Need to ask more (and the correct) Questions - Don't get Lazy....

Discussion in 'TiVo Roamio DVRs' started by CrimsnTide, Jun 11, 2019.

  1. CrimsnTide

    CrimsnTide New Member

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    Just a short story to make sure everyone knows to ask the RIGHT questions about purchasing USED TiVo's - on E-Bay, Craigslist or wherever....

    I'm in the weaning process of cutting the cord. I called and cancelled DirecTV. I'm tired of trying to keep up with the accounts on when the discounts expire, when to call, cancel or beg for them to "lower my bill"... I'm the weak one and was willing to convert to BASIC cable for awhile before I cut that out too. In doing so I was looking for another TiVo to hook up to an existing cable feed - since I already have Internet through Spectrum. I found a Roamio Pro on EBay. Price was a little spendy, but I contacted the seller and asked if it needed a subscription. bisagni,The seller on EBay (from New York) was quick to respond and say "No Subscription required".... NO SUBSCRIPTION REQUIRED...... I have been looking around ebay for awhile and have contacted numerous sellers who most responded to my questioning. If not, I left the auction alone. Apparently I got lazy on this and ASSUMED bisagni and I were on the same page. I made an offer, he countered and we agreed on the price. bisagni was fast to ship and I was actually surprised on how well it was packaged, especially for it not being in the original box. Well, when I went to add onto my account, the TiVo rep said it's NOT activated and I would need to pay for a subscription. I contacted bisagni and told him that it's NOT activated and I cannot add to my account unless I subscribe to TiVo. His reply was that USED the unit without a subscription and that I can too. "No Subscription required" now had a new meaning. I told bisagni that it cannot be used the way it was intended to be used and that I couldn't even put it on my account without subscribing. NO refunds is what he is claiming. I even wrote on my PayPal payment that "This Payment was for 1 Tivo Roamio Pro with LIFETIME service and that could be activated on my account" His response (after taking my payment) was that "was not his ad" Going thru the process now with EBay, Paypal, but I think they'll turn their heads and not do anything. I felt he had enough decent feedback (not anymore).

    So bottom line, don't get lazy and don't play a word game with potential sellers. Some will lie, cheat and sell their soul for a little cash. This piece of Sh*$ should rot. Joseph bisagni from New York should not be trusted if you come across is auctions. He doesn't seem to do a lot, but just in case. Who knows, since he has already lied and cheated on this simple transaction. Be diligent, because most of the crooks and dishonest people are too....
     
  2. krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Link to auction page?
     
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  3. waynomo

    waynomo My One Time TCF Club

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    Definitely shady.

    Technically it doesn't need a subscription. However, it's not a very practical door stop.

    In spirit he definitely misled you.
     
  4. waynomo

    waynomo My One Time TCF Club

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    Can you dispute on PayPal?
     
  5. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    Just start with eBay, reporting “not as described”. If that doesn’t encourage him to take it back, you’ll ultimately win the dispute anyway. Painful and time consuming I know, but there’s no reason you should be stuck with this.
     
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  6. CrimsnTide

    CrimsnTide New Member

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    As requested here's the link:

    TiVo Roamio Pro DVR 3TB for sale online | eBay

    Ad doesn't say one way or another. I made contact with the seller.
    As the title reads, a potential buyer should ask probably MORE and thorough questions to eliminate any "word games"....

    (Actual Messages exchanged from me and the Seller (bisagni):

    ME: Does this box require a monthly subscription?
    Seller (bisagni): No subscription required

    After unit was purchased and received:

    Me: I received the TiVo from your auction. When I called TiVo to add to my existing account - they informed me that a SUBSCRIPTION IS REQUIRED. I CANNOT tell you how disappointed I am especially when I contacted BEFORE I placed my offer. The response from you is below “No subscription required”. I even wrote this on my PayPal payment: Payment was made for 1 (ONE) TiVo Roamio Pro (3TB) DVR tcd840300 6 tuner dvr w/ remote with a LIFETIME subscription (No subscription required) as noted by seller. Tivo is to be activated on my personal TiVo account,
    I would like a refund - and reimbursement for the shipping charges back to you. SUBSCRIPTION IS REQUIRED! See below! Please respond and let me know how to proceed.

    Seller (bisagni): No subscription required

    Seller (bisagni): You can use it without a subscription. Record and play your own shows. That is how I used it.

    Seller (bisagni): You asked if it needs a subscription to be used. Tivo can be used with or without a subscription. I’m sorry you don’t want to use it without the guide. There are no refunds.


    So the messages just continued back and forth. Him now calling me a Madman. I have contacted Ebay (Good Luck), PayPal (Good Luck), MasterCard (Good Luck) and will contact USPS (Good Luck)

    So if you come across a Joseph bisagni out of Montauk N.Y., just stay away from anything he is selling - or renting, or trading. He's untruthful and will probably lie to you about what your actually getting....
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
  7. tatergator1

    tatergator1 Well-Known Member

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    The listing seems fine for what it is. The transcript of the question you sent with answers introduces a little gray area into the debate. However, he never claimed it had Lifetime, nor advertised it as such.
     
  8. CrimsnTide

    CrimsnTide New Member

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    Yes, for what it is... It didn't say ANYTHING about "Subscription", "Lifetime" "All-In"...... However, I did make contact with the seller and asked about a "monthly subscription being required." His response was "No Subscription Required"...
    And the reason for posting.... I can see where I am NOT going to get my money back. I got lazy and did not word my questions correctly. Right? Wrong? Truthful? Dishonest? Is it REALLY a gray area????? Just something to think about when purchasing something (online). I would NEVER mis-lead someone to sale something. I don't feel the SELLER was truthful. When I paid him, I wrote in the text area PayPal allows this:

    Payment was made for 1 (ONE) TiVo Roamio Pro (3TB) DVR tcd840300 6 tuner dvr w/ remote with a LIFETIME subscription (No subscription required) as noted by seller. Tivo is to be activated on my personal TiVo account,

    His response was "That was not his ad" - and he's right. I ASSUMED it was a lifetime. But he took the payment and I am ASSUMING he knows I cannot register on my account - without a SUBSCRIPTION. But he took the cash KNOWING what I was expecting. Gray area? Sure.

    A play on words (Or just plain deceitful). Just a cautionary tale for those who are interested....
     
  9. waynomo

    waynomo My One Time TCF Club

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    Are there any shows on it or did he do a clear and delete?

    Any chance TiVo would tell you the former history? Did it ever have a subscription?

    Do people really use a TiVo the way he describes it?
     
  10. waynomo

    waynomo My One Time TCF Club

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  11. CrimsnTide

    CrimsnTide New Member

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    WayNoMo - This was to be more of a informative type post and not one to actually direct retaliation. I'd prefer just to accept it as a lesson learned - and hopefully someone can maybe learn from it too. Expensive on my part, but hopefully a cheap experience if others can maybe benefit? I appreciate the gesture and know it's well meant, but won't make the world any better by retaliating. Although not religious by any means, I do want to believe in Karma....

    As far as the shows on the unit, after learning from TiVo it could not be registered unless subscribed to, I did NOT pursue it with my cable company in obtaining a cable card and did not even hook up. Still disgusted (and disappointed). Although cutting the cord will pay off in the long run, it's an expensive venture. I purchased a OTA Roamio recently that was transferred to my account and works beautifully! Maybe that flawless transaction blinded my best judgment.... Thanks
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
  12. ThAbtO

    ThAbtO TiVoholic by the bay TCF Club

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    He may have been using it without a subscription, but its also a lie about it being able to record. Unless, it was disconnected from the network after the initial setup and never got the no subscription status which would disable everything.

    Another thing, you said you was going to cut the cord. Well, a Roamio Pro is a bad choice as it is cable service only. Cutting the cord usually means going away from any paid TV service and mostly going to antenna.
     
  13. waynomo

    waynomo My One Time TCF Club

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    That's part of what I was trying to get at. His statements seem very convenient and I am questioning the veracity.
     
  14. waynomo

    waynomo My One Time TCF Club

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    Does anybody know what the same unit goes for on eBay?
     
  15. tatergator1

    tatergator1 Well-Known Member

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    I looked at some completed listings to ballpark it earlier today as I'm way out of touch on the used market right now. Lifetime Roamio 6-tuners seems to be in the $200-$400 range depending on hard drive size. A 3TB like this listing with Lifetime would probably sell in the $350 range right now.
     
  16. CrimsnTide

    CrimsnTide New Member

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    Well, cutting the cord has me going through a little bit of withdrawals. My hope on obtaining a cable unit only would be to satisfy my addiction to watching sports when I am able to. I had planned on Spectums Choice plan. As mentioned, I had already picked up a Roamio OTA w/Lifetime and it does a great job. I'm just a little selfish about losing out on my viewing some of the sports programming.... I was hoping to use both until I could be weaned off my sports shows.... DirecTV was OVER $170 month. Going Spectrum for internet AND cable would be HALF that. A good compromise - for now...

    I had a max limit set and I knew the price I paid was below that, but after asking about needing a subscription, I thought we both (Seller AND BUYER) were on the same page. He of course was thinking another way.

    I've already got a card reader for the OTA mod, but having four tuners is pushing the limits in our household.... I was just thinking of getting another OTA OR a cable ready box - but it MUST have a ALL IN/Lifetime plan...
     
  17. mdavej

    mdavej Well-Known Member

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    Ahh, I see now. You're not on very solid ground for a dispute, as you well know. Seller was definitely misleading in his messages, but was technically correct. No subscription is required if you use it as a door stop.

    Thanks for the warning. I've been burned many times buying Tivos and other Tivo related devices on ebay in spite of taking lots of precautions. Luckily all my bad transactions ultimately worked out in my favor.

    I say cut your losses and relist this one, then go for an OTA with lifetime that you confirm with Tivo and the TSN BEFORE you click that BIN button.
     
  18. krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Personally, I’d file a claim to get my money back. The box requires a subscription to function as advertised.

    Per the eBay Money Back Guarantee:

    If the item you received doesn't match the description in the original listing, or if it arrived faulty or damaged, you're covered under the eBay Money Back Guarantee. You can return it even if the seller's returns policy says they don't accept returns.

    (link)
     
  19. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    The emails back and forth are likely available and are misleading, but frankly any listing which does not clearly say the unit has "LIFETIME" or "All in" service I would never even try to deal with. Anyone here knows that it is only the units which have lifetime service which are really worth much. Good luck, but get smart if you can return it.
     
  20. 53richart

    53richart New Member

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    Since it seems to be a bit of a gray area, perhaps you can negotiate a return for a partial refund. At least you wouldn't be out the whole amount.
     

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