Time Warner: Do you really save any $$ by choosing Tivo over the cable DVR?

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by klrobinson999, Feb 6, 2011.

  1. mattack

    mattack Well-Known Member

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    But get *lifetime* subscriptions (which are tied to each box), and amortize the payment over however many months you actually use it. If it lasts several years, as typical, you can save money *AND* not be paying a monthly price.
     
  2. terpfan1980

    terpfan1980 It's Just TV TCF Club

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    I have lifetime on my boxes but paid an average of $500 per box and will be paying $4/month for each of 3 boxes. Math isn't my strong suit, but considering I was paying $16/month for the FiOS DVR, it will still take quite a while for me to really get anything that resembles savings out of my investment in TiVo equipment.

    The only real advantage to the TiVo equipment is that I can get 4 outlets per month for the same fee I had been paying for 1 Verizon supplied HD DVR, plus I have MRV (unless/until FiOS starts setting the CCI bit :( ), TiVo Desktop Plus, etc. Well, that and the fact that the TiVo boxes each have considerably more storage capacity over the wimpy available storage in the FiOS HD DVR boxes. (2TB, 1TB, and soon to be 2TB in my TiVo's compared to something like 250GB in the FiOS HD DVR box)

    But factoring in the costs of all of the TiVo boxes and the TiVo Desktop Plus software, the additional remote controls, etc., means I've spent money that will take a long, long time to even think of having gotten value out of. I hope that I'm able to use these boxes for 3 - 5 years and at that point I might really begin to think of the money I paid out as a bit of a bargain. :eek:

    $500 / 60 months = $8.33 a month per receiver just in equipment costs over that time, plus the $4/month per receiver for the cable card means $12.33 a month for TV service on top of the monthly subscription fees I pay to Verizon. Uh, yeah, bargain isn't the word for it.


    Honestly, I think TiVo needs to keep their fees down in the < $9 month range in order to keep their equipment cost competitive with cable and satellite providers, but right now their pricing seems to be much higher. Hopefully that will change over time. :up:
     
  3. klrobinson999

    klrobinson999 New Member

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    The $19.99 "deal" just seems ridiculous, doesn't it?
     
  4. terpfan1980

    terpfan1980 It's Just TV TCF Club

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    When you add in the cost of the cable card, definitely. For someone that is only using over-the-air it's not as bad, but then again someone just using OTA might very well be adding in a Netflix subscription, or be getting Amazon VOD or Blockbuster selections and that too starts adding up.

    Just sitting here this morning a reporter is doing a segment with a print reporter that cut the cord. The reporter that cut the cord lists paying for Hulu Plus, Netflix and other items and yet proudly talks of the savings he has over having paid for satellite service. I'm sure he has saved a good bit (he claimed over $1k per year in savings), but he also admits he lost out on most sports (ESPN) as well as missing out on a lot of programming that is on cable channels.

    Sadly in the modern era TV costs $$, it's a matter of how much anyone can/will tolerate. For me the $20/month TiVo fee was more than I would tolerate, though the math above shows what I have spent or will have spent over time.
     
  5. Stormspace

    Stormspace Electrocuted by TiVo

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    A few things. As long as you are getting one TiVo and not two, the experience you have with TiVo will ultimately be better than with TWC STB. You'll need a Tuning Adapter as well as a cable card. The TA should be free. Next, I always like to diversify my expendatures, so that one company doesn't have complete control of my environment. By using a TiVo, whatever you record on it is yours, so you don't have to experience loss of recordings because of a glitch in the main office or if their billing system disagrees with yours.

    For a few channels you'll be able to use TiVo to Go(TTG). But, on the negative side, you won't be able to use TiVo to Go on most of your channels. Time Warner sets a Broadcast Flag (CCI Byte of 0x02) on all channels but those mandated by law (Locals) to be unprotected. TWC equipment won't allow you to do this either, but if you are expecting to get that for movie channels it isn't happening.

    I'd also verify that the monthly sub is 12.95 and that TiVo isn't still doing the 19.95 per month "special" on all premieres.
     
  6. jayn_j

    jayn_j New Member

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    I'm actually paying $2 more a month with the TIVO replacing one of my two DVRs. When I replace the second one, it will cost me $5/month more due to TWC weird pricing. That's at the $12.95 rate.

    My issue was that I simply couldn't stand how TWC lobotomized my DVR over a period of 6 months, killing external drive support, favorites list, 30 second skip, etc. These were all features I had learned to rely on, so I was willing to pay a bit more to get them back.

    I didn't jump fast enough on the last $70 woot deal, so I'm waiting for it to roll around again.
     
  7. slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    You can buy refurb Premieres for $100 and get $12.95 monthly today, right from Tivo's website. Some people have been able to activate lifetime for $299 w/MSD on them too.
     
  8. terpfan1980

    terpfan1980 It's Just TV TCF Club

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    Not that I don't appreciate the deal I got from a fellow forum member here for the XL that I have (as I really did appreciate that deal), but if I had any clue at all that Woot would have offered up those $70 refurbs and they would have been eligible for lifetime, I would have skipped the second Premiere that I bought entirely and just gotten two of those Woot refurbs and done the drive upgrade myself. I paid more for my second box (regular Premiere with 2TB drive upgrade already done and lifetime already on it) than I probably needed to and that is part of what will make it take much longer for me to see anything that really resembles savings on switching to TiVo.

    The Woot boxes were a great deal, setting me back about $370 for a lifetime box plus the cost of a 2TB drive (about $60 after rebates and other credits that I had available to use when I bought it), definitely a lot less than the going rates for a 2TB Premiere with lifetime on eBay.
     
  9. HallWhite

    HallWhite New Member

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    I simply assumed HD was a requirement. I had an HR 10-250 for several years when I was with DTV the first time, but realized its days were numbered when DTV brought its new bird online to accommodate all of its new HD channels. After relocating and signing up with Time Warner, the main thing that kept me there for about three years was having Tivo. I kept waiting for the promised arrival of the new Direct Tivo, but finally ran out of patience and made the jump to DTV. I have been pleasantly surprised by their latest DVR, the HR 24.
     
  10. shwru980r

    shwru980r Well-Known Member

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    I think it's more accurate to say that you are echanging the cable box for a cable card, unless you go with basic cable.
     
  11. mattack

    mattack Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, didn't want to quote so much, but.. You're obviously also ignoring the better interface (if it is indeed better), and the fact that you have more tuners.. (I'm not sure if by 'outlets' you literally just meant cable cards, or that many separate Tivos.)

    But it seems to me you're saying you paid $16/month for THEIR DVR.. now you're paying $12.33/month.. so you obviously are saving even now.. It's VERY likely that they will last at least 3 years. It's the hard drive that goes bad usually, and you can replace that (out of warranty). [I actually had a hard drive _I_ added go bad recently.] But if the cable DVR goes bad, you're 100% sure of losing all of the programming.
     
  12. scandia101

    scandia101 Just the facts ma'am

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    Only on the surface.
    You get a $299 tivo and a year of service for $340 (not including tax)
    At the regular prices that would cost $454.xx
    With the $9.95 MSD rate it would cost $418.xx
    and if you could us the grandfathered $6.95 MSD rate it would cost $382.xx

    Saving roughly $42, $78, or $114 is not ridiculous.
     
  13. TheWGP

    TheWGP Hmmm...

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    The flaw in your math is the 299 price for the Tivo - even before the "promo" $99 pricing nobody was paying 299 for one. And the best route to go is still probably a refurb direct from Tivo for $99 with either 12.95 or 9.95 MSD if eligible. Of course, lifetime math > anything else if you amortize for 2 years or more. If one plans to stay with cable for the foreseeable future, a $99 Tivo Prem and a $299 lifetime = $398 for lifetime service, which is only, what, 58 bucks more than ONE YEAR of service according to your math above? When stated like that, it's not much of a comparison at all, in my mind.
     
  14. orangeboy

    orangeboy yes, I AM orangeboy!

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    The TiVo Payment Plan states otherwise. I'm not going to do what I usually do and quote the specifics. I'm tired of doing other's homework for them...
     
  15. scandia101

    scandia101 Just the facts ma'am

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    It's not a flaw at all. The $299 price is available now with a regular subscription rate. What happened in the past is irrelevant to anyone spending money on a Tivo today.

    As for refurbs, a lot of people don't want to buy someone else's reject.
     
  16. Robbdoe1

    Robbdoe1 Tivo Obsessed

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    IMHO: I agree with you 100% on that one.

    People talk of refurbs here like they are brand new units which they are not. You roll the dice and take your chances.

    Robb
     
  17. lamotte

    lamotte New Member

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    not really sure if u lose some money or not. i hated the dvr i had from comcast before moving and getting time warner in early september so far the only problems i had were getting the cable card installed properly it took a total of 6 visits . 3 were no shows and the first was awesome as the agent for time warner did not have my cable card as requested but spend about 45 minutes with me telling me horror stories of all the problems i would be having in the future.

    so far it has been great no problems at all so far good luck
     
  18. terpfan1980

    terpfan1980 It's Just TV TCF Club

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    I'll wind up with 4 different systems/boxes that will have a total of 8 tuners. At this point I have 2 of the boxes in use (a Premiere, and a Premiere XL) with M-cards. I have 2 more M-cards coming to go with another Premiere that I have and also to go with a Ceton InfiniTV card that I bought and have been waiting seemingly forever for. Yeah, a lot of TV.

    The Ceton card pretty much will win out on the monthly cost since it was $400 total with no monthly fees required. Assuming I can use it for the same period I used for the TiVos (estimated at 60 months, or, in other words 5 years) I'd be paying $6.67/month for the cost of the Ceton card. Add in the $3.99/month for the FiOS cable card rental and that goes up to $10.66/month compared to the $12.33 that I'd be paying for the TiVos.

    Hopefully all of these systems/devices wind up being usable for 5+ years in which case the monthly cost goes down for each additional month of service (assuming the FiOS gods don't jack up the costs for cable card rentals).

    In cable card costs alone I'll have gotten 4 outlets (systems/devices) each with multiple tuners. 2 tuners per TiVo box and 4 tuners in the InfiniTV card so a total of 10 tuners in the household able to record at any point in time. Yeah, that's a lot of TV. With just my daughter and myself in the household now, I probably don't need that many tuners (actually I definitely don't need that many). On the other hand, when my daughter moves out on her own later I'll probably wind up selling her the TiVo that she now considers hers. I'll be fair about the price for it and at that point I'll try to get another device that will cover my needs for the TV that would be losing the TiVo.


    Interface wise, I give the TiVo good marks but at the same time the HD interface is clearly not done. Feature wise -- with TiVo desktop plus -- the TiVo would currently beat the FiOS HD DVR boxes, and again, the TiVo boxes all beat the wimpy storage levels that the FiOS HD DVR boxes come with. In terms of recording content, remote scheduling and other features the boxes are about equal though.


    Personally I'm still of the opinion that the monthly fees for all of these boxes is still higher than it should be. $6 - $8 a month is the most a cable company DVR or TiVo should cost in terms of monthly fees. At prices higher than that customers start to question just how much the DVR boxes are really worth. Lower than that it seems a no-brainer to get the DVR and use it. Add in the idea that just about all of these DVR boxes come with advertising on them in some way, it seems the monthly costs should be even lower still.


    Anyway, I like the TiVo boxes and am glad I got them, but to be fair I seriously thought about just grabbing Media Center Extender boxes or just using the Xbox 360 boxes that I already have in conjunction with the Ceton card. The costs would certainly have been very competitive, but in that particular area I do think the TiVo wins, especially since my daughter was already very familiar with it.
     
  19. jayn_j

    jayn_j New Member

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    Sometimes true, sometimes not. TIVO provided a trial period where the unit could be returned. The vast majority of these units fall under the catagory of "Try it you'll like it. Sorry, nope."
     
  20. orangeboy

    orangeboy yes, I AM orangeboy!

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    Can you share where you found this information please?
     

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