Tivo Following AOL

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by markabtex, Sep 19, 2007.

  1. kmill14

    kmill14 New Member

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    Most huh? So you've surveyed (or seen a survey) for most people related to their DVR desires? If you can send a link to it, that would be great.

    I'm glad you wouldn't pay any money for any of the features mentioned above. I hope that $1.05 is well spent on something else. But there are many others who would (and do) disagree with you. This is a rediculous argument, and time will tell what people want.
     
  2. jayfest

    jayfest Not-so-New Member

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    OK, you're right that the most recorded shows are on the networks, probably because they still have far larger audiences than the cable networks (although the fact that cable networks repeat their shows more often might make it easier for people to catch them without recording them). But face it, the D in DVR stands for Digital, and since the cable company's DVR is integrated with their cable box (unlike the TiVo DVR), you're not going to be able to get one from the cableco unless you get the digital channels. It certainly doesn't make business sense for them to offer a separate recorder without the other cable box features. So, for people like you, the choice is easy. For many other people, however, the cableco DVR costs are not so much greater and there is a real decision to be made on whether the extra TiVo features are worth spending more money.
     
  3. c3

    c3 TiVoholic

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    Huh? "D" in DVR has absolutely nothing to do with "d" in digital cable. As for integrated box, TiVo started selling Series3 almost a year ago. I do get digital channels, in both standard and high definition formats.
     
  4. Billy66

    Billy66 Again with shoelaces

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    For you c3, the math is different. Don't you think your situation is more unique than mainstream?
     
  5. jcthorne

    jcthorne Well-Known Member

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    In Houston, Comcast just pushed its rates WAY up. An HD DVR now requires Digital package service at $53, HD service at $7, HD DVR service at $13 PER BOX and $8 for each outlet after the first. Premiums are now $20 Each.

    So even if you already have digital service, adding an HD DVR is $20 for the first box and $21 for each additional.

    With Tivo at $269 and falling, it does not take long for payback. The cost structures are changing. And like others in this thread have noted, I found I just did not watch much that was not available OTA in my area at better quality. CERTIANLY NOT $93 a month worth.
     
  6. Atomike

    Atomike New Member

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    When people are looking for a DVR, do they in droves ask for Swivel Search? Or would they want to save $5 or $6 per month?
    Redicuous? Maybe so - I'll take you word on that. But it's certainly not ridiculous.
    Out of curiosity, what are the numbers for Tivo's sold vs. Cable DVRs sold recently? I honestly don't know. Please enlighten us since you seem to be a statistical expert.
     
  7. jlb

    jlb Go Pats!

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    Burlington, VT
    Interesting thread. I feel compelled to add my $.02 to some of the discussion.....

    I currently pay $10/mo to Comcast to basically have the locals (I also get the Gold Channel, CMT, and some other access stuff). This works just ducky for my family. If I were to get a DVR from Comcast, I would have a huge increase in price. I would need to upgrade my service to something north of $40-$50, plus box rental, plus dvr fee (and possibly + the ComcasTiVo fee). Yes, for me, the choice is simple. I stay just as I am right now.

    Personnally, I go back and forth on this. I like the ability to stream my music and all. But if getting a HD DVR someday (be it Comcast or TiVo) means sacrificing the other features, so be it.

    But, my father-in-law falls into the "just want it to be easy" crowd. And you know what......He could not figure out how to set up a Comcast SP for 24 and Prison Break. He asked me to do it. And I was so used to the easy interface of a TiVo that it took me literally 15 minutes to do so. On TiVo, if I happen to see an (perish the thought) ad for another program and I think it sounds good, it takes me all of about 30 seconds to set up a SP on the TiVo.


    If I have a Comcast DVR, and I then set up 30 SPs, and then the box fails. I lose all of my programming and I would have to redo all of my SPs (see also above item). With a TiVo, I may have recovery options. For one, I am allowed to upgrade the hard drive on my TiVo, or make a backup image. If my HD fails, I have the possibility of swapping back in a HD with the image that holds my SP list. TiVo (or at least most) has the ability to transfer my programs to my PC. For my most favorite shows, if they queue up, I can transfer them and bring them back after a failure, or just burn a DVD. Can Comcast do that....no.

    As I said above, TiVo also has the easiest interface of any DVR out there. Give someone an opportunity to try both, and they would likely pick the TiVo for ease of use (at least IMHO).

    See above. I pay $10 and I am very happy with what I get.


    And let's not forget how big companies like Comcast hide information they don't want you to know. Now, I may not get this exactly right, so please update me if necessary......

    If I wanted to get HD from Comcast, they will come back and say you need a certain level of service and must have a proper Cable Box/DVR. But what they don't tell you is there are laws on the books (at lest for now) that state with the basic (or is it any) package that I have, they MUST pass the local hi-def channels in the clear along the cable line (or something like that....as I said, I may have my wording wrong). Sooooo, I could get a HD TV (still analog in my house) and as long as it had the right tuner built in, I could get the HD locals for free. If I did get a new TV right now, I could split my signal, send one wire to my S2DT and still record two analog channels but also have the other split go right to the TV and be able to watch HD live. All the while still only paying $10/mo to Comcast. They would have me believe that if I wanted to watch HD that I would need to be spending a lot more per month.

    Yuck.
     
  8. c3

    c3 TiVoholic

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    Probably, but many of my co-workers and family members have limited basic only. I bet that many consumers are not aware that the TiVo solution may actually be cheaper than getting a DVR from the cable company.
     
  9. jayfest

    jayfest Not-so-New Member

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    Of course the Series 3 is an integrated box. I never said it wasn't possible - I'm just saying that I don't think it's worth the cableco's time & effort to try to develop a special digital recorder for a person who is receiving only the analog channels, which is what the $17/month customer (who has NO box at all) gets.
     
  10. kmill14

    kmill14 New Member

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    Ask people in Comcast land in New England how much they save at $14 / month just for the DVR, not to mention the box rental fee etc that others have covered in detail. Feel free to ignore it, but in all areas, generic DVRs are not cheaper, and in fact may be more expensive than buying a new Tivo HD.

    I have a strong sense that you don't actually use a Comcast DVR, and more than likely have DTV and the new HR-20. You've really argued nothing other than the fact that you have some hidden knowledge about most people, that generic DVRs are always cheaper (when they aren't) and that Tivo doesn't really do anything different than those DVRs (when they do).

    So basically, you have no leg to stand on, and its pointless arguing with you about it.
     
  11. c3

    c3 TiVoholic

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    The cable company does not have to develop any special DVR. Their current DVRs work just fine. For $17/month, I get about 30 analog channels, the 30 digital equivalent channels (ADS), about 10 more SD digital channels, and 8 HD channels.
     
  12. yunlin12

    yunlin12 Tivonation Citizen

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    In San Jose CA, Comcast charges $11.95 for DVR and $7 for HD equipment, so if you want a HD DVR, you are out $19/month, or $680 for 3 years.

    Go with a TivoHD ($252 + $19 shipping on Amazon), get 3 year pre-pay, plus the $1.97 Comcast charges for dual cable cards, you are looking at $634 for 3 years.

    If you want a second DVR, Comcast will charge you $11.95/month extra. Tivo, with the MSD, only cost you $6.95 extra.

    Where is that "When cable and satellite companies are giving away their DVRs and their monthly fees are less than half of Tivo's" I hear so much about?
     
  13. riddick21

    riddick21 New Member

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    Maybe not swivel search but how about movie downloads, multi room viewing, transferring shows to an iPod, streaming music, streaming photos, tivocomeback wishlists, and better GUI over all. These are all major feature that add real value to TiVo. Tivo costs me an extra $3 dollars a month over the cable companies DVR. I think its worth it.
     
  14. lessd

    lessd Well-Known Member

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    For most people in the HD world it's record hours coupled with the ease of upgrading the internal Hard Drive, and ease of use that makes TiVo have a competitive advantage not the monthly cost difference. I personally know families who together own about 50 TiVos (about 10 are TiVo-HD), about 20 of the TiVos are using MRV, none of them use the TiVo-To-Go function none of them know or care about movie downloads, but 45 of them have had the hard drive upgraded. (All their HD units have had their Hard Drive upgraded) I may be representing a small sample but I think it does yield some useful information.
    (The Series 3 was way out of the price range people I knew would spend for TV entertainment and some of these people have a lot of money)
     
  15. riddick21

    riddick21 New Member

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    Thats a good point. Add upgradeable hard drives and eSata to my list of clutch features. Anyone who says a TiVo is the same as the cable companies DVR is a moron. For some people maybe they really don't care about the extra features and CC DVR is sufficient for their needs, thats a personal choice and i wont judge that, but to say that the cable companies DVR is the same as a TiVo is just stupid. They offer more than enough features to carry a slightly higher price than the CC.
     
  16. jayfest

    jayfest Not-so-New Member

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    I agree that there are many, many better features on the TiVo than on the cableco DVR, but I think there are at least two strong points the cableco has. One is the OnDemand service, some parts of which I've mentioned elsewhere, but there are also such things on there as a whole slew of exercise programs, shopping services and music shows that are not available elsewhere (TiVocast is a comparable service with a completely different set of shows, but obviously it is up to the individual which shows they would be interested in). The other is the often-repeated fact about not having to be locked into a particular piece of equipment. If the cableco comes out with a better piece of hardware, you can trade yours in for a newer model (although I suppose they could always raise the monthly charge for it). Someone who is not sure which choice they want to make could (assuming they don't have to upgrade their cable service) try the cableco DVR for a while and if they decide they would rather have a TiVo (or none at all), they can send it back with no further cost.

    BTW, I don't have first-hand experience on this, but I believe many cableco DVRs can handle external SATA hard drives to upgrade their size, can't they? That would largely eliminate that point as an advantage for the TiVo.
     
  17. jcthorne

    jcthorne Well-Known Member

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    Houston

    NO, for the Basic cable subscription price you get all the locals. Analog or digital (HD or SD). What you see depends on what TV you connet to it. Just like OTA. The cable company does not let you have a HD DVR unless you subscribe to the much more expensive HD Digital package and thus subsidizes the cost of the box in the $50 a month service fee. The HD DVR AS IS would be very useful for basic subscribers. Comcast is not about to give you one for $12 a month on a $17 subscription though. Its just like ala cart cable pricing. If the consumer could pick and choose exactly what they want rather than being forced to pay for what they don't, the cost to the average consumer would plumit. Alas, so would cable co profits and thats why they fight it so hard.
     
  18. jay_man2

    jay_man2 jay_man-also TCF Club

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    I disagree completely with the assertion that TiVo is following AOL. AOL saw an industry shift, and its customer base and even the supply chain shift with it, just like buggy and whip manufacturers and blacksmiths did with the introduction of the horseless carriage, and the whole industry infrastructure that gre up to support it. We don't buy modems anymore so we can use dial-up - we get a DSL or cable modem and routers, wired or wireless, to do what we need, and buy Linksys routers instead of US Robotics modems.

    TiVo may yet end up like the Newton, though. A pretty cool, innovative concept that caught on years later in another form (aka PalmPilot). Ahead of its time but unable to adapt to market forces, and a "wider" feature set of later products.
     

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