Straight up...difference in Base Premiere and Premiere XL?

Discussion in 'TiVo Premiere DVRs' started by cmshep222, Jan 26, 2012.

  1. cmshep222

    cmshep222 Member

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    The facts seem very shaded here. The XL has the 1TB hard drive and a glow-remote...I get that. And after that, the XL is THX certified...I get that too.

    But does that mean better hardware (processor, RAM, video card)? Or is the actual hardware the same (besides the hard drive space)?

    I'm looking to buy a 2nd Tivo for our house (1st is a Tivo HD) ...but if it's really just glow-remote and bigger hard drive...I'll buy the base Premiere for $72 bucks on Amazon, vs $248 for the XL.

    Hoping this group has some insight here!
     
  2. atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    As far as anyone has been able to tell other than the hard drive the hardware is the same in the Premiere and Premiere XL.

    Also just for reference it is very easy to upgrade the Internal hard drive of a Premiere.

    Good Luck,
     
  3. rainwater

    rainwater Active Member

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    Although hard drives are quite expensive right now but they should be coming down soon hopefully.
     
  4. yoheidiho

    yoheidiho Member

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    Just get the Premiere. Put the difference in $$ toward a 2 TB drive upgrade and don't look back!
     
  5. g_stewart

    g_stewart New Member

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    ...and the XL has the "XL" plastic logo thingy on the front.

    I like to think that alone makes it the BMW of DVR's, as I sob quietly over how much extra money was wasted.
     
  6. vurbano

    vurbano Member

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    Better yet buy a used one and upgrade the drive
     
  7. crxssi

    crxssi Veteran TiVo User

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    As others have said- the two boxes have exactly identical hardware in every way except hard drive model/size. The difference in price for the $25 more hard drive space and a remote that most people would want to replace with a Slide remote, is just insane.
     
  8. rainwater

    rainwater Active Member

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    How is it insane? You don't save a great deal by doing a DIY hard drive upgrade. Not everyone wants to or is able to upgrade the hard drive. And TiVo is basically charging about $150 for the upgraded drive. That isn't even that much more than you can get a drive right now. I think they have it priced pretty reasonably considering. And like I have said before, the Premium Glo is perfectly fine for most people. In fact, it is a great remote compared to most TV and cable company remotes.
     
  9. crxssi

    crxssi Veteran TiVo User

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    I look at it much differently. The XL is $200 more (three times the contract cost). The difference in price between the drives in the two models was about $25 or something (when I looked).

    Analogy- let's create a car named the Rider. Base price, $20,000. Now we will add to the features of the car, a gas tank that holds a lot more gas than the regular model and call it the "Rider XL" (and throw in some fuzzy dice for the mirror). Price? $60,000.

    Fuzzy dice.

    The stock (non-"Glo") remote is also perfectly fine for most people and is a great remote compared to most TV and cable company remotes. But one who is willing to grossly overpay for a unit is probably not "most people". One would think they would at LEAST add in their top of the line remote with such a model.
     
  10. rainwater

    rainwater Active Member

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    I don't see how the difference matters when you have to buy a new drive if you buy plan on upgrading. DIY is always cheaper but the price they are charging is not that ridiculous all things considered. If I was recommending this to anyone in my family, I would recommend the XL because I know none of them has to ability or patience to install a drive. Well worth it in my book. For me, I would never buy the XL because I have no problem updating the drive myself.
     
  11. unitron

    unitron Well-Known Member

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    Don't forget the Rider XL comes with THX certification, I mean, mag wheels.;)
     
  12. Series3Sub

    Series3Sub Well-Known Member

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    Well the THX certified S3 used a higher bit rate for analog to digital conversion compared to the subsequent HD. One would presume the higher bit rate was also used for the HDXL. The higher bit rate for encoding results in a better quality picture.

    Also, still regarding the THX certification, a post a few years ago from someone who did open the S3 and HD boxes because he was bothered by the apparent inferior analog to digital of the HD, but not because of bit rate. Anyway, what he determined, if I remember correctly was the the S3 had separate chips for encoding the analog to digital, and the HD used a common chip.

    Of course that was for the Series 3 platform, but it makes this point: supposedly, the THX certification means that the unit meets THX standards for the best possible video and audio. I have no doubt the XL's have some things in them to do indeed result in superior quality, but the question is how appreciable is this higher quality in real world viewing of content on the TiVo? Even the inferiority noticed by that long-time-ago poster was one he admitted that not everyone would notice, but mostly the discerning eye or if Joe Blow did notice, he probably wouldn't care and enjoy the shows anyway. Now, let's assume the Premiere XL does, indeed, truly perform at a higher level meeting the THX standards (whatever those really are; the current definition just means that it is superior to the non-THX version), but is this worth hundreds of $$ extra? That is something for each to decide, especially since most people probably could never tell the difference or if they did, may not see it as so inferior as to ruin the experience and they would rather save the hundreds of dollars. A wealthy, picky, tech dude who can really see the difference just might pop for the XL, but his has plenty more $$$ from where that came, not always the case for the rest of us.

    The old legend that the Sony Betamax was superior to VHS is true ON PAPER, as Betamax did handle the audio a bit better with ever so slightly less wow and flutter and I believe provided for about 5 more lines of resolution and Sony's more convoluted tape path probably provided for better isolation. OK, yeah, I guess Betamax MEASURES superior on paper, but those extremely minor enhancements just CANNOT be appreciated (noticed) by mere human beings. For all practical purposes in real world viewing, the Betamax and VHS could be seen as being IDENTICAL, not being able to tell the difference between them because the heart of the matter was that they were 1/2" 240 (Sony 245, me thinks) lines of horizontal resolution videotape systems, both victims of their tape size and, hence, lines of resolution and, therefore, indistinguishable in terms of judging one or the other as superior quality. We used to set them up both side by side and NO ONE could tell the difference.

    If we presume the Premier XL has similar or other enhancements as the The S3 and HDXL, then THX certified TiVo's seem to be matter of finer points rather than significant quality differences. So, if one is considering an XL, they are better off considering it for the larger built in HDD, especially if they aren't tech oriented and aren't comfortable performing their own upgrade or paying for one at Weaknees, for example. Then, of course, there are those who like the status of the "XL" and "THX Certification."
     
  13. unitron

    unitron Well-Known Member

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    Not to mention the cool THX opening video clip.:D
     
  14. crxssi

    crxssi Veteran TiVo User

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    Um, no. Mag wheels would be a REAL feature.

    THX certification would be the same as a window sticker saying "yep, the claimed miles per gallon for this model car was actually tested to be true", even though both models are identical engines and MPG.
     
  15. crxssi

    crxssi Veteran TiVo User

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    I actually very much doubt there is anything physically different in the two. And like you said, even if there were (which is very improbable), I doubt anyone would ever notice.

    FUZZY DICE
     
  16. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    Yes, it just means that TiVo payed the money to THX to get that model certified. The lower model could probably get THX certification as well but it would cost extra. There are many products out there that are as good or better than THX certified products, but they are not THX certified since the manufacturer did not pay the certification cost. I have no idea what that additional cost is though.

    In real world use I've never noticed a difference in audio or video between my regular Premieres and my XL and Elite Premieres that are THX certified.
     
  17. jpcamaro70

    jpcamaro70 Member

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    I love the analogy but must disagree.

    Look at the basic premiere as a loss leader and the xL as the true cost. Most people go with the base premier (I assume) so they'll be competitive here, get more subs. Base products are always the losers or short gainers, these companies need the upgraded products to make money.

    Look at Apple iphone 16gb is 199, 32 is 299, 64 is 399. Does it really cost $100 for 16gb of memory?

    Plus, the cost of a 1TB drive is 200 or more DIY, plus your time.
     
  18. crxssi

    crxssi Veteran TiVo User

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    Exactly my point. The higher models are a rip-off. We all know it doesn't cost that much for extra memory.

    Actually, it is $150 and maybe 10 min of time (see dvr_dude on ebay) for 1TB or $190 for a 2TB (which would be DOUBLE the size of the XL). And that is only because drive prices are temporarily, grossly inflated over the last few months.

    But those are after-model costs. I was only talking to the absurd, 700%, extra, bonus profit that TiVo gets by charging $200 more for $25 of storage (the difference in THEIR cost for the drives) (Oh yeah, and maybe $5 more for the upgraded, non-top-end remote, and $1 for the THX certification "feel-good").

    512GB drives, like that in the Premiere non-XL, are joke now. It has been two years since the introduction of the Premiere and the low-storage model does nothing to further TiVo's position as a leader. As I have said in other threads, several times, TiVo needs to drop the Premiere non-XL and just have two models: The Premiere Elite, and the Premiere XL (at the Premiere non-XL price) and bundle the Slide Remote with it (or just the standard remote and leave THAT for an upgrade).
     
  19. Shanezam203

    Shanezam203 Member

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    what's that internal 2tb drive cost? and shipped with Tivo software so it's plug and play.

    Thanks,
    Shane
     
  20. crxssi

    crxssi Veteran TiVo User

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    That information is in my last post, right above yours.
     

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