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no signal on OTA channel

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by shmelvin, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. shmelvin

    shmelvin New Member

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    Aug 25, 2017
    A couple of weeks ago I lost a few OTA channels, what I get is "Problem with the signal on this channel. Trying again. (V53) even though it shows the channel in the guide and lists what's up next, has a signal strength of 85, and even the progress but no pic. It's not the antenna as it works just fine on the TV itself. ...Any ideas?
     
  2. kpeters59

    kpeters59 Well-Known Member

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    Have you rebooted the TiVo?

    Maybe force a connection first?

    If that doesn't fix it, re-run the channel scan and report back?

    -KP
     
  3. shmelvin

    shmelvin New Member

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    Aug 25, 2017
    I have done all that with no change, it shows everything about the channel, It just wont play it?
     
  4. kpeters59

    kpeters59 Well-Known Member

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    What zip-code is your TiVo set for?

    -KP
     
  5. V7Goose

    V7Goose OTA ONLY and Loving It!

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    You have an invalid channel selected in your channel list - one that is being broadcast in a different area too far away for you to receive. The reason you see a signal strength is because you have a real channel broadcasting in your area using the same physical broadcasting frequency (but probably a different channel number).
     
  6. JoeKustra

    JoeKustra in the other Alabama TCF Club

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    V7Goose is right. Since you know where Diagnostics is located, check this. Each tuner has the Frequency and Program Number. The frequency is the physical channel and the Program Number is the sub-channel. If you supply the call letters I can lookup the information in WiKi.

    Also -> North American television frequencies - Wikipedia
     
  7. V7Goose

    V7Goose OTA ONLY and Loving It!

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    Well, there may be something more insidious going on. This morning I suddenly am having a very similar problem with several channels that have been working fine for about a year. The TV tuner shows they are still there and working, but the Bolt is screwed up (some of them no video, even with strong signal, some wrong video). Channel scan verification did not fix it as It has done once in the past. Still working on this one . . .

    UPDATE: Tried full Guided Setup using another local zip that should always be the same lineup - no joy. It's looking like Bad_Rovi may be screwing up the lineups again in their infinite stupidity (that's about the only thing that can cause this if the TV picks up the real channel with good video and PSIP info).

    UPDATE 2: Checking the Diagnostics screen shows that all of the currently screwed-up channels are actually being tuned to a bogus channel. For example, even though Guide and the info data shows that I have tuned in channel 15.1, Diagnostics shows that tuner is actually tuned to 38.1. I have seen this before is past miserable tiimes when I was fighting with Bad_Rovi to fix lineups - sigh.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2018
  8. V7Goose

    V7Goose OTA ONLY and Loving It!

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    New Mexico...
    Now this is REALLY REALLY strange - I have two Bolts. Both are currently configured using the same zip code. One Bolt is tuning all channels just perfectly, and one has 4 channels (primary and 3 sub-channels) all tuning to an invalid channel number!

    Update: THIS part of the mystery is solved - it was a timing issue after all - I did a re-scan to verify antenna channels on the "good" box, and now those 4 channels are screwed up on that box too! Definitely a Bad_Rovi lineup problem. (I am just leaving the original part of this post below for continuity.)

    BOTH boxes did receive a message dated today, Fri 1/26 saying the Channel List Has Changed (they added another bogus channel). The one that is still working fine made the last connection this morning around 0230. The box that is not tuning correctly made the last connection this morning around 0630 when I re-ran Guided Setup, but I know it was showing tuning problems with those particular channels yesterday as well, so it is improbable that the issue is due to making a connection to the mother ship about 4 hours after the good box.
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2018
  9. V7Goose

    V7Goose OTA ONLY and Loving It!

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    New Mexico...
    OK, back to the OP's problem - your issue could be one of three different things:
    1. You could have an invalid channel selected, as I stated in post #5 above.
    2. Since you seem to be saying it USED to work and then stopped, it could be a new Bad_Rovi linup problem just as I found today.
    3. There used to be a bug in the TiVo code that caused duplicate channels in the channel list (same logical channel number AND channel call letters). I thought I finally got this fixed about 6 months ago, just before TiVo Margaret left, but maybe it is back? If this is your problem, that bug prevents you from being able to tune in the real channel, even though it is still in the channel list and is still checked.
    So here is what to check. First, look in your channel list to see if the offending channel is still shown correctly with a check next to it, and make sure no other channel with that same logical channel number is checked. You may see many channels with the same number, but as long as none of them are checked, it makes not difference (but you should never see two channels with the exact same number and call letters).

    Now, if everything looks right in the channel list, go back to Live TV and select that channel from your Guide. Now open the Diagnostics screen and see if at least one tuner shows that it is tuned to that particular logical channel number.
     
  10. shmelvin

    shmelvin New Member

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    Aug 25, 2017
    I have been on the phone for over an hour with a very combative tier 1 tech support agent, who tells me no channels will work with less than 90% signal strength, which is obviously total BS. She had me do a complete re-install which seemed to make things worse. Nothing has changed, the antenna hasn't moved and when directly plugged into the TV (No Tivo) all the channels work just fine. I can watch a channel with a signal of 44 without a problem but a channel with a signal of 66 doesn't work. This makes no sense. But! Tivo is sending me a new box, so lets see what happens?
     
  11. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    DId the local broadcasters change frequencies recently? With the recent FCC reverse auction, many broadcasters are changing frequencies this year. Or just taking the money and giving up their frequency completely and closing up shop. And until TiVo updates their info, you can't properly tune them.

    I just ran into this in the DC area this week. The CW station recently moved from their higher UHF frequency to a lower UHD frequency. So I needed to do a rescan to even see the channel. But without the info being updated by TiVo, it's pretty much useless for recordings from that channel. I guess unless I made a manual recording.
     
  12. V7Goose

    V7Goose OTA ONLY and Loving It!

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    Brief update on my issue - I submitted an on-line for the lineup problem yesterday. Although there has been no update to the problem report, all four of the local channels that were bad yesterday seem to be working fine for my Bolt this morning. No way of knowing if this was in response to my problem report or not.
     
  13. lawnmowerdeth

    lawnmowerdeth Drunk

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    I am having a similar problem that started about 2 weeks ago.

    This lineup is in St. Louis, MO

    Channel 24-1 through 24-5 all show correctly on the guide, but they have gotten mixed up.

    24-1 and 24-2 cannot tune the channel (v53)

    24-3 shows tunes in what should be on 24-1
    24-4 shows 24-2
    24-5 shows 24-3

    All internal TV tuners still get them all correctly.

    I've just submitted an online report as well.
     
  14. John Bob

    John Bob New Member

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    Feb 8, 2018
    This started happening to me on the same day that I installed Hydra. Maybe it's related, maybe not. I have to re-run channel scan, and guide setup to get them to come back, but for me it's only Fox. I can still see it when checking signal strength, channel plays fine. As soon as I go back to the guide and try and select it, it gives me the same saying, Problem with signal on this channel, blah, blah. Once I re-do it again, it will stay for what looks like a few days and then do it again. And yes, the multiple channel listings bug is back. I have to go into channel list, find the right ones, and deselect the others.
     
  15. shmelvin

    shmelvin New Member

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    Aug 25, 2017
    Tivo replaced the box and I still have the problem, plus it now sounds like a truck, so they are replacing it (Again)
    Tivo tells me that all signals have to have strength of 85 - 99 in order to work, which is total BS as not one of my signals is over 84 and I get a perfect picture on anything over 50.
    My issue is MeTv (44-1) it has a signal of 84 but no picture, it worked fine until about 4 weeks ago and now nothing, though as soon as I take the coax off the TiVo and put it on the TV it works fine. Tivo has absolutely no clue as to why it doesn't work. I am about ready to go back to cable as this little experiment is not really panning out.
     
  16. V7Goose

    V7Goose OTA ONLY and Loving It!

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    Your problem is NOT your hardware - it is a screwed up lineup from Bad_Rovi. We have given you plenty of information in earlier replies to help you pinpoint the issue and then request a lineup correction. Have you verified that the TiVo box is actually tuning to the correct broadcast frequency? Have you verified there are no other 44-1 channels in your channel list? Do you know for a fact what both the logical display channel number and broadcast channel numbers are for that station (have you checked the FCC license database to KNOW what frequency that specific channel is using, or gotten the same information from your TV diagnostics)? Have you SLOWLY gone through all of the channels in the Antenna Signal Strength screen to see if any of them show video for that channel?

    Understand that a specific digital channel is identified by three different things: the "display" channel number, such as your 44-1, the actual broadcast channel number, which may or may not be the same as the display channel (but usually not), and the actual broadcast frequency, such as "617000 KHz". The broadcast channel number and the frequency do correspond to the same thing, but the real frequency is generally not much help in troubleshooting these problems - you most often need to compare the display channel number shown in the Guide, and the broadcast channel number that is only shown in the TiVo Antenna Signal Strength screen. TiVo diagnostics unfortunately only shows you the display channel number and the true frequency in KHz. The primary channel and all sub-channels from a single broadcaster will ALL use the same broadcast channel number and frequency, even if the display channels are totally different.

    Generally MeTV is not a primary channel (suggested by the xx-1 channel number), so that indicates there are probably other stations from that same broadcaster that you can find and compare. For example, in my area, MeTV is a sub-channel under Telemundo, which is primary channel 2-1 on frequency 38 (in this case, TiVo incorrectly refers to the broadcast channel number as "[Freq 38]" in their communications). MeTV is also broadcast on physical channel 38, but they use display channel 15-1 instead of the expected 2-2, and Bad_Rovi had a very hard time understanding this; I had to file a lot of problem reports and give them detailed facts proving their problem before they finally fixed it.

    My horrible channel lineup from Bad_Rovi contains 15 different channels that are all defined using broadcast channel 38, but only four of them are real and display any video in the Antenna Signal Strength screen: Telemundo on 2-1, MeTV on 15-1, H&I on 29-1, and Movies! on 33-1. The other 11 BOGUS channels that are in the lineup using broadcast channel 38 are from hundreds of miles away and do not really exist in my area, but each of them will show a strong signal strength level but no video when tested. I am certain that is exactly what you are seeing.
     
    rdrrepair likes this.
  17. V7Goose

    V7Goose OTA ONLY and Loving It!

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    New Mexico...
    I know that last reply is long and probably confusing, so here is the dead simple way I would diagnose the same problem:
    1. Tune in the channel on my TV and write down the display channel, broadcast channel, and actual frequency from the TV diagnostics display.
    2. Tune in the channel on the TiVo and check the TiVo Diagnostics screen for a tuner showing the same display channel number (44-1 in your case). If that channel is not showing the exact same frequency as you saw in the TV diagnostics, you have found your problem.
     
    videobruce and rdrrepair like this.
  18. shmelvin

    shmelvin New Member

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    Aug 25, 2017
    Thanks V7 goose I now have a clue :)

    Here are the results
    Tivo = Channel 44-1 KFVV ...... TV = 44-1 KFVV
    Tivo signal 85 ...... TV signal 60
    TiVo Frequ 653000 ..... TV frequ 652989
    Tivo Modul 8VSB ...... TV modul 8VSB
    Tivo SNR 29 ...... TV SNR 31
    OK I see the frequency is off, how do I fix it?
     
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2018
  19. JoeKustra

    JoeKustra in the other Alabama TCF Club

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    The channel's call letters? KFFV?

    Physical channel 44 is 650Mhz to 656Mhz.

    KFFV - Wikipedia
     
  20. shmelvin

    shmelvin New Member

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    Aug 25, 2017
    Joe, yes the call letters are KFFV
    (KFFV is a commercial television station in Seattle, Washington, broadcasting locally on digital channel 44 as a Independent station branded as KFFV Television)
     

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