HR10-250 and MPEG4; Upgrade Offer

Discussion in 'DirecTV TiVo Powered PVRs & Receivers' started by ebonovic, Aug 3, 2007.

  1. fredflint

    fredflint New Member

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    Jan 23, 2002

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    I get the east coast (NY) feed for Fox and also get the local version. Since both affiliates are owned by the same company (or so I am told), I was able to get it when I requested waivers over 6 years ago. Fox was the only waiver they granted me.
     
  2. ANZAC_1915

    ANZAC_1915 New Member

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    Feb 25, 2009
    OTA or on D*?

    In any event, if that was the issue, you would think they'd be able to tell me that, instead of telling me I need two new HD receivers because they are faulty, or that the channels no longer exist.
     
  3. shibby191

    shibby191 New Member

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    Dec 24, 2007
    Doesn't matter OTA or D* actually, it's just can you get them at all per the law. If you can get HD locals via D* then you are a prime suspect to get audited.

    Yea, well, you're asking a bit much from customer support. ;)

    Seriously though, if you lost the HD DNS stations and especially if you have HD locals available on D* in your market then you can pretty much guarantee your account was audited and the DNS stations removed.
     
  4. ANZAC_1915

    ANZAC_1915 New Member

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    Feb 25, 2009
    (how would I know?) Are the HD locals MPEG2 or MPEG4, and are they the mapped stations or in another channel range?
     
  5. stevel

    stevel Dumb Blond TCF Club

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    What shibby means is that if DirecTV offers HD locals over the satellite in your market, they'll take HD DNS away.
     
  6. ANZAC_1915

    ANZAC_1915 New Member

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    Feb 25, 2009
    I cannot see any HD locals. If I could, I wouldn't be griping about the DNS HD versions.

    Now, I might be able to see HD locals if I upgraded to a MPEG4 DVR, which I don't want to do until there is a HD Tivo version.
    I don't think I should lose access to content when it is still being broadcast in a way I can access with my current equipmemt.

    If this is really different than the SD laws, that is pretty wonky.

    They did admit that I do have eligibility to watch the West Coast MPEG2 HD DNS channels (81,83, etc), but unfortunately they already migrated to MPEG4...

    Looks like OTA is the next step, we live a long way from the stations so not sure how well it will work.
     
  7. TyroneShoes

    TyroneShoes HD evangelist

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    Actually, the SD rules and the HD rules, while very different, are both pretty wonky. The fact that they are very different is living proof that the rules were fashioned arbitrarily. The bottom line is that they were each written with the wishes of the networks and stations in mind, and not the wishes of the viewers or vendors, so that explains both why customers view them negatively and why vendors view them non-partisanly.

    I get your argument, but I see it as weak. DTV is willing to provide you with suitable equipment to get HD locals, yet you are refusing. Getting folks to convert takes a lot of the carrot and just a little bit of the stick, and IMHO DTV has struck a fair balance in that. If you won't take the carrot, then you should probably brace yourself for the stick.

    That DTV may enforce the DNS rules as one method of urging you to convert seems like a reasonable business approach, seeing as how you should be just as required to observe DNS rules as anyone else. But if you examine the situation, DNS rules and whether you could be provided with capability to receive locals are really two very separate matters. It is just somewhat a convenient yet unrelated coincidence for DTV that it may help persuade you to convert should you lose DNS
     
  8. ANZAC_1915

    ANZAC_1915 New Member

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    Feb 25, 2009
    I do agree with you, I just think they should be honest that is their goal (getting me to convert) rather than just saying I'm not eligible and this is all the FCC's doing. I did find some other info that unless my original local station waivers (which I procured myself and provided to DTV in 1999) specify the waiver is for analog signals only, I should be allowed to received DTVs digital version of the east coast feeds.

    And there is the irony, that now the locals have ceased analog broadcasts, I am effectively receiving the DNS version of those same east coast digital network broadcasts (SD channels 380, 382 etc). It may be that I shouldn't receive them, but the DTV guy said I was eligible for them - the FCC rules are about analog and digital, not SD and HD. So either I'm eligible for DNS feeds in leiu of a digital signal, or I'm not. (they can't say it is ok for digital SD but not digital HD)

    I guess I wasn't paying attention when this happened a year or two ago, because they effectively screwed west coast HD DNS subscribers with HR10's by choosing to migrate those channels to MPEG4 ahead of the east coast, hence the free upgrade offer I guess.

    And hey, this is the Tivo forum, where is the HR10 love? :)


    PS Fredflint - what state are you in? DTV claimed they'd let me watch 80,82,86,88 if I lived on the "east side of the country".

    PPS DTV droid claimed MPEG4 HD DirecTivo would be out in Q4 2009.
     
  9. TyroneShoes

    TyroneShoes HD evangelist

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    I am not sure what the rules are, but basically, for analog, if you are in a zipcode flagged as "white", you are eligible, and if in a "red" zip, you aren't.

    But digital is apparently very different. At one point you could get the distant HD signal if you were an HD sub and lived in a city that had a network O&O station for that network. At one point you could even get both east and west (I missed that boat). And at some later point they disenfranchised you even if you met those requirements.

    If I am DTV and I want to fight whether you get DNS or not, I hire a good lawyer who will say "Sorry, your waver was for Kxxx-TV (the analog signal) and Kxxx-DT (the new digital version) is a different signal, different name, even if from the same affiliate, and therefore "different" enough that your waiver doesn't apply. As a matter of fact I think there are no waivers in the digital world of DNS.

    But the point might be that DTV doesn't really want to fight. They want your business, and they will sell you anything you will pay for unless the NAB or the local station holds their feet to the fire, which is rare, because TV stations have plenty to worry about other than that. The dough they can generate and retention benefits of selling you something you are officially not supposed to have yet really would like to have can greatly outweigh the chance of a slap on the wrist from the FCC. They normally misinterpret the rules in their and your favor whenever they think they can get away with it.
     
  10. newsposter

    newsposter Poster of News

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    why would a tv station care if my tivo records from their station or someone else's? I'm not gonna watch commercials no matter what
     
  11. TyroneShoes

    TyroneShoes HD evangelist

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    Sep 6, 2004
    In the archaic world of broadcasting, what they want is ratings. If you watch CBS from NYC, your local station doesn't get your eyeballs counted. That is why it made absolutely no sense that you could get a HD DNS station if you had an O&O in your market.

    Ironically, what broadcasters sell is airtime in little 30-second slices, yet they base their claim to how many folks will see a particular commercial on something completely different--the number of folks who claim they were watching something else, the program surrounding those commercials, also based on a very small sample of those folks. Pretty thin, eh?

    The entire "captive audience" business model of broadcasters is a joke and a dinosaur, and will be a dim memory in another few years.
     
  12. joed32

    joed32 New Member

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    Jul 9, 2005
    With no sponsorship wouldn't that mean no TV shows, or would they just discontinue OTA and raise the price that they charge to Cable and Satellite to pay for them.
     
  13. newsposter

    newsposter Poster of News

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    ok so my friend, a holdout from primestar days still paying for the distants, is being counted in 'those' markets but not our home market?

    How do they account for people like her that may have distants but also may (she does not) watch OTA? I guess what i'm asking is how do OTA people get counted?

    and is there any consideration given to overlap areas? If i cared to buy a rotor, i could easily get stations other than the philly market. Do they count me as watching them since i'm definitely 'able to' get them OTA but directv wont give me them?
     

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