Partial recording problem...

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by sfm, Oct 3, 2006.

  1. TiVolunteer

    TiVolunteer lotta lurk rare post

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    Jul 10, 2001
    Cary, NC

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    I agree that it must retune the channel for the next recording. I have witnessed it live going from a "missing channel" to fixed just by retuning the same channel when it went to record a show at the tope of the hour. See Item (d) under "What Happened"

    http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4883540#post4883540

    However, I believe that there are two different "flavors" of the missing channel problem -- one in which a "retune" or channel change would fix it and one which required a reboot. I had one whole evening of prime time shows on one channel end up as zero length recordings when I had the second flavor. Other shows recorded on the other tuner recorded just fine.

    Luckily, I've had ZERO missing channels/partial recordings since 8.1 rolled out (knock on wood). All my observations above are pre-8.1.
     
  2. tclynx

    tclynx New Member

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    Ellicott...
    You might all find this interesting. We hadn't sent back our old TIVO yet so that we can finish watching the programs it had already recorded, but we programed the new TIVO for the shows we watch. Last night both TIVO's attempted to record the same program on Comedy Central. Whereas the new TIVO (which, as you might remember, uses the cablecards that were on the old TIVO) picked the show up just fine (still no problems with this box). The old TIVO, however, was not able to record it (duration 0). They are both getting the same Comcast signal so we don't think its the cable, and it can't be the cablecards since the new box using the old cablecards got the signal just fine, so we're thinking it's actually a bum TIVO box. What do you think?
     
  3. Teeps

    Teeps Well-Known Member

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    Torrance,Cal...
    No. I have experienced both since 8.1 was pushed.
     
  4. bmgoodman

    bmgoodman Member

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    Dec 20, 2000
    Northern...
    I'll admit that I haven't read this entire thread, so this may duplicate what someone else has said. I don't have HDTV yet, nor even digital cable. I record everything on my S3 directly from analog channels (no cable cards or cable boxl). I have connected a set of cheap rabbit ears so that I can pick up the local digital OTA broadcasts. (I have done a few test recordings from OTA digital channels, but I have nothing scheduled to record from OTA).

    Last night, I found that the S3 had recorded Monday's episode of 24 from the OTA digital Fox channel. When I went to watch it, I found it was a 0:00 "Partial" recording. So I don't know that the issue is with the cable cards or even the cable.

    Of course, this is just one data point, but I wanted to throw it in in case it may help some of you. I hope Tivo can work this out before I actually start recording in HD. Kinda defeats the purpose of having an S3 if it's no more reliable than the cable company's box. :eek:

    BTW, I have just gotten some form of 8.1, but I'm not at home to give the full version.
     
  5. PPC1

    PPC1 Member

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    Sep 15, 2006

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    I think this proves what I have suspected all along-- its not a cable signal issue, and its not a cable card issue.
     
  6. PaulS

    PaulS Active Member

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    Well, just because he was recording OTA doesn't necessarily mean that he didn't have signal issues. On the contrary, I believe that OTA is a far less stable signal than cable would be. Far more variables to contend with in dealing with OTA, such as weather, multipath, geography, etc.
     
  7. bmgoodman

    bmgoodman Member

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    Dec 20, 2000
    Northern...
    I might grant that what you say about OTA is true. But, should the whole recording abort if the signal is interrupted for 1 second? Two seconds? 1 minute? Should it continue recording for the remainder of the recording period and not care if the signal ever returns?

    I'd probably vote for continuing no matter what. I'm sure others would prefer an "abort" after some time with no signal. Whatever the case, I cannot imagine that I would want even a 1 minute interruption to abort the entire recording.

    I will add that in my case, the little I have watched the OTA broadcasts, I have seen periods of 1-2 seconds of dropouts on occasion. Certainly nothing long enough that recording should abort.
     
  8. pl1

    pl1 Well-Known Member

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    MA
    Me too. Including the ability to go back to recording if something like the Emergency Alert System knocks it out. Since moving most of my recording from cable to OTA, this has been somewhat resolved, but I should be able to use my S3 as intended. OTOH, speaking with other Comcast users, they have to live the with same thing on their Comcast DVR's.
     
  9. Roderigo

    Roderigo New Member

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    Brookdale, CA
    How does moving your recordings to OTA help the Emergency Alert problem? If you have cablecards, this message is coming out of band from them - so it doesn't matter what the tuner is recording.
     
  10. Roderigo

    Roderigo New Member

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    I'm pretty sure if you lose the signal, it will keep recording for the fully scheduled time. So, if you got a 0 length recording, either the signal was out for the full hour, or there's some other bug in play.

    Certainly easy to test my theory - detach the cable while recording something, and then reattach it. See what the S3 does in response.
     
  11. pl1

    pl1 Well-Known Member

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    MA
    Second S3 with no cableCARDS! :)

    But, I didn't actually know that it was the case that the cableCARD was interrupting everything including OTA if the signal comes. Is that a fact? I guess I was assuming that it did not interrupt OTA on the same unit.
     
  12. yanasina

    yanasina Member

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    Jan 11, 2007
    If the power is out when the S2 is supposed to start recording, and then it comes on, the recording will start. I assume the S3 is supposed to do this too. On the S3, if the signal is lost and changing the channel brings it back, then the S3 should be able to reacquire the signal, but it isn't doing that; the rest of the program is lost since nothing changes the channel to reacquire the signal. It seems like if changing the channel gets the signal back, that the S3 ought to be able to reacquire the signal without human intervention, somehow, some way. Signal loss is one thing, and a cable company issue, but if the signal is actually there, then it's a Tivo issue, isn't it?
     
  13. PaulS

    PaulS Active Member

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    100% agreed.

    Might not be the best solution, from a certain point of view, though. Say you have a signal that's borderline. Comes in and out. You might end up with a recording that's very patchwork, with periods of video and periods of black intermixed. At some point, that becomes simply unwatchable. It's commendable to try to record everything you can, but you might have to draw a line at some point.
     
  14. PPC1

    PPC1 Member

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    Sep 15, 2006
    He specifically stated that both S3s were getting the same Comcast signal. Specfically, he was recording Comedy Central, a cable only channel. Thus your assumption that he was recording OTA is false.

    I think you might be confusing the post I quoted with some other post.
     
  15. PaulS

    PaulS Active Member

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    Unless we're talking about two seperate posts, you might wanna re-read the original post yourself. I'm referring to bmgoodman's post, where he specifically stated that his OTA digital Fox channel recording was a 0:00 partial. Yes, he was connected to cable without CableCARDs, but he specifically stated the recording was OTA. If you're referring to something else, than accept my apology, otherwise, please re-read the post.

    My issue came with your blanket statement in the post immediately after bmgoodmans's that since the recording was OTA, the partial recording bug couldn't be a "cable signal issue or a CableCARD issue". Especially after one anecdotal piece of evidence (OTA partial) that seems to contradict the majority (cable partial) of evidence. It may be a generic signal quality issue, but to draw a conclusion so broad from one piece of evidence is extremely short-sighted IMHO.

    So far, since receiving 8.1 last week, I've had a total of three 0:00 recordings. All three were on a 256QAM digital simulcast of an analog channel (2xSciFi, 1xE!). I have pristine signal quality, and my CC's seem to be working perfectly. I'd love nothing better than to get to the bottom of this and have it fixed...
     
  16. Mar 1, 2007 #256 of 326
    rdrrepair

    rdrrepair Bill Knapp

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    845 New York
    Well, just got my second partial recording problem.

    My first was the two hour 24 show on FOX 705 HD NY a few weeks ago. I recorded 15min of a 2 hour program. Pre 8.1.

    Tuesday night I recorded 1/2 hour of NCIS CBS channel 702 HD NY. Luckily I had a backup on one of my Series 2 TiVo. Post 8.1

    While viewing the S2 recording of NCIS I saw that there was an EBS broadcast 40 minutes into the show.

    I remember turning on my TV and seeing the TiVo recording NCIS on the S3 and it was about 10 minutes behind live. I flipped the input to the S2 and stated to watch another program that was recorded. My viewing of the recorded program on the S2 was not interrupted. I had no idea that there was an EBS.

    It seems odd that I lost the recording at 30 minutes when the EBS went off about 40 minutes after the start of the program. With the 10 minute live buffer this might make sense. I don't know - just throwing it out there.

    I have noticed better stability in my channels since the 8.1 update. Before 8.1 I had a hard time keeping channels locked. After the 8.1 I have had ZERO instances of loosing tuner function.
     
  17. Mar 1, 2007 #257 of 326
    PPC1

    PPC1 Member

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    I would accept your apology, if any were really needed. (Which I don't think is necessary.) My prior post referred to a completely seperate post. My post quoted tclynx. Please re-read my post, particularly the quoted portion. I think its a simple misunderstanding.


    This is where you went astray. You assumed my post refered to the immediately preceding post by bybmgoodmans. My post set forth a quote attributed to tclynx's post. Perhaps, does your display edits out the quotes?

    At any rate, take a look tclnyx's post. I think that it is quite informative-- two S3s recording the same cable source, the one with cable cards recorded the entire program, the one without cable cards had a zero duration recording.
     
  18. Mar 1, 2007 #258 of 326
    PaulS

    PaulS Active Member

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    My bad. Sorry for the confusion. It was your post coming immediately after bmgoodman's post that threw me off. :cool:

    In any event, it is indeed very interesting that a CableCARD-equipped S3 recorded the Comedy Central program just fine, and a vanilla analog-only S3 ended up with a 0:00. Bad hardware, bad signal quality, or a TiVo bug. Those can be the only alternatives that I see at this point based upon this evidence.
     
  19. Mar 1, 2007 #259 of 326
    Roderigo

    Roderigo New Member

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    Brookdale, CA
    Well a cablecard equipped S3 and a non-cablecard equipped S3, the two can be receiving two different channels for the same channel number.

    The card may be providing a digital simulcast, and the one without the card would have to use analog.
     
  20. Mar 1, 2007 #260 of 326
    PaulS

    PaulS Active Member

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    Southern NH
    Right. The OP would have to go into the Diagnostics screen to tell us if his cableco digitally simulcasts Comedy Central, or leaves it analog. If analog, then we have an apples to apples comparison between the CC S3 and the analog-only S3.

    For the analog-only to fail, when the CC succeeded, definitely narrows down the possible factors in the 0:00 recordings.
     

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