"Senior vs. Junior: American Chopper" (spoilers)

Discussion in 'Now Playing - TV Show Talk' started by gastrof, Aug 12, 2010.

  1. MikeMar

    MikeMar Go Pats

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    There are some non-competes that are:
    -Only if you leave on your own
    -For a certain period of time regardless of how you leave
    -For a certain period of time that they PAY you for
    -Other types I'm sure

    Some or more enforceable than other, depending on the wording/industry/company
     
  2. IJustLikeTivo

    IJustLikeTivo Active Member

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    And more importantly where the business is. California makes a non compete pretty much impossible. And others limit to equity owners if a business ( e.g. Jr). But there is plenty of ways around them for both parties.
     
  3. vertigo235

    vertigo235 Well-Known Member TCF Club

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    I think what he's trying to say is that while it is legally enforceable, it's not very practical or easy to enforce them.

    I still hold strong though that if an employer wants me to sign a non-compete without proper consideration, and simply as a scare tactic etc. Then that's probably an employer that I don't want to work for to begin with.
     
  4. IJustLikeTivo

    IJustLikeTivo Active Member

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    Yep, plus I'm trying not to say something else.
     
  5. DevdogAZ

    DevdogAZ Give 'em Hell, Devils

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    Most non-competes do not restrict the clause based on the details of the termination. Usually, they're valid no matter why the employee left. Courts will generally want to see that the clause is limited in scope and duration so as not to prevent the departing employee from making a living, but the reasonableness of that scope and duration is different in every case, depending on the industry, products, competitors, etc.

    In addition, some states and/or associations have enacted laws that severely restrict non-compete clauses in certain industries. For example, in the legal industry, the state bar associations have said that non-competes for lawyers are not permitted.
    Whether your employer(s) chose to enforce the clause is a completely different story. Enforcing a non-compete clause is very expensive and time-consuming and is generally only worth it if the departing employee is doing significant damage to the former employer. If a software engineer leaves one place and goes across the street and starts working for the competition, it's unlikely that the former employer will care unless the departing employee also takes with him confidential information and the competitor uses that to get a leg up.
     
  6. ahartman

    ahartman Space for Rent

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    Really guys? Seems to have gone a long way off topic to the show...

    I respectfully request that the legal pissing match be taken elsewhere.
     
  7. IJustLikeTivo

    IJustLikeTivo Active Member

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    Respect won't work here. Especially with the number of posts you have... ;-)

    Point taken.
     
  8. Hansky

    Hansky Active Member

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    What he was doing was speaking in absolutes and authoritatively, and trying to appear he knew what he was talking about. In reality, the opposite was true. When called, a little hissy fit followed to attempt to overshadow his failures. As I said, that is what people at his level, and many primary school classes, do. Now, he backs up further with what he "meant to say." Basically, a joke.


    Maybe. However, "consideration" is not the same as "compensation." People often think it is a scare tactic that right up until the time they get served with a lawsuit. Perhaps they listened to "experts" on internet message boards. In some entire industries, in some locations, a person either signs or they find a new industry.


    I'd love for you to take the floor and tell us all about those ways of getting around them. You've done so well with your absolute statements up to this point.
     
  9. IJustLikeTivo

    IJustLikeTivo Active Member

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    I'd take to the floor only for the purpose of making you look silly but you do that for me.

    If you doubt what I say, give me objective evidence of your perspective. And, it is just that, perspective since you've presented nothing more objective than I have. I gave you my PERSONAL experiences with CNC, you gave me opinion. Nothing different.
     
  10. jradosh

    jradosh Newlywed

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    :up: +1 :up:
     
  11. Mike Lang

    Mike Lang Administrator Staff Member Administrator TCF Club

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    Cool it guys...
     
  12. marksman

    marksman ID-10-T

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    Here is my take on OCC versus PJD.

    OCC at this point and time assembles parts to make motorcycles. PJD actually designs and builds custom bikes.

    I know the people that work with Paulie have to get frustrated with him building things in his head, but ultimately it is a more creative process and result. I am not surprised at all Faro chose him over OCC. OCC just essentially mixes and matches parts and sticks them together.

    People can talk about Paulie not assembling/building bikes, but nobody at OCC has a tiny fraction of the conceptual design ability that Junior has...

    The Hair Club bike was both frightening and interesting at the same time. Why anyone who had the Hair Club for men would want a bike covered in Skulls is beyond me.
     
  13. modnar

    modnar Active Member

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    Yes. What Paul Sr. doesn't seem to even have the ability to understand is that it doesn't matter if Paulie does > 50% of the physical labor on the bikes or not. In fact, it's a waste of Paulie's value as a designer to have him turning screws when there are others without his creative talent there to do the fabrication.
     
  14. nataylor

    nataylor Curiously Strong TCF Club

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    Bingo. Senior doesn't get the difference between design and assembly.
     
  15. Frylock

    Frylock Well-Known Member

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    OCC really should focus on building stock bikes. They have enough experience and parts that building stock bikes that look good would make a lot more sense than trying to do custom work. Let Paul Jr take on the custom side of things and let Sr do the production work. Then the two of them could be in different markets, and perhaps come together as a family.
     
  16. jbernardis

    jbernardis Active Member

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    I always thought this was the way they should be doing things when they were both still at OCC. Junior is subordinate to Senior, but in charge of custom builds. Senior runs the overall business.
     
  17. IJustLikeTivo

    IJustLikeTivo Active Member

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    The problem is that the stock bike business is primed by the custom business. Once they decided to do that they have to keep priming the pump to generate interest. The money is in the mass market not customs. By trashing the custom business senior has doomed the mass market side as well.
     
  18. IJustLikeTivo

    IJustLikeTivo Active Member

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    I do actually like the HC bike that Sr's shop did. First one since Jr left that is really custom. I can't imagine that it rides well though, that front end must weight ton.

    Doh, I take it back, just got to the end. HFC, Sr is suing them AGAIN? What a moron.
     
  19. IJustLikeTivo

    IJustLikeTivo Active Member

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    I can't watch the Sr parts anymore. He just completely disgusts me.

    OTOH, I think he might have a case on the suit against joe. I guess it depends on NY law. But seriously, another freaking law suit.

    BTW, looking at the crap in Sr's garage tells me where the money went. BTW, OCC is facing foreclosure on the building. They stopped paying their mortgage to force a refinance. It cost 12 million but is now only worth 7 million. And, the county owns the building in lieu of tax payments. Sr is good at never owning debt.
     
  20. vertigo235

    vertigo235 Well-Known Member TCF Club

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    Burn In Hell OCC!
     

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