away from other R&D. Trying to parse words into a silly argument over what a "good chunk" means is bad enough. You don't need to argue things I didn't say to boot. Like I said, relax and move on.
     
  14. innocentfreak

    innocentfreak Well-Known Member

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    I think if the price was reasonable say 499 like they marked the XL down to, it would be perfect. I would pay 499 for a 4 tuner TiVo with 1TB or 1.5TB drive. This would be about 80% or so of the cost of buying two Tivo HDs at least it was back when they were $300.

    The question after that would be would I get a 2 tuner TiVo for the second room or a second 4 tuner. Most likely I would go with the 4 tuner. Either way at this point I am dropping one TiVo so they wouldn't lose a sale from me.
     
  15. Mgalin

    Mgalin Member

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    I'm just suggesting that while the integration with Amazon or Netflix is cute, i don't think it's really a necessary part of their business model..

    If the Tivo streamed well, i'd set up a 4 tuner Media center box.. hell. If i could get a second tivoHD and not pay subscription and for 2 more cable cards , and collaborative scheduling. i'd throw down 300-400$ in a heartbeat. Guess that's asking alot..

    My workaround now, is PyTivo and Usenet/NZBs.. Ya know for legally downloadable content. *grin*..
     
  16. DocNo

    DocNo Member

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    Ah, but see Tivo can't manage itself. There is a program type between "save until I delete" and suggestions - guaranteed suggestions, or season passes to be deleted first that would be very useful for lower priority shows I want to ensure are recorded *if* I have free space, but they should also be deleted first, before other season passes I may have.

    In leu of that, give me a @^$#% free space indicator - make it a backdoor like the 30 second skip but for the love of god just throw the damn free space indicator in there already :rolleyes:

    and people complain about Apple trying to "boss you around"....
     
  17. heySkippy

    heySkippy oldweakandpathetic

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    My TiVo has a free space indicator. It's that number next to the Suggestions folder.
     
  18. steve614

    steve614 what ru lookin at?

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    ...or Recently Deleted, if you don't use Suggestions.
     
  19. innocentfreak

    innocentfreak Well-Known Member

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    Or you can also fire up something like KMTTG where it will give you an estimate of how much space is used.
     
  20. satmaster

    satmaster Member

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    Moxi is crap its just like the series3 it does not have video inputs so it only works with cable/ant No satellite.:thumbsdown:
     

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