Moving to FiOS+Premiere. Need some advice, please.

Discussion in 'TiVo Premiere DVRs' started by brianfuchs, Jan 25, 2012.

  1. brianfuchs

    brianfuchs New Member

    Apr 24, 2003
    I am almost ready to pull the trigger, switching from DirecTV (and my beloved Series 2 TIVOs) to FIOS and TIVO Premiere.

    I already have a FIOS installation that is only being used for Internet service.

    So, on the Verizon side, I am moving to a Triple Play service, and on the TIVO side, I will be purchasing several Premiere XLs.

    My question is in regards to what my wiring options are.

    Currently, I have Coax running from my Verizon ONT to my media closet. I do not have a CAT5E going out to the ONT and frankly I'd rather not add one, unless there is a very strong case for it.

    My Verizon router is located in the media closet, and from that closet I distribute Coax and Ethernet to the locations of most of the TVs. One TV location only has a Coax. Ethernet would be a difficult run, but I could use WiFi for it.

    1) What needs to go to the TIVO boxes - Coax? CAT5E? Either? Both?

    I'm not sure if this is correct, but what I'm envisioning is that in the media closet, the Coax coming from the ONT will need to be split, with one going to the router and the other going to my Coax distribution. These Coax lines will connect to the TIVOs. I believe this would be the case, because my Verizon router doesn't have a Coax Out.

    What I'm not understanding is if the TIVOs also need to connect via Ethernet. Remember, I have one TIVO that will not have easy access to Ethernet. I don't mind having that one connect via WiFi.

    I am completely unfamiliar with the whole concept of MoCA, but I've heard horror stories involving the MoCA bridge.

    2) I have heard people say that CAT6 from the ONT is better than Coax. Is there really a discernible difference?

    3) My house has RG6 coax throughout - This is the requirement for FIOS, right?


  2. DonaldBurns65144

    DonaldBurns65144 Member

    Jan 10, 2011

    1st off there's a search function on this site to reduce repeating the same threads over and over.

    That said, with FIOS you can use an Elite model and coax if you go with MOCA. (search!), but with Premiere or Premiere XL you can also go with MOCA, but will need an MOCA adapter. Or you need to supply video via coax plus network either wired or wireless (with wireless adapter). Again search. OTA signals only with those two also since Elite does not have OTA tuner. Search regarding M card and FIOS for details on making that work.
  3. ciscokid

    ciscokid Member

    Jan 14, 2003
    For my Tivo and Fios I have Coax for the picture and use a wireless adapter for the internet which is quite adequate but you can also use wired ethernet cable should you choose to.
  4. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

    Oct 31, 2007
  5. Quake97

    Quake97 New Member

    Apr 24, 2006
    Southeastern PA
    I second the MOCA adapters. They actually cost less than the TiVo wireless adapters and let you hook up more than one thing, like your tv or other equipment, as long as your have spme switches around Plus you don't have to deal with wireless interference. I'm going to be getting some of these adapters.

  6. herbman

    herbman Member

    Apr 8, 2008
    For the original question, whether you have coax or cat5 to the ONT, you still get Ethernet and coax out of the actiontec router. The outbound cable type makes very little difference with anything, except maybe a tiny bit of latency on the Internet.

    If you have ethernet to most rooms use it, and for the cost of MOCA adapters I would simply just get an elite in the room without hard Ethernet. Or just use wifi.
  7. rage777

    rage777 Member

    Aug 19, 2006
    Not sure if anybody really answered question 2. You don't need to have anything other than the coax from the ONT to the router. The way I have it is, the coax from the ONT goes to my attic and splits to all the other coax cables in the house. From one of those coax cables I have my main Actiontec Fios router on it.

    I am a little confused about one of your statements, because you mention Verizon and Triple Play. Not sure why, but Verizon likes to make like Verizon and FIOS are two completely different companies. If you call Verizon internet support for FIOS, they will tell you to call a different number. So if this is the FIOS Triple Play, then for question one, you have to have a coax to your Tivo. If you have a CAT5 cable going to your Tivo, then you won't need a MoCA adapter. I have an older home, so no CAT5 cables throughout the house so I use MoCA adapter all over the place.
    The reason people buy the Actiontec routers and convert them to the MoCA adapters is simple, they are a lot cheaper than any other MoCA adapter. I have bought 5 of them from ebay for $20 to $35. When it goes above that, I usually look for another one. Don't buy the really old ones that look like huge bricks. And like Quake said, you can hook up more than just one thing to the adapter. I have my Tivo, A/V receiver, Blu-ray, and WD TV Live on one of my adapters.
    For question 3, yes.
  8. brianfuchs

    brianfuchs New Member

    Apr 24, 2003
    Thanks for the advice. Here is a diagram of how I think the system will be set up. Thick lines represent Coax. Red is Ethernet. Blue is HDMI. The FIOS router is the Actiontec (they just sent me the newest model because my old one crapped out after 7 years). The bridge would also be an Actiontec. Again, all coax is distributed from the media closet, which is also where the Router is located.

    If this seems correct, one question I have is regarding the Elite in Room 1. Is there any advantage of connecting the switch to the Ethernet in of the Elite, or is it better to use the internal MoCA bridge?

    Also, there shouldn't be any issue with passing the TIVOs through the A/V receivers, right? The receivers have 1080 upscaling, and will pass 3D.
    And I just noticed I referred to the output of the Wii as HDMI (clearly that is wrong, but you get the idea...)

  9. rage777

    rage777 Member

    Aug 19, 2006
    It looks correct to me.

    As for your question, I don't think it matters. The problem is that all the Premiere Tivos and the Actiontec routers are limited to 100MB/s, while the Elite is a Gigabit. So unless you convert more of your Tivos to Elites or get a MoCA router that has a Gigabit port, you are pretty much stuck at 100MB/s.
  10. aadam101

    aadam101 Tell me a joke

    Jul 14, 2002
    I wouldn't spend that much. Old Verizon Actiontec routers can be used in the same way and provide a wireless access point too (if needed).

    You may even be able to convince Verizon to just give you one. Before I went with MoCa, I tried to give my Verizon router back since I wasn't using it. They literally wouldn't take it. They insisted that I keep it. These routers seem to have very little value to them.
  11. bradleys

    bradleys It'll be fine....

    Oct 31, 2007
    @ aadam101 - that was two units for $50...

    That was a better deal then I got! :rolleyes:
  12. brianfuchs

    brianfuchs New Member

    Apr 24, 2003
    So I just pulled the trigger...

    Bought an Elite and 3 XLs from Amazon. They were each discounted $50, so I was able to get a 4-year Square Trade warranty on each for the same price the non-warrantied TiVOs would have cost from the TiVO store.
    I also ordered a single Actiontec converter.

    Next Step - order the Triply Play upgrade....
  13. captmiddy

    captmiddy New Member

    Sep 22, 2002
    One thing to note, MOCA is faster than the ethernet ports on the Actiontec. MOCA is 250M approximately, while the Actiontec ethernet ports are 100M. So there is a small advantage to sticking with MOCA if you have other MOCA devices connected. I use 2 MOCA devices in conjunction with my Actiontec to distribute network around my house and it is faster than distribution off the Actiontec. It is also a lot cheaper than trying to build a network by rewiring your house, which is where I started and still have 8 year old holes in the wall where I want to finish but just haven't had the time or energy.

    If it wasn't for the fact that TiVO won't migrate lifetime service off old boxes anymore I would go with one additional premiere myself to gain room to room streaming. I have a Series 2, HD Tivo and a Premiere. I also have a lifetime on a Series 1 and an additional dead Series 1. You would think with all this business I send them they could cut me a break on a new line of service ;-).
  14. aadam101

    aadam101 Tell me a joke

    Jul 14, 2002

    Didn't realize it was for two. There is still an advantage over buying the Verizon Actiontec routers. You can also use them as wireless access points. I had a really though time with my previous setup (constantly having to reboot everything) to keep the access point up and running. I don't have that problem with MoCa. I have MoCa in six rooms. I have a wireless signal from the main router and I have one MoCa adapter also providing a wireless signal. For people with large houses, it's a perfect solution. I was skeptical that it would work so well but it really is a flawless setup. I get great internet speeds in every room in my house with zero problems. I didn't have to run any wires. I bought a few 3' ethernet cords. That's it. Simple and flawless.

    I didn't have that before MoCa and I'm thankful that I learned about it on this forum.
  15. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

    Jan 31, 2002
    It's still better for the ONT to be used with Ethernet output than MoCA. If your FiOS MOCA router goes down than your service can be down until they get you a replacement. With Ethernet, you can easily replace the router yourself. Limiting any downtime you have.
    Although I've been running Ethernet from my ONT for around 4.5 years and my uptime has been way over 99.999%
  16. wkearney99

    wkearney99 Bill Kearney

    Dec 5, 2003
    Unless you have set top boxes that require MOCA. Those require having a MOCA connection AND proper DHCP and routing settings. It's possible to set up a non-MOCA router with adapters to support those boxes but it's non-trivial to configure. There's not a lot wrong with the Actiontec routers provided by Verizon for FIOS. They do the job pretty well. I've run both kinds of configurations. While there's something to be said for 'having your own router' for most people it won't be necessary. Having a straight ethernet connection from the ONT, however, is useful and I'd certainly encourage people to get that instead of a coax connection from the router to the outside box. The installer will likely try to talk you out of it, do not let them. It makes no difference in how all of the FIOS services work whether there's a coax or ethernet connection to the ONT. But coax to the router does reduce your opportunities for using your own router in the future. Otherwise you'd have to pay Verizon to make the switch at a later date. You may be able to avoid a truck roll if you pulled your own CAT5E wire from your router to the ONT. But since it's free either way during the initial setup, just go with ethernet from the start.

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