The Free Space Indicator Thread

Discussion in 'TiVo Suggestion Avenue' started by Samsara, Jan 12, 2002.

How Important is This to You?

  1. It's so important that I'd pay extra for it.

    158 vote(s)
    9.1%
  2. It's important but I wouldn't pay extra for it.

    1,307 vote(s)
    75.5%
  3. Not important, but I'd probably use it if it was free.

    219 vote(s)
    12.7%
  4. I'd probably never use it one way or the other.

    46 vote(s)
    2.7%
  1. Jun 3, 2003 #141 of 297
    martinp13

    martinp13 Roller coaster addict :)

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    hub: at this point, I would be happy with something like that. It would shut up the pro-FSI rabble (I'm kidding, guys... honest! :)), and be almost the minimum of effort on TiVo's part. ;)
     
  2. Jun 5, 2003 #142 of 297
    DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    I don't really care what form the FSI takes as long as they put one in there. I really only need one to tell me how much space is used up "right now." I understand that this is never a true indication of free space due to scheduled recordings in the To Do List but for my purposes, all I want to know is if it is time to watch something that has been saved for a while or find a tape to dump some stuff to. As with most people, I am a procrastinator and will put off these tasks to the last possible minute. So I count up the total hours used on my NP list. I look in the To Do List to see how much will be recorded and the have to determine if there is room or if something will have to be pushed. Then I decide if there is anything I can delete, whether there is anything I can watch or whether I have to dump something to tape. I find myself doing it on a pretty regular basis.

    Bottom Line: How many people have to go through their Now Playing list on a regular basis and count up the total hours used? (wouldn't it be nice if there were some way to show the duration of the program on the main NP screen rather than going into each program to find out how long it is?)
    I would bet I am not the only one. For my needs, it would be great if there were a simple "gas gauge" type FSI that said how much space was used up right now.
     
  3. Jun 5, 2003 #143 of 297
    Ereth

    Ereth Unemployed Bum

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    Turn suggestions on. Take a piece of paper and write, in nice clear text: "The amount of free space you have available RIGHT NOW is: 0" and tape it to the bottom of your screen.

    It'll be right within about 2 days, and be correct 99% of the time thereafter, and it didn't take any effort on Tivo's part.

    Wow, this thread has been going for over a year. I should've made this suggestion sooner!

    :D
     
  4. Jun 6, 2003 #144 of 297
    voripteth

    voripteth User Advocate

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    Apr 9, 2003
    Since there isn't a Free Space Indicator, perhaps we can find an easy work around using existing functions.

    1) Turn on Suggestions. (Wait a few days if you didn't have it on before)
    2) Observe how many suggestions are saved. When suggestions drop close to zero you are out of free space.
    3) Sort the Now Playing list by expiration or record time. The oldest programs will disappear first.
    4) Watch or archive the oldest programs.

    Done!

    (See? You didn't need a FSI after all! ;) )
     
  5. Jun 6, 2003 #145 of 297
    beejay

    beejay Member

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    Oops. 4.0 took away sort by expiration. See, we do need FSI. (And sort by expiration).

    (I've seen a posting of FSI available if you have backdoors enabled on 4.0. It looks like it has what we need, if only it didn't add up to about 120% of disk space. Maybe it will be made available in the next release.)
     
  6. Jun 6, 2003 #146 of 297
    gayste

    gayste Love TiVo!

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    That's exactly how i do it. Just keep track of the suggestions and when there are almost none I know i have to start worrying :)

    Steven
     
  7. Jun 6, 2003 #147 of 297
    DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    You guys amaze me. Do you think this thread would have been going so long if people were content with such a backwards work-around for this issue? Sure, that is a way to fill up your disk with crap that can be deleted but it still doesn't tell you how much free space you have. You still would have to either count up the total hours used by recorded programs or the total hours used by suggestions. Besides, I haven't yet seen anything on the Suggestions that I would want to watch so I prefer to keep them off.

    In my opinon, the purpose of this suggestions forum is not for people to suggest a jerry-rigged way to get around the lack of a feature in the software. The purpose of the forum (IMO) is for TiVo users to get together and gripe about things they wish TiVo would add to the software or hardware in the next version. Hopefully TiVo uses forums like this as a way to get free market research and to find out what their users really want.

    If a poster asks for something that is already available, then the forum should point him in the right direction. But if a poster simply makes a request or a wish for an enhancement to the TiVo software there is no reason for people to continue to make the same lame suggestions about how that poster could get by without the enhancement if he is willing to do such and such.

    Just an opinion. I would like to see the forums have a useful purpose and that is providing feedback to TiVo on what active users of their product would like to see "fixed." But every time someone comes back with an unsactisfactory work-around, it simply says to TiVo that this enhancement isn't necessary because people are willing to accept a mediocre substitution.
     
  8. Jun 7, 2003 #148 of 297
    vegaspl

    vegaspl Tivo'er since '99

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    West Hills,...
    Wow......

    I couldn't have expressed it any better!!!!:up:

    In all the years that I have been following postings on this feature being requested, not once have I seen any response from TiVo. At least they could express WHY it cannot or will not be added.:(
     
  9. voripteth

    voripteth User Advocate

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    Apr 9, 2003
    I don't work for TiVo but I can give you three reasons why they won't touch this feature:

    1) There is a simple work around by watching the number of suggestions.

    2) There is no single solution that will make everyone happy. Look at the number of different solutions proposed.

    3) Potential of giving misleading information. Without a FSI, TiVo has some wiggle room when freeing space. Adding FSI may cause additional complaints when someone's program gets deleted when FSI showed there was room.

    Of course on the other hand this could be a wonderful thing to release as an "undocumented feature". People could use it if they were willing to take the risks of it not being perfect.

    While we're waiting for them to add this undocumented feature, take a look at reason #1 again.
     
  10. beejay

    beejay Member

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    Richmond, IN
    I think your initial assertion is incorrect. We have seen screen shots of an FSI that is available in 4.0 with backdoors enabled. Clearly TiVo has spent some effort to give us some measure of disk space in use for various types of recordings.

    Now, maybe it will disappear like advanced wishlists, but I don't think it's accurate to say they won't touch this feature.
     
  11. vegaspl

    vegaspl Tivo'er since '99

    169
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    Feb 20, 2001
    West Hills,...
    How wrong can one be!!!! I'll address each of your so called reasons...

    1) There is a simple work around by watching the number of suggestions.

    Not so "simple"... especially for those of us who have upgraded to larger capacity. I get frustrated when the only alternative is to add up all those times. BTW... If you think that those of us who have upraded are in the minority..... read the article in the current issue of Time entitled "You can Hack it"

    2) There is no single solution that will make everyone happy. Look at the number of different solutions proposed.

    Those "different" solutions are only being proposed hopefully to indicate to TiVo that almost "Any" kind of alternative FSI would be better than none. You are assuming that just because someone suggests one method, that does not mean they would not be happy with a compromise.

    3) Potential of giving misleading information. Without a FSI, TiVo has some wiggle room when freeing space. Adding FSI may cause additional complaints when someone's program gets deleted when FSI showed there was room.

    Easily covered by a simple disclaimer of sorts indicating that the figures shown are "approximate"
     
  12. voripteth

    voripteth User Advocate

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    Apr 9, 2003
    Although I keep trying to refrain from responding to this thread I'm drawn in one more time...

    I don't quite fathom what is complicated about watching the number of suggestions. If the number of suggestions drops below ten (or whatever threshold suits you) then you are running out of space. Simple! Granted it is just a crude estimate but I offer it as a workaround until TiVo acquieses to the eventuality of including a free space indicator.

    As for the multitude of suggested implementations for FSI, apparently TiVo has already included something that is available via a back door command. Hopefully someone who can access this command will post some details here!
     
  13. DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    No one said it was complicated. It is simply a matter of convenience. If you use the suggestions method, you still have to count up how many there are.

    Maybe you didn't read my previous post but I don't think most people are content with such a "crude workaround." In my opinion every time someone suggests using a crude workaround rather than adding a constructive, software-based solution they are simply telling TiVo that this issue isn't a priority because their dumb customers are content with a "crude workaround."

    If some sort of FSI is not a priority for you, the way you use your TiVo, fine. But I think it's counterproductive to continue to suggest that it isn't important or there is some sort of workaround. I would think we would all like to see TiVo implement ALL the common suggestions in this forum. I don't think we need to try and shoot down the validity of any suggestion made by a poster in this forum.

    Bottom Line: While I love my TiVo and am very pleased with almost everything about it, I think there are a ton of small improvements that could be made to the software/interface to make it even better. With the many other PVR options that are beginning to emerge in the marketplace, I would think TiVo would do everything they could to make their customers 100% happy with their machines since word-of-mouth is still the best form of advertising.
     
  14. vegaspl

    vegaspl Tivo'er since '99

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    West Hills,...
    Being a Probabilities Analyst and Professional Gambler, I would lay 2 to 1 it won't be! :thumbsdown: :( I DO hope I'm wrong. There have been many many releases since I have been a TiVoer without anything even resembling an FSI. Can no longer be optomistic.
     
  15. BrettStah

    BrettStah Well-Known Member

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    Well Paul, at least now there apparently is some sort of FSI available as a backdoors feature, so they have done some work on the feature. Who knows if/when they'll polish it enough for full implementation though...
     
  16. HTH

    HTH No Avatar Selected

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    Why bother adding them up? Whether you have 20 or 200 hours free shouldn't matter to you. That you have enough for what you want to schedule should be enough knowledge for anyone other than someone who has an obsessive need to know every little detail about something, no matter how useless the information.

    And surprise, TiVo tells you this as you schedule the recording! It tells you either that you have the space or what needs to change in order to make the space. And does a much better job of it than you could by looking only at what space is free right now.

    Your only problem is that you can't be bothered to mark recordings you want to keep as recordings you want to keep. Expired space is free space, dammit!

    Have you considered that a simple FSI is misleading because it is insufficient to explain why something gets deleted? And how many people won't know what the word "approximate" means ("That word's too long, an' it's got one of them ekses in it")?
     
  17. vegaspl

    vegaspl Tivo'er since '99

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    West Hills,...

    OK HTH....Among other reasons, consider this....

    With Multi-TiVo's (I am sure there are more and more of us), many times I have to decide where to place certain recordings. SP's; PPV's; Movies off rented DVD's; etc.

    Frustrating when I set one up, only to have TiVo tell me there is not enough space. Knowing at a glance which TiVo's have what space available would make it so much easier to properly allocate.

    I realize this particularily may not be a common problem, but I mention it just as an example.
     
  18. BrettStah

    BrettStah Well-Known Member

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    Paul, what if at a glance one Tivo had 10 hours listed as "free", and another only had 5 hours? Then you go to put your new wishlist, season pass, etc. into the schedule of the Tivo with more free space, and find out that the Tivo with more free space right now is going to fill up by the time your show comes on, while the other Tivo, it turns out, won't?
     
  19. beejay

    beejay Member

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    At least he had the information available easily, rather than adding up the space suggestions took up to get less accurate information with more effort.

    I have a speedometer in my car, evidently because I'm

    I could exchange it for an indicator light that just flashed when I was exceeding the speed limit, but that's the kind of obsessive guy I am. ;)

    And I'll take the 2-1 bet that some sort of FSI will be generally available in version 5.0.
     
  20. BrettStah

    BrettStah Well-Known Member

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    There are 3 things that are used to determine when you'll run out of space.

    1) Total capacity of the Tivo (we get this now in System Information).
    2) Current space usage (some disagreement on whether this should include suggestions and/or expired shows).
    3) When the upcoming recordings (aka To Do List) will cause the Tivo to fill up the remaining space, causing things to be deleted or not recorded due to lack of space.

    Some seem to just want the second item. Others feel the third option would be preferable. Others are content with the current system. I'd prefer we get the second and third, with the third being much more useful to me.
     

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