Star Trek: Discovery - S3 E11 "Su'Kal"

Discussion in 'Now Playing - TV Show Talk' started by martinp13, Dec 24, 2020.

  1. martinp13

    martinp13 Roller coaster addict :)

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    Welp! Show's over, no POSSIBLE way they can come back from this setup. :)

    At first I thought the monster was the kid, then I thought the monster was his mother. Now I don't know what to think. What a mess.

    Some random thoughts:

    1) Please don't let Adira turn into the next Wesley. I know the show wants to use them, but dang.

    2) Not next episode but in the near future, does anyone else think Saru will be removed from his captaincy, due to his ability to be so easily distracted by other Kelpians? Because that means we get Captain Killy!! :)
     
  2. cwerdna

    cwerdna Proud Tivolutionary

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    LOL! Indeed. These shows are always so predictable when it comes to such things.

    I wasn't a huge fan of this ep until near the end. However, at least it feels like a Star Trek ep.

    Was kinda funny to hear them try to end or exit the holoprogram.

    I wouldn't want a Captain Killy...err... Tilly.
     
  3. kdmorse

    kdmorse Well-Known Member TCF Club

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    I may have to watch this again to have a different opinion.

    But I honestly don't think it's possible to have come up with a stupider, less engaging cause for The Burn than a scared grown up child facing his own fears in a holodeckish simulation on a dilithium planet.

    I mean, someone please tell me I somehow misunderstood the entire episode and it wasn't *that* dumb? Please?
     
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  4. Rob Helmerichs

    Rob Helmerichs I am Groot! TCF Club

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    OK, you somehow misunderstood the entire episode and it wasn't *that* dumb.

    Are you happier now?

    ;)

    (Ironically, I thought the stupidest possible cause for the Burn was Burn-ham. Until today.)
     
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  5. kdmorse

    kdmorse Well-Known Member TCF Club

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    Just to make sure, I went and read some reviews/recaps of the episode. They were, not kind. But at least some of the shots made me giggle:

    "Plus, if you had “the Burn was somehow triggered by a radioactive Kelpien child who lives in the holodeck version of Plato’s cave” on your Discovery Season 3 bingo card, well – you’re a smarter viewer than I am."
     
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  6. JYoung

    JYoung Series 3

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    (Lowers head. Lifts hand to forehead. Shakes head.)

    Ugh, the kid caused the Burn?
    Really???
    Really???

    And I thought that pulling the new and improved Guardian of Forever out of their unmentionables was bad.

    What's next, Gary Mitchell and Q ride in to the rescue?

    And if Osira could just beam in shock troops through the shields just like that (which is a security hole big enough to drive a starship through), why didn't she just do it when she first warped in?

    Quite honestly, not only does this episode make no sense, it's a rehash of Future Imperfect.

    Being born on a planet full of radioactive dilithium gave him powers and abilities far beyond other Kelpiens.

    :rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2020
  7. Rob Helmerichs

    Rob Helmerichs I am Groot! TCF Club

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    Wouldn't it be sweet if there were a Trek-appropriate meme for that? :D
     
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  8. Bruce24

    Bruce24 Active Member

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    I agree. As soon as they realized the ship wasn't federation, she should have jumped discovery back to Starfleet, finished repairs and come up with a plan on how to best get the crew back. Instead she gives a nice FU speech to Osyraa and then minutes later is forced to give her the ship.
     
  9. morac

    morac Cat God TCF Club

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    A lot of stuff made no sense.

    - Discovery doesn’t need to wait at the edge of the nebula to jump back in. It can jump to the planet from anywhere.
    - Transwarp conduits have specific entrances, so it’s very convenient that one of those happens to be right near the nebula.

    On a side note, I normally watch this in the Apple TV app, but it’s currently telling me “content unavailable” when I pick Discovery (the entire series is unavailable). Fortunately you can link the CBS app, so I watched it there.

    Star Trek: Discovery on Apple TV
     
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  10. secondclaw

    secondclaw Member

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    Really the only redeeming thing about this mess was Doug Jones out of his regular makeup.

    The whole idea of putting ensign Tilly as 1st officer and possibly in command when Emerald Chain is looking for the ship is preposterous, to say the least. It would be like making Wesley Crusher Picard's #1 during the Borg invasion. Exactly when has the show has demonstrated she has any command skills? Even the Killy version of her was laughable. I really don't know where the writers are going with this mess. And the cause of the burn was, while definitely unpredictable, completely ridiculous.
    And season 3 had such a good start ... damn it.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2020
  11. JYoung

    JYoung Series 3

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    Season 2 started off well and then devolved into a flaming dung heap.
    Season 3 appears to be heading to the dung heap as well.
     
  12. mattyro7878

    mattyro7878 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I long for Gabriel Lorca and Michelle Yeoh. That was a big drop off to Captain Tilly and a petulant Kelpian. Don't they talk about what they are about to produce?? Maybe they are more concerned with being a "there's a place for all of us" show rather than a Star trek show that respects all.
     
  13. pgogborn

    pgogborn Well-Known Member

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    All the usual suspects are innocent, the Burn wasn't a malicious pre-meditated act... but it could happen again, what will be done to stop it happening again, will it be ethical.



    From a previous episode:
    Because of the arrival of Burnham and Saru there was nearly another Burn. The writers will continue to allow Burnham to fly around the Universe putting it in jeopardy and being forgiven.

    I had high hopes for Admiral Vance but I now realise he is not going to save us from Burnham and Saru:
    Admiral Vance: You believe this planet is also the source of the Burn.
    Burnham: Yes, sir.
    Admiral Vance: Any chance the life sign could have been somehow involved?
    Captain Saru: The scientists were members of the Federation. And the child would have been perhaps four or five at the time. So no.
    Admiral Vance: There's one thing you should be aware of before you go



    Something Tilly said could be deliberate writer's misdirection:
    Tilly: We have a spore drive and we're right next to a dilithium planet. There's only one person who wants both of those things enough to come all the way out here.

    I haven't yet ruled out there isn't a still unknown big bad using exploiting the ability of the child to cause a burn.

    I also think in this and the previous episode the writers have set up a potential power battle between Burnham and Saru.
     
  14. pgogborn

    pgogborn Well-Known Member

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    I thought Discovery had to withdraw from the Nebula leaving Burnham and Saru behind, couldn't jump back, because of damage to their shields.

    Osira couldn't find Discovery until the near Burn forced Discovery to re-route power and turn off its cloaking device.
     
  15. JYoung

    JYoung Series 3

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    My point is that Osyraa appeared to beam her shock troops in through Discovery's shields when Tilley ordered Black Alert.

    Which she could have done the moment she first warped in as she had about 20-30 seconds before Discovery cloaked.
    She also didn't do it during the conversation she and Tilley had after Brightburn forced both ships to decloaked.

    Why?
    She doesn't appear to be on the subtle side.

    (And incidentally, wouldn't the communications between the two ships while they were cloaked help locate then?)
     
    Last edited: Dec 26, 2020
  16. mattyro7878

    mattyro7878 Well-Known Member

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    Just researched. The attack on Discovery imitates the sea monster the Kelpian people must overcome. I think this is a big holo charade.
     
  17. pgogborn

    pgogborn Well-Known Member

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    Before she sent in the shock troops she located Stamets while Tilly was trying to get him to respond to her on the intercom, them beamed in a two man elite team to secure him, which seems to me to be subtle enough.

    (I need a rewatch, I thought Tilly couldn't order Black Alert because the shields were not properly working)
     
  18. pgogborn

    pgogborn Well-Known Member

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    I am convinced there is a liar playing charades, I do not know who it is, if they are using the holo to do it that is interesting especially as nobody seems to know how to turn the holo off, but I think it could be even more interesting if the big bad isn't using a holo.
     
  19. JYoung

    JYoung Series 3

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    No.
    Tilly didn't order Black Alert because they couldn't use the Spore Drive while cloaked.
    (Of course, that could change by the next episode.)

    So either Tilly and company forgot about the shields when they decloaked (or the writers did) or Osyraa always had the capability to transport her troops through the shields.

    Also, how did Osyraa know exactly where to send her shock troops?
    How would she even know who Stamets is?
    How did she know Discovery was going to be at the nebula?
    How does she even know as much as she does about the Spore Drive?

    The logical answer would be that someone (or something) is feeding her information.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2020
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