HR20 keyword recording PPV chanels

Discussion in 'DirecTV TiVo Powered PVRs & Receivers' started by puppypuppy, Jan 14, 2008.

  1. puppypuppy

    puppypuppy New Member

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    Nov 26, 2001
    Moss Beach,...

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    Hey with my Tivo HD unit it would not record PPV programs that matched keywords, etc. But the New HR20 keeps trying to record stuff off the PPV channels. Is this something I have set up wrong or is this a missing feature that I'm just going to have to learn to live without.
     
  2. joed32

    joed32 New Member

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    Jul 9, 2005
    You're not doing anything wrong, it just works that way for now. I just search and then pick our exactly which showing I want to record. If it's PPV then I don't bother. A fix has been in the works for a long time now but no results yet.
     
  3. TonyTheTiger

    TonyTheTiger Pro Troll Magnet

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    Remember that if your HR20 records a PPV show, you will NOT be charged for it unless you watch it. There is no fee for recording and deleting an unwatched PPV.
     
  4. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Jul 24, 2001
    Tinley...
    If you have an HR20-700
    And you have received the latest software update: 0x1EA

    You can modify your search to add: NNOT PPV to the end of the serach to exclude the PPV category.
     
  5. RS4

    RS4 New Member

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    This is what I mean when I say the HR20 is not well thought out. It's nice that there is a way that you can not include PPV in the search. But why not put the option in some non-computer-ease way? Why not have a checkbox or some other visual for the option? The default would be "Don't include PPV" or something to that effect.

    I would consider NNOT for the more advanced crowd of users, so I think it's fine to have that option, but consider that 95% of the people won't remember that - nor should they, especially when most people would not want to include PPV in their searches in the first place.

    Once again, this is evidence to me that this box is being developed without considering who their users are. Why force a user to remember technical terms if they don't have to?
     
  6. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Jul 24, 2001
    Tinley...
    Oh brother....

    Because the terms ARE intended for the more ADVANCED searching crowd.
    The boolean additions NNOT AAND AANY are not for casual searchers...
     
  7. TonyTheTiger

    TonyTheTiger Pro Troll Magnet

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    We all love Earl (well, most of us do, except the whiners and complainers), but his typing sometimes leaves a little to be desired. I think the second 'N' is a mistype and the phrase should be "NOT PPV".

    I think having the option of seeing what's available in PPV that matches my criteria is a good thing. I have the choice of whether I want to pay for it or not, but at least I know it's there. And then I have the option of excluding PPV if I want. What's wrong with that?

    However, there are some posters here who would complain if the HR20 was to get up, find you, tap you one the shoulder and tell you it's recorded your show and then ask when you want to watch it!! They would probably say it hasn't got the same accent as TiVo! :eek:



    ETA: Sorry Earl, looks like I was wrong about the NNOT - but not about your typing skills ;)
     
  8. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Tinley...
    ;)

    NNOT is the command... and yes... at 130wpm, I do have room to improve a bit..
     
  9. milominderbinder

    milominderbinder New Member

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    Dec 18, 2006
    Chicagoland
    Earl,

    In the Enhanced Search FAQ, I did not have the PPV filter. I updated to show this now:

    Special Categories
    You can add these special category filters to your search:
    HDTV for just HD programs or NNOT HDTV for just SD programs
    VOD for only DIRECTV on Demand programs or NNOT VOD for no Video on Demand programs
    PPV for just Pay Per View programs or NNOT PPV for no PPV programs

    Are there any others?

    - Craig
     
  10. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Tinley...
    Any category name... like

    AAND HD
    NNOT HD

    AAND COMEDY
    NNOT COMEDY

    I would have to look up the other standard category names (Which are available in the search wizard screens)
     
  11. milominderbinder

    milominderbinder New Member

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    Dec 18, 2006
    Chicagoland
    Got it. I updated to include that.

    Thank you,

    Craig
     
  12. JohnB1000

    JohnB1000 Well-Known Member

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    Just to prove myself so reasonable I'm gonna agree with RS4 on this one. I think that basic search features like this should have simple check boxes etc.

    In truth it doesn't bother me, but requiring boolean knowledge to find only HD shows or not PPV is not that great. However it should be easy for them to add if they want to.
     
  13. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Tinley...
    Serious question:
    Does any DVR platform out there have a check box system, or elaborate search function that will allow you to build your query in an MS ACCESS click, drop type function?

    You can only go so far, with an on-screen system... that is driven by a remote control... vs a mouse and keyboard.
     
  14. JohnB1000

    JohnB1000 Well-Known Member

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    There's a new system called HR20/21 has a check box system. Check out the Fantasy Football team setup screens. You move to the box and press select.

    It's only a couple of key items and of course it's only an opinion.
     
  15. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Tinley...
    I ment for search.

    I do know there are check and mark in the HR20.
    (Such as mark and delete)
     
  16. JohnB1000

    JohnB1000 Well-Known Member

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    I'll tell you, sometimes you make your arguments in such a way that makes an HR20/21 supporter like myself consider if you really do have an ulterior motive, you have to do a better job at seeing both sides of an argument. You seem to arguing that this would not be a good thing, surely a way to do this would be a good thing, even if it's not practical. Just like DLB would be a good thing even though it's no big deal to me not to have it.

    It doesn't have to be a check box anyway, it could be an option that comes up like the Sports, Reality etc. Selecting HD only for example is a pretty common and fundamental search that I bet appears in some way or other before too long.
     
  17. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Tinley...
    I actually clearly see both sides of the argument...

    And can completely undestand why it would seem that having check mark boxes, would seem easier.

    However... when you take a step back...
    How would you implement it on the screen?

    Would you have extra line items, one for NNOT, one for AAND, one for AANY... then add the search criteria in each...

    BOOLEAN logic without ( ) then have to follow a stick order... how do you make that clear on which order the logic should be applied, with really turning it hard core advanced...

    And then... doing all of that, while still keeping it practical enough to do with the RC series remote control... and that it doesn't take 15 minutes to build one query?

    I have NOTHING against, more advanced searches... but it gets to a point that it gets to be too impractical when a simpler method (that returns more hits) and allows the user just to select from the final list, the shows they want... instead of having a 100% pure hit on the search..

    It would be similar to someone comming up with the perfect query on Google... that they could click on the feel lucky every time, and it takes them to the EXACT page they wanted to go to.

    If we had a fully keyboard and fully mouse support for the HR20/21... then it woudl be a lot easier to provide advanced searching options... as the system is more then capable of advanced boolean searches.

    You just have a limination on how practical (both functional and time), to get the query into the system.
     
  18. JohnB1000

    JohnB1000 Well-Known Member

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    Ahh such "confidence" mixed with only responding to parts of the post.

    I am not saying we need full AND/OR just take favorite options such as HD, or Channels I get or not PPV and make them an option. It's really no different to the way you subselect categories, you currently can't say MOVIES AND SPORTS because they are in the same list. I'm not in any way arguing against the boolean logic, so there's not need to keep justifying it, just adding that there are some basic search parameters that would help your average user, while some of the existing one's (category stuff) seem less important.

    Again I fail to understand why you argue so strongly against an opinion.
     
  19. RS4

    RS4 New Member

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    Sep 2, 2001
    Indianapolis...
    Earl, I believe you gave the perfect response of what I expect the programmers are doing at D*. I believe on dbstalk, you're slogan says that you think like an engineer and it shows here. There is absolutely nothing on earth wrong with the advanced search and I applaud D* for adding it. However, you folks are limiting that search to a very small crowd for absolutely no reason at at. And, I'm not suggesting that D* get rid of it.

    You need to think about the viewing audience. You want them to have an enjoyable experience when using the box. You want to offer them options for including/excluding options and/or features. The chore is that you need to do that in a way that the average user such as my wife could figure out how to use these features without knowing SQL or boolean searching commands.

    There are tons of ways to allow folks to search without forcing them to know the level of detail that D* has done here - just look at the internet. One way is to offer some kind of options menu that allows the customer to pick and choose from a group of options. For instance - the search option should offer the channels to look at such as: Channels I receive, PPV, HD only, All channels.

    Another way of doing it is to have the logical connectors in a drop-down list the user can select, along with samples.

    This is just a couple of small suggestions. The point that I don't think you realize is that D* has developed this dvr for tech savy people for the most part. I'm often amazed at Milo's links for 100 ways to do this and 40 things a Tivo user must know,etc. Heck, to me that is way too complicated. And, it says to me that here is yet another clue that D* has made using the box more complicated then need be.

    I'm glad your dvrs are being updated and that D* is installing tons of them. I just wonder how much higher the acceptance would be if they had actually thought about the non-tech users. It's true that our world knows a lot more technical lingo about this stuff because of the internet, etc. It's just a shame that in all of its haste, D* made the classic mistake of forgetting the end user. I believe the saying is something about not seeing the forest for the trees. I've been in development for years and seen it time and time again. Heck, even MS has reputation for not getting anything right until the 3rd release and Vista is following the same pattern as all of the other releases.

    The thing that often surprises me is that you seem to get huffy and puffy when anyone tries to point out the obvious, as I tried to do here. I tried to be constructive in my reply, because I thought this would be one time that if you truly read it, you would see that I was trying to be positive and help you.

    That's also a shame because I have no doubt that you probably wield a great deal of influence. You're so busy trying to get this box going that you can't look ahead to how this box could offer a wider acceptance if folks would just think through these things.
     
  20. ebonovic

    ebonovic has gone his way...

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    Tinley...
    Where am I strongly against the opinion?

    Just because I am continue the discussion... to point out it is not as simple as... "add checkboxes"... doesn't mean I dont' like the idea.

    Heck... someone might come up with a real slick solution to do it.
     

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