New "Tivo Online"

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by CIP54, Jun 9, 2015.

  1. Bierboy

    Bierboy Seasoned gas passer

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    But you still have to have a Mini? Because, on my network, I can't stream from my Premiere XL4...
     
  2. lew

    lew Well-Known Member

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    JMO, tivo has it backwards. I don't need TiVo online to view videos from hula,HBO etc on a PC. I'd like the functionality of tivo online on TiVo itself. Let TiVo access HBO so I can use HBO demand on my TV set via TiVo. A way to give use some of the VoD we're missing when we use TiVo instead of a cable company STB
     
  3. lpwcomp

    lpwcomp Well-Known Member

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    John's...
    A Mini? No. A Strean? Yes.
     
  4. rainwater

    rainwater Active Member

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    So far it is a good start. I still see some annoying UI quirks though:
    1) I have to login every day. It wouldn't be too bad but it tells me my Chromebook isn't supported (which I have to click to continue) yet everything works for it.
    2) It doesn't remember my default DVR after every login so I have to change it every time.
    3) Video quality seems pretty low for in-home streaming. Compared to my Slingbox, I can see a pretty huge difference. I'm sure this is a stream issue but if TiVo is going to stream to bigger devices than phones and tablets, they need to improve the highest stream quality.
    4) The default OnePass Manager UI screen is a screen to transfer OnePasses to different TiVos. Is this really that important that it needs to be the default OnePass Manager screen?
    5) My Shows doesn't remember sort order under Recordings. Having to re-sort every single OnePass every time I enter a folder is annoying.
     
  5. Bierboy

    Bierboy Seasoned gas passer

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    I'm sorry...yes, that's what I meant. Even if I had a stream, this really is not much in my book (until they make it useful on mobile devices....)
     
  6. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

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    Each of the mobile device environments have their own native app. Why would they make TiVo online available via mobile?

    Basically the same thing (mobile is a little more feature rich)
     
  7. MichaelAinNB

    MichaelAinNB Member

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    True. It'd be nice if TiVo became proactive rather than reactive. A "Hey, look at us!" company rather than a "Us, too, Us too!" company. Yes, the new website is a beauty compared to the old one. But c'mon, the bar was set pretty low. As you pointed out, TiVo online is simply doing everything other companies have been doing for quite some time.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015
  8. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    iOS and Android both have apps that can stream, both in and outside of the house.

    I'm not sure why there is an limitation on the browser thing for outside the home. At least for unprotected content. Protected content doesn't seem to work at all, even inside the home. I'm guessing that is a CableLabs limitation. It's my understanding that when playing a protected show on a PC you not only have to protect the content during decoding but you have to protect against screen scraping. Which is why MCE can only play protected shows full screen where they write directly to the video card. I'm not sure if Flash has that capability, so I'm not sure if they'll ever be allowed to play protected content via the browser.
     
  9. Bierboy

    Bierboy Seasoned gas passer

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    Without a stream? I can't stream anything from my TiVo on my iPad or iPhone; I don't have a Stream. That's what I'm talking about...too many hoops to jump through.
     
  10. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    The reason you need a Stream is technical. Most cable shows in the US are broadcast using the MPEG-2 video format. Most mobile devices, and the Flash plugin used for TiVo Online, require H.264 video. The stream has hardware in it that allows the MPEG-2 video to be trasncoded to H.264 so that it will play on the mobile device. Even those cable systems that use H.264 encoding use parameters that are not compatible with most mobile devices, so they to need to be transcoded to compliant specs before they will play on a mobile device.

    The TiVo itself does not have the hardware required to do that transcoding so the Stream is the only way to accomplish these features.
     
  11. NYHeel

    NYHeel Well-Known Member

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    You wrote,
    So bradleys explained to you that with a stream you can use it extremely well on mobile devices. So I'm not understanding your complaints.

    To summarize, first you basically said, the Stream isn't worth it cause it's not useful on mobile devices. Then after you were told that it's very useful on mobile devices you said there were too many hoops to jump through. What hoops? There's only one. Get a stream. That's the only hoop.
     
  12. MichaelAinNB

    MichaelAinNB Member

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    For some, actually probably for most, that's a pretty expensive hoop. Especially if one has already invested $150 in a Roamio.

    It seems TiVo is always a few steps behind in the technology world. Yes, they make a great DVR and maybe they should have just stayed with that. But they didn't. They wanted to give streaming giants like Roku, XBox and Apple TV a run for their money. That's fine, but they keep shooting themselves in the foot. They remind me of the driver who sees only to the end of the hood of his car and doesn't see the car 100 feet up the road who just slammed on his brakes. And instead of anticipating what should have been an avoidable crash, he slams into the car in front of him. TiVo keeps failing to see that car up the road. For example, when they devised the Premiere, why didn't they have the foresight to think, "Hey, maybe we should make this beefy enough to handle streaming services like Netflix and Hulu?" Instead, if I expect my Netflex, Hulu and Prime apps to load and perform reasonably, I'm told my "half decade old" Premier is outdated and I have to go out and buy the newest and greatest device. Ironically, other devices such as the Roku 2 and some older model PCs that are just as old as my "outdated" Premeire are able to function just as effectively today as they did fresh out of the box. I'm actually typing this post on a six year old HP Pavilion laptop and it handles all the newest and greatest technology Microsoft and other companies throw at it without any problem at all. Yet almost every time TiVo offers something new, it seems either an additional device or a newer model DVR has to be purchased in order for that service to perform in an acceptable fashion. I am wondering what service they're going to offer next that will require the purchase of the Roamio Pro Super Dooper Deluxe 2 DVR.
     
  13. Philmatic

    Philmatic Member

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    I was able to finally get this working (Seems like the people on the private Beta's were last to be turned on) :(

    Few thoughts:
    • It seems to be using Flash due to the requirement Encrypted HLS
    • It seems to be using an MPEG 2 TS container, but I suspect that is due to a Flash quirk. The codec itself appears to be very low bitrate H.264
    • It totally respects the CCI byte, making this almost useless for Cox and Time Warner customers
    • Doesn't do anything weird in regards to networking, if you can get yourself on your home network via VPN or even SSH Tunneling and SSL VPN, it works great
    • Quality is pretty bad, I expect this wasn't tuned much and the Flash Player is the culprit. It's workable though
    • It's very fast, similar to Netflix, which is pretty impressive since it's encoding on the fly
    Screenshot of chrome dev tools:
    [​IMG]

    Still of The Tonight Show:
    [​IMG]
     
  14. Dan203

    Dan203 Super Moderator Staff Member TCF Club

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    MPEG-2 TS is a container. MPEG-2 and MPEG-4 are not actually video codecs, they're complete specs containing multiple standards designated by parts. People commonly refer to MPEG-2 as a video codec, but it's actually MPEG-2 part 2 that contains the video specification. In MPEG-4 there are actually 2 video codecs. MPEG-4 part 2 is the original one, which is what DivX/Xvid was based on, and MPEG-4 part 10 is H.264. Both specs also define audio formats, some captioning stuff, and a few other odds and ends.

    Anyway my point is that H.264 video can be stored in an MPEG-2 TS container. In fact that's how HLS works. It uses TS files broken up into small chunks, like 10 seconds long, so that you can randomly access any section of the video by simply skipping to the file that contains the segment you're seeking to. It uses a playlist file with the names of all the TS chunks and their starting time code to organize everything.
     
  15. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

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    Frankly, I am not understanding your argument points. You said iyou didn't see that this would bring you any value until it works on mobile devices.

    Of course mobile devices have feature rich mobile apps.

    Now your complaint is that you can't use the mobile apps because you don't own a stream. Exact same issue with the TiVo online app.

    So, I think it is safe to conclude that you are upset that any streaming functionality offered by TiVo requires the streaming hardware. And you don't have the hardware and don't want to buy the hardware.

    Very little value in your complaints - with the possible exception of making you personally feel better.
     
  16. Bierboy

    Bierboy Seasoned gas passer

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    I did NOT say the Stream is not worthy it. I said this feature is not worth it. Here is what I said "Even if I had a stream, this really is not much in my book (until they make it useful on mobile devices....) And what I meant is useful WITHOUT having to use a Stream. To clarify that comment, I followed up with a comment on too many hoops to jump through so you obviously ignored that comment...
     
  17. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

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    Not really worth debating what you meant or said, I still don't get your point.

    I think you agree that both the mobile apps and TiVo Online have very similar functionality. They allow you to view the guide, manage your recordings, setup a Onepass and pretty much any management task you might want to do on your TiVo.

    On top of all that TiVo management functionality - TiVo allows you to stream content from the tivos to the respective apps. (As long as you have a TiVo Stream on your network). The browser version is hobbled OOH for the time being and all will struggle somewhat with copy protected content.

    The TiVo stream... Too many hoops to use streaming services? Well, if too many hoops is $127 purchase price - then yes, it has too many hoops.

    That is the same hoop before TiVo Online came out as it was after TiVo Online came out. Soo...

    I still don't get your point.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2015
  18. Leo_N

    Leo_N Lucky 200 member

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    So. Awesome.

    Just what I had wanted. Or at least close enough! It's beautiful being able to stream TiVo directly to my left monitor while working on my right monitor. Had been considering getting a TiVo Mini for just this purpose. It's small and windowed, but I'm fine with that, at least for now.
     
  19. siratfus

    siratfus Active Member

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    You need to navigate to the tabs that says MY SHOWS, then RECORDINGS. Connecting us a third party is just in addition to being able to view our own recordings.

    This feature has made my slingbox obsolete. I use it to sling in my garage when I'm doing work, no longer need the slingbox.
     
  20. siratfus

    siratfus Active Member

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    LOL! That's exactly my set up in my garage.
     

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