So has the Tivo Stream Software Improved in the Last Few Months?

Discussion in 'TiVo Stream 4K' started by omelet1978, Aug 2, 2020.

  1. jaselzer

    jaselzer Active Member

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    To be honest rczrider, I also thought you had returned your Stream and never looked back. In the beginning I read your posts to educate myself. Then I began to feel you were a “All things TiVo hater”. I sort of felt I was experiencing a “boy who cried wolf” story. In any event, I’m just trying to point out that perhaps your presentation is causing people to think that you simply hate TiVo and everything about it, though that might not be what you actually feel. Just a friendly thought.


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  2. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    Usually it takes many years of being a Tivo owner to develop that level of deep resentment towards them.

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  3. jaselzer

    jaselzer Active Member

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    Lol


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  4. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    Sorry to pile on, but it did strike me as odd that he hated the TS4K so much that he bought another one :rolleyes:. I also hate the TS4K (missing critical remote buttons, HDR bug, no way to integrate with Tivo boxes), so I never bought one in the first place. I tend to avoid products I don't like and buy products I do like.

    In any case, it's been an entertaining saga.
     
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  5. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    Good to know I'm not way off base. For reference, are there better remotes on other streaming devices? I've used a chromecast for years. I have a firestick 4k still sitting in the box, but don't remember my old one having the greatest remote. And don't remember my mom's Roku being anything to write home about. I feel like all the streaming device remotes are lackluster.

    Especially with Live channels and iptv apps being more front and center now. The remotes aren't really designed for it. Also not a fan of the removal of dedicated play/pays/ff/rew buttons. I think the TS4k remote comes close, especially when certain live channels services can take advantage of the remote buttons for their own purpose like Channels does. I can direct tune a channel with the number pad. I can go to live TV with the live button. Guide gives me the guide. Live also acts like a last button for switching to the previous channel. And skip does commercial skip.

    Not everyone uses Channels, but it shows what other apps can do on these devices and best take advantage of the remote. And that's on the app developers, not Tivo or the respective device mfg.

    But I'd love to see a more traditional tivo remote work with the TS4k that also learns and is backlit. If one of their DVR BT remotes would work seamlessly with it, I'd be ecstatic as my one Slide is collecting dust.

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  6. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    Removal of those buttons is my main gripe. All other streaming remotes I can think of have those buttons, even the model the TS4K is a clone of. So I'd argue that every other streaming remote I've ever seen is better. Even the much maligned Apple TV remote at least has a play button.

    Yes, I do understand the argument that ok/right/left can theoretically serve the same purpose. But in reality they don't. App developers aren't consistent, so those buttons don't actually do the same thing as play/ffwd/rew on several apps. For example, on Netflix, arrows do frame by frame, but ffwd/rew do slow search. Held arrows to fast search, and held ffwd/rew do really fast search. So there you have 4 distinct functions which are impossible to get with a single button.

    So Tivo, if you're listening, please put the 3 critical buttons which have existed on playback devices since the invention of recording (even tape recorders from the early 1900's had them in some form).

    Other than the remote and the HDR bug, the TS4K is a decent little Android TV dongle, reasonably priced. If it weren't for the HDR bug, I'd probably buy one and just use a 3rd party remote.

    But my biggest disappointment by far is the lack of a Tivo app to remotely access live and recorded channels from another Tivo box (like a Mini and the app we used to have on the Fire Stick). I expected Tivo's first streaming device to be a Mini replacement that also did streaming. That would have addresses their biggest shortcoming (lack of streaming apps) and kept me in the Tivo ecosystem. When that didn't happen, I sold all my Tivos. What they actually released was just another stick identical to all the other sticks I've had for over 10 years. The killer app on the Tivo stick isn't very killer either. ReelGood and JustWatch do the same thing far better.
     
  7. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    While they'll have those nav buttons, they all seem to lack buttons to do simple live channels functions of sorts. Roku, Fire, Apple are all in the same boat there. I guess it's a trade off of what inconveniences would you prefer since none are perfect. If you don't do Live TV via you're streaming device, then those other options could be preferable. Since I'm ditching my Tivo Dvr's, having a remote more suited towards live TV is my preference, and so far the tivo one seems to be best suited for it.

    Hopefully the next round of updated devices will bring new remotes. All it does is heighten competition.

    And all of us wanted the TS4k to act like a mini. Knowing that wasn't in the cards was the main reason I started looking at alternatives and went with Channels DVR. If tivo isn't providing the solution, then I'll use their new device to hop out of their dvr ecosystem.

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  8. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    The AT&T Osprey remote for their Android TV box has channel numbers. The universal remotes I use for those other devices also have channel numbers. But they don't do anything. The apps aren't designed to recognize them. So adding numbers to those remotes would be pointless. Not a very good trade off - functionality that doesn't do anything for entirely missing functionality.

    In any case, on my Fire Stick and can just say "watch channel four point one" or "watch NBC" just as quickly as I can hit the number buttons. So loss of number keys isn't nearly as a big a deal as loss of transport keys.

    To me, buying the TS4K is like buying a car with no wheels. Sure I could buy wheels for it. But I already have several new cars with wheels.
     
  9. jaselzer

    jaselzer Active Member

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    I invested in a Harmony Elite with a Hub, which I hear now works with the Tivo Stream.


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  10. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    Just when I was trying to do away with Harmony. But in my theater room, that would be perfect. It's the only room now with a Harmony, and the Elite to boot.

    Here's the info to set it up.
    Harmony and Tivo Stream 4K

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    Last edited: Aug 5, 2020
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  11. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    What about buttons for guide, commercial skip, last and so forth?

    And not sure they have the ability on other devices, but with Android you have button mapper and can remap buttons based on your needs if the app you use supports it. In my case, Channels does support it. I haven't tried to do voice to control channels in the app. Will have to experiment at some point. But for me, the number pad does work for Live Channels apps, and if not from the get go, button mapper support can add it. So maybe the AT&T streamer could. Make the number keys functional.

    It's all trade offs based on use cases. I'll take dealing with the directional pad for play navigation because I get the other dvr/live TV buttons that mimic what I had with tivo. So a more normal tv viewing experience. Also good if others are using the remote. But for you, you put the weight on the dedicate nav controls so the others will be more of a benefit. Options are good.

    So the wuestion is are you returning the TS4k and sticking with the firestick?

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  12. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    My Fire TV (TV, not the stick) has a guide button. My universal can do commercial skips with macros. Last would be great, but I can do that with down arrow and pick from a list of recent channels. Still no compelling advantage on the TS4K remote that's worth losing play/ffwd/rew.
    I'm aware of that option and have used it on other Android TV devices in the past. But I have no desire to remember that play/ffwd/rew is actually 1/2/3.
    Options are good. Senseless crippling for the sake of style is not. Apple and Harmony tried to do that too, and for that reason I will not buy either of those. If others in my house picked up the TS4K remote, the first question I would get is "how do I play/ffwd/rew"? Well, ok/arrows might work in some applications. Just fumble around and see what works rather than press a familiar button whose function is obvious and intuitive.
    Never bought a TS4K to begin with. I knew from what I saw on paper that it wasn't for me.

    I used to have a Channel Master Stream+ Android TV box which was loads better than this TS4K. Not only did the remote have a nearly full array of buttons including numbers, channel up/down, guide, play/ffwd/rew, etc., but it also had a built in OTA tuner for recording. It was a brilliant little box. Only thing that killed it was they could never get certified for certain streaming apps.
    [​IMG]

    In any case, my house full of Fire TVs is a fine replacement for Tivo. Remote does everything I need and makes logical sense. Have been happily running Tivo-less for over 2 years now. The only reason I held on to my Tivos and hung around in the forums this long was the hope that the TS4K would actually integrate with Tivo. Sadly, it does not.
     
  13. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    Like that remote. Backlit?

    I think I'm going to get to do beta testing for the TS4k. My new projector is 4k Lite, an Epson 2x shifter, so I'll be able test out 4k issues as well as live channel issues. Will have to see what other apps the homerun quatro will work with besides channels and their own. Still have a chromecast Ultra so if anything borks the TS4k, I can still enjoy the the theater room.

    Stinks the remote for Sabrina is most likely going to suck, unless the leaked pic is just the top half, and the bottom has some more useful buttons not shown. More design fluff and less useful functionality. Honestly, stop using Apple as a benchmark. March to the beat of your own drum at this point and celebrate being different than Apple. See the attached pic. [​IMG]

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  14. rczrider

    rczrider Active Member

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    So it's odd because I bought a replacement (I still only have one) after a major update to see if they fixed the things that bugged me? So in your opinion, I should have given them one chance out of the gate and then sworn off of it for good?

    And you're on a forum for a product you don't currently own, never owned, and don't plan on owning?

    I just got slammed because paddleboy thought I was doing what you're actually doing. I guess it's okay for you, though, because you're not saying bad things about TiVo. That's where the old folks draw the line.

    You really are a white knight for TiVo. The person you're agreeing with is literally what you accuse me of being, but because they're not saying bad things about poor TiVo, it's okay. I guess it's common for hypocrites to miss their own hypocrisy, though.
     
  15. Old Roamio 0

    Old Roamio 0 New Member

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    The TS4k does not have a play button, but the Nvidea shield controller used by a family member to play games does. It pairs with the TS4k as a remote, but does not keep the link for a long time like a remote does. Pairing is fickle. But hitting the play button, and the TS4k plays. Hitting it again and it pauses. (The nvidea controller has a joy stick, and menu buttons, and a left and right and up and down that the TS4k responds to too).

    So, re "play" : the TS4k streaming dongle knows how. The supplied remote just does not have the keys.
     
  16. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    Sorry but no. You could see posts of mine elsewhere where I've been very critical of Tivo. There is a reason why I went with Channels DVR and have been parting out my hardware. But I've also spent enough time with new tech, beta testing tech and so forth. So if it's a product I like, I'm optimistic about it and not pessimistic. I've also had interaction with one of the devs on Reddit, and believe they are working on and will solve the problems even if it's going slowly than we all would like.

    You bought, exited, bought back but pretended like you never left. You constantly rant every chance you get and remind everyone how much more stable well established mature products are. Such amazing insight there. You obviously aren't one meant to deal with the pitfalls of being an early adopter of tech.

    With that attitude, it made zero sense to jump back in just hearing of an update. You'd think someone in your shoes who's already starting out with a negative view and one round under their belt would've actually had the sense to take a wait and see approach, actually wait for feedback before jumping back in. This would be common sense instead of blindly jumping in because "oooo! An update! It must be great now." That just doesn't jive with your previous posts and general attitude. So shame on you at that point.

    You ignore the fact these well established options have had their own early problems, their own firmware issues and things that have been broken over the years. There's a reason why they are fairly solid now, ("Now" being the key word) even though I've pointed out some mishaps as late as last year even. But you just ignored all that as well because I'm a Tivo apologist, and it's easier to attack that than to touch on all the other points.

    Even when others point out a similar pattern you go back to the tivo apologist act. It's just old at this point.

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  17. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    While I miss dedicated play/pause/rew/ff buttons, the select button does just fine to play and pause while you're watching something.

    I remember a remote once upon a time used the round pad as all four functions. Might've been a disc player of sorts. Top was play/pause. Rew/ff on either side and stop at the bottom. That was their dedicated setup.

    If they made the peanut a half inch longer and put three buttons underneath the round pad for the play navigation, and added the backlight and added actual command learning, I think most would be ecstatic. A remote such as this should always be a at the very least be a premium option to buy. Tivo always had a premium remote option even if they were half a$$ed.

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  18. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    I like it better than the TS4K remote for sure. It wasn't backlit. Got rid of it a few years ago. My regular streaming remote is backlit (all the buttons are backlit, not just that multi-colored ring):
    [​IMG]

    Cool. Please tell them to add play/ffwd/rew for me.

    Looking forward to this in spite of the minimalist remote. Any remote for Chromecast is long overdue and way better than using your phone.
     
  19. dbpaddler

    dbpaddler Active Member

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    I kinda like that one. Not a fan of the buttons on the bottom, but the rest looks good. Shame it's IR only.

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  20. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    Totally fair. My post was mean spirited and I shouldn't have done it. Sorry about that.

    For the record, I still intend to follow the TS4K in case version 2.0 fixes the remote. But I have lost all hope for a Tivo app on the device itself. If they fix the HDR bug, fix the remote and keep the price at $50, I'd buy one. AT&T did a major redesign on their Android TV remote, so there is a glimmer of hope.
     
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