*OFFICIAL* "subchannels getting shifted upwards" THREAD

Discussion in 'DirecTV TiVo Powered PVRs & Receivers' started by borghe, May 9, 2004.

  1. May 9, 2004 #1 of 107
    borghe

    borghe New Member

    412
    0
    Jun 1, 2002
    edit - ok, this thread is now for all subchannel mapping issue. This includes two known issues:

    1) the subchannel is not mapping at all. In this instance, your station's analog channel (the one we've known for the last million years) is on channel X, and their digital station is sent on on channel Y. Most of the time the station then remaps the digital channel to channel X-1. In some cases now, the Tivo is not remapping that channel.

    example: Channel 45 sends out it's digital signal on channel 26-1. If you tune to channel 26-1 ON ANY OTHER TUNER, it will remap to channel 45-1. However on your Tivo, it will not remap and your Tivo never sees any 45-1, only 26-1.

    2) some or all of your subchannels on a station are being shifted upwards.

    example: where you used to be finding channel 46-1, 46-2, and 46-3 ON ANY OTHER TUNER, now there is nothing on 46-1, and everything is on 46-2, 46-3, 46-4.

    first post which problem you are having, then under each number, post the channels. Also, PLEASE ONLY POST THE PROBLEMS HERE IF IT IS ONLY THE TIVO HAVING PROBLEMS AND NOT OTHER HD STBs. If you have never had another STB post here and ask. If your problem is exactly like what is being stated here most likely this problem is affecting you. If it is different, feel free to post but you should DEFINITELY confirm that it is specifically related to your Tivo, and not to the station itself.

    MOST IMPORTNAT OF ALL!!!!! Make sure you call DirecTV on this and make sure when you talk to a tech (not a CSR) you tell them exactly which stations (including call letters) you are having problems with. It will probably be easier for them to fix if they could understand why the unit is doing this on some stations and not others.

    1 - WMVS Milwaukee, WI
    Tivo will not scan channel 8-2, nor will it remap it to 10-2 when manually tuned to. It WILL see and map to 10-1 and 10-3 through 10-6. Only 10-2 is missed.

    2 - WDJT Milwaukee, WI
    on channel 46 all subchannels (3) are shifted up one channel. 46-1 is blank and 46-2 though 46-4 carry programming. This causes the DirecTV guide data on the channels directv has 46 mapped to to be incorrect (58-1 through 58-3).
     
  2. May 9, 2004 #2 of 107
    oosik77

    oosik77 TiVo Maniac

    303
    0
    Nov 22, 1999
    Phoenix,...
    My problem is bigger...

    KUTP the UPN channel here in Phoenix is Analog 45, the Tivo has the digital stations listed as 45-1 and 45-2 but there's no signal there. If I have the Tivo search for OTA channels it finds 45-1 and 45-2 at 26-1 and 26-2.
     
  3. May 10, 2004 #3 of 107
    mitchrc

    mitchrc New Member

    1,866
    0
    Jun 12, 2000
    Los Angeles
    KUTP's DTV channel is on 26. You're having a remap problem.
     
  4. May 10, 2004 #4 of 107
    btwyx

    btwyx Substantive Member

    11,335
    5
    Jan 16, 2003
    Mountain...
    What exactly is the problem you're looking for?

    It sounds like what I'm getting on KCSM 60 (San Mateo, CA). That's being broadcast on channel 43, first problem is that its not being mapped to 60-1 properly, I can only get it on 43-1. This may resolve itself when channel 60 goes off the air on May 17th and 43 will be its only broadcast.

    There's also a jazz subchannel which should be 43-2. It started off as 43-2, but then it became 43-3, and 43-2 is the same as 43-1 now.
     
  5. May 10, 2004 #5 of 107
    borghe

    borghe New Member

    412
    0
    Jun 1, 2002
    yes, you have both problems.
     
  6. May 10, 2004 #6 of 107
    sprocto2

    sprocto2 New Member

    85
    0
    Mar 22, 2004
    Brockport, NY
    Here's what we have, these are strictly what's provided by D* in the guide.

    Buffalo -

    2-1 - Works Correctly
    4-1 - Nothing, "Searching for Signal"
    4-2 - Shows what 4-1 is supposed to be
    4-3 - Shows what 4-2 is supposed to be
    7-1 - Works Correctly
    17-1 - Nothing, "Searching for Signal"
    17-2 - Shows what 17-1 is supposed to be
    17-3 - Shows what 17-2 is supposed to be

    Rochester -

    8-1 - Signal too weak
    10-1 - Works Correctly
    13-1 - Works Correctly
    21-1 - Works Correctly
    21-2 - Works Correctly
    21-3 - Works Correctly
    21-4 - Works Correctly

    Buffalo also has Fox, WB and UPN on the air. I can tune these in manually using the actual frequency +.1. They are not found in a scan. Presumably because Tivo looks at the X.1 sub-channel and sees nothing.

    I have an e-mail in to D*
     
  7. May 10, 2004 #7 of 107
    mchaney

    mchaney Dude THERE'S my Tivo

    189
    0
    Mar 29, 2004
    Maryland
    I think it would serve us all (and DirecTV) better if we keep all this info in one thread, so I hope this is the last "official" thread on the topic so that if someone points DirecTV here, they'll be able to get all the responses in one thread.

    I too have the problem. 52-1, 52-2, and 52-3 map to 2-1, 2-2, and 2-3 on my other HD receivers but on my HR10-250, they map to 2-1, 52-3, and 52-4 respectively. Someone at DirecTV needs to correct this bug and hopefully they can do it quickly in a download because some people are unable to record season passes due to this problem. Has anyone called and pointed them here? I tried calling yesterday but didn't get anyone "sentient" on the phone and just didn't have time to jump through the hoops at the time so I hung up. May try again later today if no one else has already contacted them.

    Edit: just emailed the URL to them. If you need to send the URL to someone else, I created a tiny one for purposes of sending email/messages:
    http://*******.com/2dfvg

    Don't know why it won't let me type "tiny url" as one word but replace the *'s above with "tiny url" as one word (remove the space).

    Mike
     
  8. May 10, 2004 #8 of 107
    midas

    midas I heard that TCF Club

    14,611
    839
    Jun 1, 2000
    Montgomery,...
    Here in Chicago we have a very strange one, channel 26 (WCIU). 26-1 shows in the guide but can't be tuned in. 26-2 shows in the guide and can be tuned in, however what you actually get is 26-1. If you do a channel scan these channels show up as 1-1 (26-1) and 1-2 (26-2). You can tune to them, but of course, there is no guide data.

    One more oddity is the station call letters displayed:

    26-1 WCIUDT
    26-2 WCIUDT2
    1-1 WCIU-TV
    1-2 WFBT-CA

    I have no idea what all this means.
     
  9. May 10, 2004 #9 of 107
    oosik77

    oosik77 TiVo Maniac

    303
    0
    Nov 22, 1999
    Phoenix,...
    Yup, I hope they fix it. But for now I don't think KUTP is doing anything more then 480p anyway.
     
  10. May 10, 2004 #10 of 107
    borghe

    borghe New Member

    412
    0
    Jun 1, 2002
    midas - AHHH.. I see you have a weigel station also.. :p let me explain what is happening..

    first, you have the problem listed in this thread. your subchannels on the actual digital channel are being shifted up one.

    second, DirecTV hard maps almost ALL weigel stations to their analog station, while weigel maps them to channel 1. This has been discussed in great depths on many forums (particularly Dish forums where the 811 receiver was unable to tune in any weigel station because of not being able to get channel 1). Basically weigel is out of compliance with ATSC standards for north america. They know this, have been told this, and the individual station managers can't do anything as it is a corporate office mandate that those stations be on channel 1. The "good news" is that this issue is irrelevant to weigel's misguided intentions. What you are seeing is the Tivo shifting the subchannels up on the digital channel, BUT CORRECTLY INTERPRETING the PSIP remapping of the channel to weigel's intended locations. Even after Tivo fixes this, upon a channel scan those channels will still show up on channel 1.

    third - the call signs are different because the 26 call signs are what (tribune? gemstar?) are assigned to them in the DirecTV guide, whereas the 1 call signs are assigned in the PSIP data.. Again, the Tivo is acting according to spec.

    finally, the guide data is missing for channel 1 because a DirecTV HD receiver WILL NOT provide both guide data from DirecTV AND PSIP data... one or the other. The only way a DirecTV receiver will show PSIP guide data is if the is no DirecTV signal. Now the station might not even be sending guide data, but even if it was your receiver wouldn't show it unless you turned it into an OTA only box.

    machaney - sorry about the additional thread. I agree we need an official one and that is why I created another one.. I thought hard about this and decided one with "official" in the topic would be more obvious to people having this problem. if it is a consolation, I was going to post a link to this thread in both of our other threads but decided it would be best served to let those ones die and only keep this one on the main page...

    I have called DirecTV, and the level 2 tech said this was obviously not working as it was supposed to. He told me both bproblems have been sent to level 3 techs and that if I don't see a fix within the next two weeks to call back and keep on them.

    So yes, if you are having this problem, call 1-800-347-3288 and ask to speak to a technician and let them know you are having it. As was said in the first post, tell them the channel numbers, call signs, any information you can give them. The more people who call in with this hopefully the quicker it will be fixed.

    I will have to say that so far these are my only problems with my Tivo. I can honestly say that once these are fixed, my Tivo will literally be perfect according to my expectations of it.. Hopefully this will be resolved soon....
     
  11. May 10, 2004 #11 of 107
    midas

    midas I heard that TCF Club

    14,611
    839
    Jun 1, 2000
    Montgomery,...
    borghe, I understand your explanation except for 2 things. The fact that they show up as 1-1 and 1-2 doesn't bother me. But why is 26-1 coming in on 26-2 and 26-1 can't be tuned at all? Unfortunately I don't have my HTL-HD hooked up anymore, but I don't rememer that problem.

    My second question is regarding the actual remapping to 1-1. That doesn't seem right. What would happen if another station did the same thing? And what's to stop them from remapping to 2-1?
     
  12. May 10, 2004 #12 of 107
    borghe

    borghe New Member

    412
    0
    Jun 1, 2002
    1. because you have "The problem". The problem is that on certain digital channels across the country, the Tivo is shifting the subchannels up a channel. That is the purpose of this thread, to let people know the Tivo is incorrectly doing this and to have them chime in here and have them call DirecTV. Your HTL-HD didn't do it because it was seeing the channels correctly at their proper location. The Tivo isn't. It needs to be fixed.

    2. my little dig into you having a weigel station (here in milwaukee we have channel 58). Weigel Broadcasting has sent down a mandate that all of its digital stations are to remap to channel 1. The thought is that it will appear first in the guide and draw more attention to itself. According to ATSC north american standards, only channels 2-69 are to be used for remapping, AND a station is supposed to remap its digital channel to a substation of its analog channel number. 58 is my analog station. 58 (no subchannel) and 58-0 should tune in the analog channel 58. 58-1 should tune in the digital channel.

    top answer your question about channel two, these standards are supposed to prevent that. if a station is on analog channel 36, their digital channel according to these standards should remap to channel 36.

    basically weigel is out of compliance in two places. They are not remapping to their analog channel number, and they are using an unapproved channel number to do it. They know this, but short of action by the FCC, it won't change, and they have basically said so.
     
  13. May 10, 2004 #13 of 107
    chadly25

    chadly25 New Member

    104
    0
    Dec 20, 2003
    Does anyone know why the guide on my TiVo lists ABC's HD station as 6-1, but it isn't there? ABC's HD feed in Indianapolis is on 25-1, not 6-1. If I tune to 25-1 I get ABC. This presents a problem for when I want to record something on ABC. TiVo won't know to go to 25-1 instead of 6-1. Is there a setting in TiVo (one that is transparent to me) that allows me to manually remap ABC to 6-1? Anyone else having this problem???

    I was told to post my previous thread in this area. It seems that others are having this problem too. Is there any fix yet?
     
  14. May 10, 2004 #14 of 107
    kbcrowe

    kbcrowe Member

    99
    0
    Dec 12, 2000
    Madison, AL USA
    Add Channel 48 in Huntsville, AL to those having problem #2. :(
     
  15. May 10, 2004 #15 of 107
    borghe

    borghe New Member

    412
    0
    Jun 1, 2002
    remember everyone.. CALL DIRECTV ABOUT THIS PROBLEM!! Each and every person needs to call DirecTV and let them know how important this is.. I personally can not record off of two channels I normally would because of this bug. I'm sure it has to be affecting others here in the same way. We need to move this near the top of DirecTV's list for fixing.

    So call in if you haven't already.
     
  16. May 10, 2004 #16 of 107
    sprocto2

    sprocto2 New Member

    85
    0
    Mar 22, 2004
    Brockport, NY
    I assume you mean you can't record with a title season pass. You can set up manual recording for any channel you want. It's a decent workaround for me and it has been working so far..
     
  17. May 10, 2004 #17 of 107
    JimSpence

    JimSpence Just hangin'

    30,901
    36
    Sep 19, 2001
    Binghamton, NY
    Although I don't have an HDTiVo, I do have a problem with my HTL-HD STB with one of my locals. My ABC affiliate is on analog 34 and digital 4. Sometimes the HD content gets remapped to 34-1 as it should, but at other times it shows up as 4-2. I emailed the affiliate asking what's happening.

    Here's the response I got, which should give some insight into this situation.

    The latter part about the guide info hasn't happened yet. Tribune doesn't have the info.
     
  18. May 11, 2004 #18 of 107
    borghe

    borghe New Member

    412
    0
    Jun 1, 2002
    I don't agree at all that that it is an acceptable work around.. To be blunt, if I wanted to do that I would have never bought a Tivo 3 years ago...

    I understand that you are saying it is at least a solution, and in cases where my local stations don't send guide data to TMS it is my only choice, but this is something that Tivo needs to fix, and unitl they do, it is considered unusable by me.. part of my problem also is that I have been excited for this unit for almost two years now, and had this glitch not occured this product would have exactly met my expectations. Now everyone asks me how I like my HD Tivo and I am honest "It is great except not being able to record channel 41 or CBS (two channels)".

    Other of you this may not be impacting as much and I understand that... if this were on an unwatched independent local or even a PBS channel, I wouldn;t be raising anywhere near this stink about it.. but what it is affecting is my CBS station and probably my third favorite station in our area (older movies, B monster movies, classic TV, etc). Both have accurate guide data up but I can't use it at all to record... Tivo needs to fix this..

    anyway, hopefully that gives you a better idea of why I am making such a big deal out of this... it just seems that in my case, the problem directly affects probably the two single channels I would most record from.
     
  19. May 11, 2004 #19 of 107
    sprocto2

    sprocto2 New Member

    85
    0
    Mar 22, 2004
    Brockport, NY
    Don't get me wrong, I am very dissapointed as well. For me however, the ability to record, pause, rewind HD OTA and D* was my number one desire and it does that. I will continue to try to work with D* till it's fixed.
     
  20. May 11, 2004 #20 of 107
    bobnxena

    bobnxena New Member

    2
    0
    May 11, 2004
    Houston, TX
    I get Houston ABC Channel 13's digital signal where it's broadcast, on frequency 32-1, but it doesn't remap to 13-1 as it should -- Problem No. 1. Strangely enough, this problem first happened Sunday evening (9 May) about 8 p.m. in the middle of a program we were watching. Channel 13-1 suddenly went dark, and we had to switch to SD Channel 13 (not knowing about the remap problem at the time). D* second-level techs and supers still profess ignorance about any remapping issues as of this morning.

    The other subchannels seem to be remapping okay, except for PBS Channel 8-1, which I can't find anywhere. Another mystery is that NBC Channel 2's subchannels 35-1, -2, and -3 all remap just fine, but when I access 35-2 or 35-3, the TiVo tuner actually switches itself to the remapped channels (2-2 and 2-3), complete with program banners. 35-1 and the rest of the subchannels don't do this. I don't have enough background to know whether this is significant.
     

Share This Page