Largest drive Edge will format itself

Discussion in 'TiVo Edge' started by tommage1, Jun 16, 2020.

  1. dianebrat

    dianebrat wait.. I did what? TCF Club

    13,550
    2,621
    Jul 6, 2002
    boston'ish

    Advertisements

    Yes, they came out with that two months ago when they got caught.
     
    mrsean likes this.
  2. philco782

    philco782 Active Member

    205
    100
    Sep 27, 2014
    Florida
    Well, so far it looks like Comcast has cut down their bandwidth to about 4 megabits/second for most channels, almost 7 megabits/second for the local network affiliates. So worst case scenario, the Tivo might be writing 6 x 7 mbps streams continuously, 42 megabits/second, /8 = 5.25 megabytes per second.

    In that light, a SMR drive may be able to keep up with the Tivo... It'll be a busy ass drive, rewriting shingles continuously all day long... So I wonder, there has to be a bitrate where a SMR drive becomes saturated to the point where it can't rewrite shingles fast enough and then there is no option left but dropping video frames, or making a host device (Tivo) that is not SMR aware to basically error out.
     
    tommage1 likes this.
  3. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

    23,614
    1,277
    Jan 31, 2002
    Northern...
    SMR can definitely cause a major issue for writing a bunch of stuff to the drive.
     
  4. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

    1,983
    466
    Nov 5, 2008
    Very interesting detailed information. I was surprised when Tivo came out with the Edge and found they were using an "AV rated" SMR drive. Was more surprised when some users popped in 5TB 2.5 "storage" type SMR drives and they worked, well at least they format and boot up. BUT as you say, in a Tivo any SMR drive will be "a busy ass drive". Even if it works. Soooooooo, why not just use an external CMR drive? Since it has been found the Edge will format at least 10TB itself. Very easy upgrade, probably $40 or less for parts (not counting the drive). While the Edge has not been out long enough to see how drives will last, I'd take bets that a 3.5 CMR drive will outlast ANY SMR drive in an Edge, we shall see, at least 2-3 years before will know (unless the stock drive starts failing earlier). Bolt and Edge drive issues are bad, because you cannot keep backup drives and even if you download to computer cannot transfer back if on TE4. With an Edge TE4 is the only option too.
     
  5. chiwolve

    chiwolve New Member

    9
    11
    Jan 25, 2014

    Advertisements

    Happy to report my 14TB external 3.5 drive formatted and worked on Edge. Thanks to all on this forum. 20200711_160046.jpg
     
  6. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

    1,983
    466
    Nov 5, 2008
    Interesting, I wonder if there is any limit at all? Also wondering if this is Edge only or if TE4 on Roamio or Bolt will also format large drives over 3TB, maybe some TE4 update changed this. I'll bet jmbach would like to see an mfsinfo on the drive.
     
  7. waterandland

    waterandland New Member

    18
    4
    Mar 2, 2020
    How do I get MFSR Formatting Tool Program on a bookable CD ? I need to format a 4TB internal hard drive for a Tivo Bolt OTA.
     
  8. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

    1,983
    466
    Nov 5, 2008
    Have you tried just letting the Bolt format it? It's POSSIBLE a software update may allow the TE4 Bolt OTA to format over 3TB itself. If not for MFSR you may be able to download the ISO and burn to a CD? Is there some reason you want a bootable CD, you can just install it in Windows, then hookup the drive and run it. You'd have to read the procedure for MFSR, it's very easy, pretty much let the Bolt format the drive itself, pull it when it gets to guided setup screen, hook up to computer and run MFSR, then put back in the Tivo and continue.

    I assume you are starting fresh? If not swapping drives around in a Bolt can lose everything, even if you don't alter the original drive. If you want to keep recordings/settings off current drive you'd have to use MFST.

    By the way you posted this in the wrong place, this thread is for the Edge for starters. Questions about upgrading/expanding etc should go in the Tivo upgrade forum The MFSR and MFST guys monitor that forum.
     
  9. 3 Cushion John

    3 Cushion John Member

    60
    14
    Oct 15, 2019
    I posted my success on another thread. Easy peasy full 5T.
     
  10. ford85

    ford85 New Member

    1
    0
    Mar 22, 2016
    There is an adapter available on AMAZON Male to female SATA
     
  11. Bane7

    Bane7 New Member

    15
    1
    Jun 23, 2016
    Audiophiletom likes this.
  12. tasi

    tasi TiVoing since 2000

    24
    6
    May 10, 2002
    SF/Bay Area...
    I was able to replace the 2TB drive with a 10TB and a Rosewill enclosure, thanks everyone for posting instructions.

    This is the 10TB drive I'm using:
    WD Red Pro 10TB NAS Internal Hard Drive - 7200 RPM Class, SATA 6 Gb/s, CMR, 256 MB Cache, 3.5" - WD102KFBX
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B084F34HZ6/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

    And the enclosure I used:
    Rosewill RX-358 U3C BLK External 3.5" Hard Drive Enclosure to USB 3.0/eSATA
    Rosewill RX-358 U3C BLK External 3.5" Hard Drive Enclosure to USB 3.0/eSATA, Aluminum & Plastic, Built-in Cooling Fan and Fan Switch, Support 3.5" SATA III/II/I Hard Drive up to 8TB and UASP Function - Newegg.com

    A few bumps along the way, initially I just booted the Edge with the 10TB drive, got to the guided setup and then encountered a boot loop screen that said it was reimaging.

    So I popped the original 2TB drive back in just to make sure the Edge was working ok, it was.

    Took the WD 10TB drive and enclosure and plugged it into my USB 3.0 port on my Win 10 PC, used WD Tools to erase the drive and then plugged it back into the Edge and everything seems to be working fine now.

    I also disconnected the blue leds in the enclosure, no annoying blue light anymore.

    The only issue I have with the Edge now is the remote won't pair via RF, I can only use it in IR mode.

    Here's a pic of my setup, I used some velcro to attach the enclosure to the top of the Edge so it doesn't slide around.

    IMG_3360.png
    IMG_3363.png
    IMG_3365.png
    IMG_3364.png
    IMG_3366.png
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2020
    waynomo, preilly44, mllacey and 3 others like this.
  13. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

    1,983
    466
    Nov 5, 2008
    Very nice setup. The "pro" drive has a 5 year warranty also if purchased from a WD authorized seller (maybe register it?)

    As for the remote, not sure what you have tried. Try resetting it completely, there are instructions, maybe under "help"? Then make sure there are no other Tivos (at least ones that use RF) anywhere close when trying to pair. The remote will try to pair with any Tivo (or maybe even other RF device) that is within range. Unplug any other Tivos or maybe move this one to another room after resetting the remote, an actual reset, not just removing batteries. While doing if you are going to be using any other Tivos near this one not a bad idea to set the IR number to something other than zero too. Even when remote set to RF occasionally I see the red light for a short time, when that happens it is using IR and could control other Tivos in IR range. I have multiple Tivos in the same room so even though all paired to it's own RF remote I set the IR numbers different for each Tivo too.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2020
    tasi likes this.
  14. keithg1964

    keithg1964 Ragonk

    230
    87
    Feb 2, 2006
    Texas
    My experience with pairing RF remotes with TiVos:
    • Want to pair with TiVo #1: Unable to pair with TiVo #1 not matter what procedure or steps I take.
    • Want to use with TiVo #2: Remote will pair with TiVo #1 instantly and continue to re-pair with #1 not matter what I do.
     
    tasi likes this.
  15. waterandland

    waterandland New Member

    18
    4
    Mar 2, 2020
    I purchased the Tivo Edge 2TB 4 Tuner. Today, I opened up the Tivo Edge. Took out the 2TB Drive and successfully upgraded the internal drive with an INTERNAL 4 TB Toshiba Hard Drive. That's right! An internal 2.5 Hard Drive Sata III 6gbs 5400 RPM. I found that Tivo systems do quite well with Toshiba internal 2.5 HDD Sata III 6gbs drives. Also, best of all, Tivo Edge completely formatted the drive completely itself. Attached, you can see the proof that it works.
     

    Attached Files:

  16. deepthinker

    deepthinker Member

    173
    3
    Oct 25, 2002
    DFW, TX
    Well, been hanging in with my two, 6 tuner, 4TB self-upgraded Roamio Plus units since 7/2014, also running Hydra since first beta release on both and have still felt good with them (really okay with Hydra, like it, and don’t get a lot of the hate, but did buy and stop using a Bolt not long after it’s release within months after, because of heat, quirks, you name it. Bolt really was a POS release from TiVo). Recently though, noticed our “main” heaviest use Roamio has started having major sluggishness, just stops responding to remote input sometimes totally for a while, and from time to time has random reboots during heavy recording/playback ending up with missed minutes and two part recordings. (Main use Roamio has a ton of the wife’s saved ID crime shows, etc. and gets a mega workout, but it has issue and I catch hell. LOL)

    Anyway, worried about impending unit/disk failure on the main Roamio and with the summer sale, figured it was a no brainer to buy one of the new Edge boxes (all non-Tivo DVR’s don’t hold a candle even with some folks hate of Hydra). Having to do an external/internal hybrid connected HD upgrade to me is no big deal and from all accounts seems like Edge is a lot better hardware wise than Bolt. My Edge should be here in a few days followed in the next week with the SATA/eSata adapter (found in this thread), black Rosewill eSata enclosure (used one before for years and like them), and a “WD Purple 6TB WD60PURZ” drive. Went back and forth on the drive after reading about CMR drives and thought I might be safer there than the WD Red/Pro drives to make sure I get a CMR drive and price/size ratio was good. Anyway, will check back and post once it’s all hooked up. Thanks to all in this thread already for the guidance though!!
     
    Dan Cour likes this.
  17. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

    1,983
    466
    Nov 5, 2008
    Sounds to me like you've made all good decisions. The 3.5" purple is a great choice IMO. You did not mention the specific model # enclosure you are using. The only other choice to make is if you want to go Sata to the Esata port on the enclosure or Sata to the Sata port on the drive. All the upgrades I've read about here seem to use the Esata port on the enclosure. And seem to be working well. However for ME personally I always prefer Sata to Sata, avoid the electronics in the Esata port (some Bolt Sata to Esata upgrades failed after software updates, I did Sata to Sata and mine has withstood all updates). The Esata upgrade is "cleaner", cable connects to the Esata port so can be easily disconnected whenever need be. With Sata to Sata you'd have two cables that connect together, one coming from the Edge, one connected to the Sata port on the drive, run out of the enclosure, and connecting to the cable coming out of the Edge (appropriate male/femaie ends on the cables). Also you'd need separate power/data connection inside the enclosure so can hookup the Sata data connection and the power connection separately. Works great with my Bolt and enclosure, everything is closed up and fairly "neat". And never have to worry about a TE4 update "breaking" the Tivo due to electronics in the Esata port. Good luck, either should work ok based on what others have done. This is what mine looks like, Bolt not Edge:

    100_3647[1].JPG
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2020
  18. timeslide

    timeslide New Member

    5
    1
    Aug 1, 2004
    Tulsa, OK
    Help please. I bought a WD Red 6GB Drive (WD60EFAX). Brand new TiVo Edge (OTA). Used a double sided male to male SATA data and power adapter into the TiVo. Then a SATA data cable from that to the drive. Then a separate external power adaptor for the drive. When I turn on the TiVo it just freezes on the “Starting up” screen. Will work fine with the stock drive. Have tried two of these WD drives. Ran some quick diagnostics on my MAC. The drives seem fine.
     
  19. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

    1,983
    466
    Nov 5, 2008
    This is the first drive that has NOT worked with the Edge far as I know. Reason is probably it is one of those infamous Red drives that is SMR, WD switched some red drives to SMR without informing anyone (there are lawsuits). You most likely need to return the drives, current model 2-6 TB WD EFAX reds are the culprits. If you want to stick with WD go with a purple or the EFRX model red, not the EFAX. I'm PRETTY sure this is your issue assuming the upgrade with done correctly.

    Just to check, you are not using an external enclosure or Esata connection correct, Sata to Sata? Other thing you could try is fully format or better yet write zeros to the drive first. Am still guessing it's the SMR EFAX though.
     
  20. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

    1,983
    466
    Nov 5, 2008
    Oh. when people find out the WD red EFAX is SMR and won't work for certain applications most people (including myself) just say to go with the EFRX or the purple. But perhaps the best thing to do is get another brand, like Seagate. The NAS Ironwolf is not SMR, Seagate has not switched any of their NAS drives to SMR and claims they will not. Or the Seagate AV drive, Skyhawk I think it is called? Kind of a protest against WD for what they did, it has happened to people in TC, before it was announced what WD did, no one could figure out why those reds were not working. Probably cost some people a good amount of time and money, not to mention those who bought them to use in a NAS.

    My personal recommendation for drive upgrades is AV type drives (CMR highly preferred, not SMR), Skyhawk for Seagate, Purple for WD, not sure about other companies. NAS drives have NAS firmware, are specifically designed for NAS applications. A Tivo is not a NAS, it is an AV device, why not use a drive with AV firmware?
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2020

Share This Page

spam firewall

Advertisements