is the HD Tivo good enough?

Discussion in 'TiVo Series3 HDTV DVRs' started by jojodoesit, Oct 19, 2007.

  1. mrbreakit

    mrbreakit New Member

    Oct 21, 2007


    The flaws that you refer to are indeed intended TiVo features. Features that have been in the product for quite some time.

    Unlike many of the generic dvrs on the market, TiVo does not require the user to actively manage their hard drive. If the user wishes to do so, they can change the "Keep Until I Delete" setting when setting up a recording.

    If you have not already noticed, TiVo is a digital video recorder and its sole purpose in life is to record. When you are not actively using the box, the TiVo will record Suggestions for you. So, when you come home, you have a bunch of great movies and tv shows already on your hard drive. Suggestions are on by default; however, you can turn them off. Most likely, this is the reason for the channel changes. (and, the box may record advertising content that is broadcast on obscure channels late at night, but scheduled recordings take precedence). And, a possible solution to your problem may be to set up manual recordings (recording a channel with an arbitrary start and end time).

    Now, the TiVo can output video to a tv or any other device that accepts video input. But, the TiVo has no idea how a connected device will use the video stream. Outputting video to another device to be recorded is not a common use case, and certainly not a motivating factor for purchasing a TiVo.

    What external recording device are you connecting your TiVo to? Why not use that device to record your programs directly?
  2. YoungGemini

    YoungGemini Geek

    Jan 11, 2007

    Why don't you tell us a little more about your set-up?

    Is the Tivo connected directly into the cable line or antenna or is it receiving its video feed from another device that it controls?

    You've said you have the VCR plugged into the Tivo, is the VCR set-up to just record the whole night or are you using timers to control when its suppose to record?

    If your just doing a blanket record of the whole night, you might want to consider setting timers on the vcr (your tape will get a lot more good stuff that way).

    If your Tivo is plugged directly into a cable line or antenna then you may want to consider doing the same w/ the antenna jack on your vcr and you can just have your vcr record using its built in tuner.

    Here is an example of my set-up:
    • My cable line comes into my place, immediately splits off for where my living room TV is and the other to my cable modem.
    • Once it gets to my TV it is then split off again, one directly into my TV's analog tuner, once into my cable box (Comcast DVR which will be gone soon as my TivoHD arrives), once into my Tivo, once into a DVD Recorder, and once going into my bedroom.
    • The cable line in my bedroom is split between the Tivo and my other Tivo.

    Currently I can record 5 programs at once if needed (2-Comcast DVR, 2-Tivo-One program on each Tivo, 1-DVD Recorder).

    Also in the living room I have the cable box and Tivo feeding into an RCA switch which then feeds into the DVD Recorder, this way if I wanted to record something off the Tivo/Comcast DVR onto a DVD, I can set it to record just as you would a VCR, then I could still use the tuner on the DVD recorder to record something later.

    Now Jojo might be trying to do the same thing I did when I had DirecTV:
    I had my Tivo control the DirecTV receiver (I was renting a room, so didn't want to shell out the bucks for a DTivo), I then had my DVD recorder programmed to record off off the output of the Tivo when specific programming would come on using timers. I recorded about 2-3 hrs/night which I could then watch at work the following night. But to avoid getting a lot of useless late night TV programming, I set my DVD recorder to record at specific times when I knew good programming would come on (and reviewed my Tivo's todo list each week to verify stuff didn't change).

    The nice thing about cable is off 1 outlet, you can split and split.

    And before anyone comments about it degrading the signal, on my cable box I can watch all my premium stations and on-demand stations w/ picture perfect clarity.
  3. astrohip

    astrohip Well-Known Raconteur TCF Club

    Jan 6, 2003
    Ok, we get it. You've heard multiple responses, and continue to reply with the same complaints over & over. With absolutely no clue that you've been listening. Or learning. If you're not a troll (and I just don't get that trollie feel from you), you are certainly hard-headed. Which means you don't really need our help.

    What you call flaws, we call TiVo.

    /unsubscribe :rolleyes:
  4. ToddNeedsTiVo

    ToddNeedsTiVo Shampoo is not toxic

    Sep 1, 2003
    Ankeny, IA
    This thread is such a train wreck. I can't look away!

    Macro? You're not even using the word correctly! Perhaps you mean the noun form rather than the adjective: a single computer instruction that stands for a sequence of operations. A button "very large in scale or scope or capability" is completely ambiguous, but then again it's as nebulous as some of your other comments.

    You can't run the season pass manager correctly or find the slow motion button, but you want the implementation of macro sequences? Um, no. Negative.

    Once again, you need to let your TiVo manage the channel on the cable/sat box and quit recording things from it with other equipment. All this recording and can you watch all this stuff?

    If your TiVo is so full that you're losing recordings to newer ones, you're just not doing things right. I mean that logically and conceptually.
  5. doconeill

    doconeill Unix Guru

    Dec 13, 2002
    West of Boston


    Not a flaw - a very specifically intended procedure. You've told it to record more shows - it believes that the new shows are more important, since you have NOT stated that you want the old show specifically kept. It can be done automatically with your season passes, and with little effort on manual recordings.

    But frankly, it sounds like you are trying to use a TiVo for archival purposes, which is not its intended function, and its not TiVo's fault that it doesn't meet your needs. You are simply recording WAY too much.

    So buy a macro remote. This is not TiVo's problem to solve - the TiVo remote does not support macros at all.

    Again, as explained, Suggestions can be turned off very easily. The TiVo data downloads, etc. can be eliminated by removing the specific channels it records them off from your Channels I Receive list. Then it has no reason to change the channel, unless of course you told it to record something. Of course, the TiVo assumes total control of the input device - you should not be using another recording device that presumes it has control as well on the same device. Of course, you could ALSO

    Or doing as suggested, but you don't do that.

    It is now plainly obvious that you are a troll. You post twice in 13 months, complaining about the same thing. You don't respond to requests for more information, or suggestions. You simply reiterate your complaints despite the solutions offered. You have shown no willingness to "learn" as you claimed.

    I'm guessing you found that Slow button after 5 years, since you no longer list that among your "major flaws".
  6. jojodoesit

    jojodoesit New Member

    Sep 23, 2006

    Tivo has 3 major flaws, overwriting programs and changing channels when I'm recording with another device, unattended. The 18 minutes of info screens are totally lame.

    A macro (adj: very large in scale or scope or capability) button would solve the first problem and a policy change would solve the last two.

    Or if I could record 6 hrs off to another recorder every night, like any other DVR allows - my Sony, my Panasonic, my 2 different Toshiba models, that would be sufficient.

    No other DVR on the market has these flaws, and I was hoping that sometime soon new Tivos would be as functional as other DVRs have become.

    When I bought my Tivo there were very very few DVRs available.

    The Season Pass feature really is worth a lot, but it's not worth the premium you pay considering the numerous limitations (and many other small irritants which I didn't mention}.

    Tivo should study other DVRs and offer their capabilities as an option, it wouldn't require major changes, it's a no brainer.
  7. jojodoesit

    jojodoesit New Member

    Sep 23, 2006

    I guess Tivo didn't approve of my reply, it's been 2 days. Do they review all replies? If this gets posted I'll try again.
  8. ToddNeedsTiVo

    ToddNeedsTiVo Shampoo is not toxic

    Sep 1, 2003
    Ankeny, IA
    This has been so entertaining! I know it simply can't be for real because no rational person would be unable to grasp the concepts put forth in this thread.

    Back to the 18 minutes of menu display, eh? What in the world are you doing where you would care about that? Navigate away from the menus already! You act like you get stuck on the menu.

    I bet enduring a forced tune to an Amber Alert or weather warning on a CableCARD-enabled TiVo HD would really blow your mind.
  9. bareyb

    bareyb Under Maintenance TCF Club

    Dec 1, 2000
    Silicon Valley
    I'm gonna go with Troll. :p
  10. flc

    flc New Member

    Jul 27, 2007
    Read the header, where it says "this site is not part of TiVo, Inc"
  11. JYoung

    JYoung Series 3

    Jan 16, 2002
    Los Angeles
    The OP never saw the Slow button on the TiVo remote in over five years.
    Nor does he appear to have read the TiVo manual nor most of the responses to his "questions".

    You expect him to have seen that?
  12. mikesown

    mikesown New Member

    Nov 14, 2005
    "Good enough"? Yes. Great? No. Why? Because:
    - The menus are slow. Don't get me wrong- I know HD is very computationally intensive, but it's very annoying. Pressing a button and waiting 2 seconds for the menu to appear is a lot more frustrating than it sounds when it happens to you 20 times a day.

    - There's no 2-way communication. Though Tivo probably has something up its sleeves(think a dongle) to fix this, you will likely have to splurge(or rent) to get 2-way communication for SDV channels and on-demand.

    - The price. Yeah, Tivo is great and all, but is it really worth $250 + $17 a month with a contract, when a cableco DVR is $0 + $10 a month and no contract?

    Overall, I'd rate the Tivo HD as 'adequate.' It does what it needs to do(everything that's advertised), it does it better than the competition(that's not saying much), but it has major limitations and annoyances.
  13. Keith Mickunas

    Keith Mickunas New Member

    Jul 22, 2003
    Wylie, TX
    3 flaws now? No, they are features. Why don't you pay attention? Turn suggestions off, and set your season pass to the settings that suit you. Sorry you can't queue things up to transfer to a VCR, but that is just a feature no one but you wants. Like I said repeatedly, and you ignore, put a larger harddrive in it and you'll be fine. But if they copied they other manufacturers, that would not be an option. That's what makes TiVo the best.

    That macro button sentence of your's makes no sense. Is there supposed to be a button on the remote that says "do it the jojodoesit way"? Most people when they talk about macros and remotes are talking about buttons that execute a series of steps. Maybe you should learn how the terminology is used before you start throwing it around. If they through on a button that executed ever permutations of the series of commands that each and every user might want to execute, that remote would be infinite in size. Just what do you expect?

    Did you find the slow button yet? Are you even trying to understand how this works? Why are you so stubborn?
  14. Revolutionary

    Revolutionary Too sleepy for TV...

    Dec 1, 2004
    I'm gonna say this one more time, and then I'm done here: the HD Tivo devices do not support cable or satellite boxes. You cannot "record with another device." This is a non-issue. If you insist on referencing it here, then I have to concur with the opinion that you are just a troll. But, if you are seriously interested in the merits of the Tivo HD, as your thread title indicates, then you should acknowledge this and stop grousing. If on the other hand you just want to ***** without genuinely interacting with the community, then just say so so I can add you to my ignore list.
  15. jojodoesit

    jojodoesit New Member

    Sep 23, 2006
    Sorry - if you think I'm ignoring you. This is what I got for 2 days..

    You may not post new threads
    You may not post replies

    Now they're coming through.

    I've recorded through Tivo with many other recording devices for 5 yrs. Unless, maybe, you're referring specifically to HD? I don't have one.

    I've resisted adding a new drive to my Tivo since I already have more than 7 DVRs with hard drives. As a day trader, I have large data requirements and it all must be instantly accessible. Maybe some of you know how day trading works..

    My remote doesn't look like the photos, my ex-wife did something (refurbished?). That's history..

    HD won't work with DirectTV. That's good to know, because broadcast over-the-air offers only meager pickings.

    You guys should acquaint yourselves with the pre-computer era meaning(s) of macro, otherwise you just sound ignorant. Excel programmers misused the word macro, but I understand they needed a short, unique catch-all term. Later programmers brought it into common usage.

    Put me on your ignore list, that's what children do. Sorry, a threat of iggy is too funny.

    I can't reply to everyone, but maybe we can all learn something if you repeat your snipes and I'll try to address them.
  16. Keith Mickunas

    Keith Mickunas New Member

    Jul 22, 2003
    Wylie, TX
    That's just nonsensical. VHS is more accessible than the TiVo's hard drive? Once series 2 came along folders were added and it makes things pretty easy.
    Yet apparently it was TiVo's fault your remote wasn't right.
    You should consider that many words have many meanings and that where and when you use them is significant. Regardless, the way you are using the word doesn't make sense. What exactly is this macro button supposed to do? Is it supposed to be psychic or something? Like I've already said, TiVo has chosen the defaults that make sense for 99.99999% of their users. And you want a button that automatically changes the way things work to what you think is ideal? Does that really make sense?
    You asked about the HD models. Why would we talk about Series 2 in the Series3 forum when you specifically asked about the HD models? Make up your mind. The two HD models work with cablecard or OTA.
    Were you logged in? I'm guessing not.
  17. doconeill

    doconeill Unix Guru

    Dec 13, 2002
    West of Boston
    But YOU are talking about a post-computer usage of the term, which is to have one action perform several.

    Perhaps you should be the one to acquaint yourself with a dictionary:

    macro (adj.): 1: being large, thick, or exceptionally prominent; 2 a: of, involving, or intended for use with relatively large quantities or on a large scale; 2b: of or relating to macroeconomics; 3: gross; 4: of or relating to a macro lens or to close-up photography. First prominant use in 1923, from the Greek makros, meaning long or large.

    macro (n): a single computer instruction that stands for a sequence of operations. First prominant use in 1959. Derived as a short form of macroinstruction

    Aside from that, you've shown that you are singularly unable to read and comprehend the responses given. Therefore you do not want help, you just want to complain. Go create a blog and do it.
  18. jojodoesit

    jojodoesit New Member

    Sep 23, 2006
    So macro and macroinstruction are the same word to you? Macro has become slang for macroinstruction in today's computer-ese. Did I use the phrase macroinstruction button for what I would like to see to re-set Tivo defaults? No.

    Many responses in here have been informative for me, but I'd rather you had told me that my few "easy" changes to Tivo had been implemented in HD (because it then would have the capabilities of every modern DVR, without the same-old limitations). We all know about some of the limitations, why defend them?
  19. doconeill

    doconeill Unix Guru

    Dec 13, 2002
    West of Boston
    Sigh...this is getting old.

    You claimed you were using the term "macro" in its adjective mode - but the definition does not fit your requirement. A "macro" in remote terminology is in fact a form of macroinstruction - a button that performs a series of functions (like record show, go to record settings, set Keep Until I Delete). By your definition, you just want a big button that does specifically what you want it to.

    By the way, the definitions are straight from Webster Online. They specifically say that "macro" in the noun form is correct as a short form of macroinstruction, so therefore they ARE the same word.

    So other than the long lost Slow button, you have not replied to anything saying that any of your "issues" were solved with the given recommendations. You simply re-iterated that they are "flaws", despite the fact that you are the only one who believes they are, and the fact that you are using it improperly to begin with (more than one device told it is "control" of the STB).

    I suggest you go with someone else's DVR that does what you want. It is obvious that the feature set of the TiVo is in conflict with your desires.
  20. jojodoesit

    jojodoesit New Member

    Sep 23, 2006
    Yes, I would like a button that reset the Tivo to do no harm, no deletions and no channel changing, no ads, no stopping between program playbacks, just like every other DVR. What a concept! For users who want Tivo to mindlessly delete their shows chronologically they shouldn't press the button.

    If Webster says they're the same word today, obviously that's the effect that slang has. I was programming IBM 360s in the 60's and we discussed macroassemblers far more than macroinstructions, so it would have been silly for us to use such slang.

    I should have thanked every sniper for their suggestions. When I bought Tivo years ago I didn't realize until these topic threads that I could use it "improperly".

    Yes, but I'm still waiting for other manufacturers to learn to implement something akin to Tivo's season pass scheduling.

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