Is COX Communications Violating FCC Mandate?

Discussion in 'TiVo Help Center' started by frazierwa, Oct 16, 2017.

  1. frazierwa

    frazierwa New Member

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    I have a vacation home in AZ and every year for the last 8 years I have been able to get a 'package' from Cox which includes Internet service and TV service with a cable card. Those two services typically cost about $90/month. This year they do not have ANY packages that do NOT include their own DVR (Contour) and the same package now costs $120/month. When I mentioned that I do not need the DVR since I have a Tivo, I was advised that there would be an additional charge of $2/month for the cable card rental. When I mentioned that the 'package' price was considerably more expensive this year than last, she said it was because it 'included' their DVR that could not be removed and no discount was provided.

    Isn't this a violation of the FCC rules that prohibits them from requiring us to pay for a DVR that we don't need or want? Of course the rep says that there is no additional charge for the DVR.

    It seems clear that this is a violation of the spirit of the FCC rules related to cable cards. Does anyone have any information about this? I know there is a site where complaints can be sent to the FCC but I'm seeking information from other forum members first.
     
  2. Sparky1234

    Sparky1234 Well-Known Member

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    Filing a Complaint Questions and Answers
     
  3. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    It's more than a violation of the spirit of the regulations, but until and unless you actually take the time to file the complaint, you are doing nothing but encouraging such violations. Please do so, you can actually do the whole thing online in 10 minutes or less.
    Please post your results later.
     
    Mikeguy likes this.
  4. frazierwa

    frazierwa New Member

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    As I mentioned, I'm trying to gather information about this issue so that my complaint properly describes their practice as it relates to the FCC. Based on what I posted, do you know what part of the FCC rules are violated? I could not find a link to the specific FCC rules or guidance related to cable operators and their responsibilities regarding sales practices for Tivo owners.
     
  5. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah right, the first bullet point on the Know your Rights link, CableCARD: Know Your Rights
    "Pay only for equipment you have. Your operator must give you a discount on any packages that include the price of a set-top box if you choose to use your own CableCARD-enabled device. FCC Rule 76.1205(b)(5)."
    All you have to do is provide the information on the who, what cable company and that they are refusing to give you any discount for using your own device and insisting that you pay for a box that you don't need or want.
    You don't need to be a lawyer or make believe you are one. You could have done it at least a dozen times already.
     
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  6. frazierwa

    frazierwa New Member

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    What is wrong with you fcfc2? You must offer extraordinary advice if people put up with your crap!

    I know you don't need to be a lawyer to file an FCC complaint, but it seems reasonable to learn about the applicable rules to improve chances that the complaint will be properly written. People on this forum seem like a logical resource for that information, hence my question. Now that I have the link you provided, I have enough detail to understand that my complaint is valid. Thank you?
     
    Puppy76 and bluecruiser like this.
  7. ajwees41

    ajwees41 Well-Known Member

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    if the current/newpackage does not include the hardware cox didn't do anything wrong, but separate the hardware fee from the package which most likely went up in price do to programming fees and taxes
     
  8. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Since anyone can find a massive amount of information by simply using google and typing in "FCC Complaints", I found it extremely difficult to believe that you would be having that hard of a time figuring out how and what to do. If your neighbors are having a loud, raucous party at 2AM do you need to know what the specific ordinance is in your locality, do you wait until the next day and go to the library, or call a lawyer to find out? Maybe you do, but most people would simply call the police and complain. It is up to the authorities to decide what to do about it. The FCC is the authority in this situation. You don't even need to know if the complaint is in any sense justified and what if any infraction of "their" rules have been violated, all you have to do is tell them what you think "may be" wrong, period.
    Other than my "yeah, right" comment/crap, there is absolutely nothing I posted which is even a tiny bit off IMO. My intent was not to "hurt your feelings", but to spur you to take some action.
    I have seen many, many posts here and in other forums where cable companies have violated FCC regulations regarding cable cards and I cannot remember one where the OP actually filed a complaint upon being provided with the information, which they could have easily found themselves with the help of google and a few minutes of their time, yourself included.
    On the other hand, I have seen several posts from folks who have initiated filing a complaint with the FCC over such practices and suddenly have the cable companies contact them within a day or two and successfully resolved their issues. But these posts never seem to help encourage other folks to file their complaints. Instead, you can almost picture them vacillating and equivocating over and over and over again, like some kid stuck on the end of a diving board, frozen in fear...
    My post was not just for you, it was for anyone else who searched these forums looking for information on filing cable card complaints and to point out how amazingly easy it is to actually file the complaint with the FCC. Other than the identifying information necessary, all you really have to do is in plain, simple language write down what you experienced without any reference what-so-ever to any specific regulation and let the FCC folks pick up the ball, which they will do. In your case, you could have cut and pasted "provide the information on the who, what cable company and that they are refusing to give you any discount for using your own device and insisting that you pay for a box that you don't need or want."
    Nothing further is necessary.
    And yes, I do try to give good, accurate advice, but I am getting up there and my patience is sometimes not as strong as I would like.
     
  9. frazierwa

    frazierwa New Member

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    Since your frustration with other forum members is so high that it causes you to insult them when they merely ask for help from the forum community, perhaps you need to consider 'retiring' from participation. Yes, it will be a huge blow to the forum, but somehow we'll manage.
     
  10. BobCamp1

    BobCamp1 Well-Known Member

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    I don't think he knew he could file an FCC complaint online or what the URL was. The OP only has 9 posts, 4 of which are in this thread.

    I can also use Google to type in "troll".... I would probably find a statement like, "You don't need to be a lawyer or make believe you are one. You could have done it at least a dozen times already."
     
  11. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    My frustration was with you not every member of the forum. BTW, have you yet filed the complaint with the FCC.
     
  12. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks but the statement you quoted was simply a statement of fact. Here's one of the better google searches for "troll", Urban Dictionary: troll
    If my post was trying to provoke anything it was action on the part of the OP, i.e., and my diatribe as you described it was simply my reasoning as well as providing simple instructions as to how simple and straight forward that process is. Before making any more unfounded assertions, please try googling any of the following phrases, "FCC complaints", "FCC cable card complaints", or simply look in the link which had already been provided or anything you can guess to be related and tell me if it takes you any more than about 3 clicks to find actionable links and a massive amount of related information.
    Could I have gotten the important part of my information to the OP in a kinder, gentler way? Yes I could have and should have, and have done so repeatedly in the past. This was my bad, because now I find myself discussing someone's hurt sensibilities instead of focusing on the issue at hand....filing an FCC complaint.
     
  13. frazierwa

    frazierwa New Member

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    fcfc3; this has nothing to do with hurt sensibilities or feelings.... I'm just fine; I've been insulted by much better people.

    This is primarily about you being a jackass and not recognizing it; which means that you probably can't fix it. Please reconsider your retirement.

    If it will help you leave, believing that your support has been helpful; yes, I filed the complaint with the FCC. Not a dozen complaints, just one after I found the information I was seeking about their rules.
     
  14. Tanic

    Tanic Member

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    Depending on which city you are located in, they may have a cable franchise office which you can file a complaint. You will get a contact from Cox HQ.
     
  15. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    Let me fix what everybody meant.
     
    fcfc2 likes this.
  16. frazierwa

    frazierwa New Member

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    Yes, that apparently is the defining statement that is relevant in my case and I articulated the violation to FCC via the complaint process based on what the Cox rep told me.

    I must assume that many on this forum have encountered this situation previously; I imagine that this may be the largest group (Tivo owners) of cable card users in the country. It's very odd that each of us must file a complaint with the FCC and then wait to negotiate a resolution with the cable operator. By now, you would think that the process and resolution would be pretty well baked. Also, I'm surprised that Tivo doesn't have a department dedicated to resolving disputes since it is clearly in their interest to exercise rights for cable card users.

    It seems like the cable operators realize that most people aren't going to dedicate the time to file an FCC complaint and then wait for a response from the cable operator so they continue to violate the rules with apparently no FCC penalty. The cable operators make it very clear that they hate the requirement to support cable cards and they are doing their best to discourage customers from using them. I understand their motivation, but who offers meaningful protection of consumer rights in this case. What good are the FCC rules if there is no apparent enforcement of them? We shouldn't have to rely on the operator to negotiate a compliant response. I filed my complaint on Monday (this is Wednesday afternoon) and I have not been contacted by FCC or the operator yet so I may not even have the normal, weak solution available. I did get an automated e-mail replay after filing the complaint but nothing since.
     
  17. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    Keep us updated on how your complaint goes.
     
  18. ajwees41

    ajwees41 Well-Known Member

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    it will go nowhere since cox no longer packages the hardware with the channel packages like they have in the past.
     
  19. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    OP says the opposite.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2017
  20. ajwees41

    ajwees41 Well-Known Member

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    But he also said it was higher price than what he had last time he wants non contour package in the cox owned forums that's what the cox reps said need to be ordered don't and I repeat DON'T order the contour package.
     

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