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Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by atmuscarella, Apr 11, 2017.
Greed or trying to show a profit. Most of these services aren't showing a profit.
How is the DVR on this platform? Can you setup the equivalent of season passes for series? Can you visually fast forward/rewind with thumbnails? Does it have 15 or 30 sec skip forwards and backwards? Is it responsive?
All I said was Fubo is in the same price (point) as the YTTV, Hulu Live etc.
I meant greed coming from the major content owners, e.g. Warner, Viacom. Specifically, by fubo carrying all major channels including Disney, Warner, Comcast, etc., it's setting itself up for full exposure those providers can hold over fubo. In that sense, I'm glad fubo added Disney but dropped Warner channels as its choosing to go in a direction to balance its programming costs.
The channel owners are generally raising their rates, but not providing much to show for it. Reruns with commercials. Little in way of original content. TBS's schedule of Friends all day or Viacom Paramount network's Bar Rescue marathons isn't justifiable for the price increases.
I don't think it's fair to use the term greed. These people are simply doing business -- trying to figure out how to sell something to as many people as possible for as much as possible.
We spent a lot of time clamoring for a la carte options. Now that we have them, everyone is complaining that the a la carte options are incomplete or expensive.
While I rely on broadcast television for entertainment, I routinely add a subscription. I am extremely appreciative of the wide array of options and the consumer friendly price points. I am also aware that, for many, full blown cable packages make the most sense.
Just started a Fubo trial yesterday (with family share and dvr plus), so here's what I have found so far. I have a Firestick 4K, TiVo Stream 4K, and a Roku Ultra. There are some major differences with the Roku app as compared to the Stream and FS.
DVR seemed to work fine on all devices. You can record NEW only or all episodes. You can delete episodes. I set up a pass for Law & Order SUV and it groups all the various channels together in your recorded list. The sort is newest episode number first and you can filter by seasons. I did not see a way to sort by date recorded. I have not looked at how VOD fits in there.
OK .. now the differences ..
Android devices FF and rewind using DPad - 15 seconds either way with each click. On FS, when you use the FF or RW buttons .. it shows elapsed time, but no visual preview. Actually there is no preview screen for any controls. Side note, there is a Stats for nerds type screen. Guide looks pretty much like YTTV. Filtering options are by date and category.
Roku In my mind they spent all their development on this app. 10sec, 20 sec, 1 min, 2 min and 4 min FF and RW with thumbnails. Also shows the elapsed time. The guide is awesome. They have descriptions for the shows in the guide. The highlighted show gives info at the top of the screen just as our TiVos do. Same filtering options as the Android apps. They even have the show descriptions in the recordings section too. Fonts are smaller there than with the Android devices. When watching TV, there is a last channel button so you can flip back and forth between 2 channels. 3-5 sec delay or so. You can set the app up to automatically start on the last channel you watched and choose to have Live TV play in the background when you're viewing the guide. There is no stats for nerds though.
For me, with Fubo dropping Turner and no RSNs, it doesn't have the right lineup for me so I won't continue past the trial. Also, in my totally subjective opinion, the picture doesn't seem quite as sharp or bright as other streaming services I have used. It's not awful, it's just not crisp.
Thanks very much for the great info. Looks like a hard pass for me having a Fire TV 4K and a TS4K (Android devices) based on the lack of thumbnails for FF/REW alone. And pricing wise it's about same as YTTV with DVR+ anyway, so doesn't sound like a good alternative to YTTV.
I think I found a non-starter for me since I do not have any Apple or Roku devices.
OTOH, this same article says:
Is there someone who has (or has tried) Fubo TV that can tell me if you can start watching a catch-up program from the beginning after recording for an hour? Or do you have to wait 1 hour after recording before it is available? And this article says the beta is only available on select channels and programs. I don't have any issues like that with YTTV.
EDIT: From Fubo TV's Help:
EDIT: And Fubo TV's help does not come up with a search result for "Instant DVR" or the "Startover" feature. I guess I'll just have to test it to see if it works for me or not.
I have both Android and Roku devices and it works basically the same on both. Yes, you can jump into a recording before it is done. You can start from the beginning and have FF, pause and RW. The only thing is that if you view while recording, you do not have thumbnail previews. For this to work, you have to access the recordings from either the Recordings tab or the Recordings row under the Home tab. Under both methods, it is very clear what episodes are currently recording. If you try to access the program through the guide, you can only have controls from the live point of the show.
It does appear that you can click on a show from the guide and from that point forward you can FF, RW, or pause whether you are recording the show or not. Some shows, and I have no idea what the criteria is, you can play from start with controls and skip commercials, even if not already recording. Also, unlike YTTV, when you click on a show, you go to an intermediate screen and can choose record or just play. There's also a Continue Watching row under the Home Tab if you want to resume watching. Easily deleted when you are done with the show.
Since it's 7 days free, play around with it. The Roku has a far superior experience than Androids, but the app layout is pretty much the same for both.
But fubo isn't an a-la-carte oriented service. It's trying to be a full cable tv replacement. While I believe it is competing in a market rife with greed from its content owners, I'll just leave it at that.
Another disadvantage over YTTV and Hulu Live, is it lacks FOX (and maybe other major) affiliates in Sinclair markets, it appears, not just the FOX RSNs.
I don't know how you got from what I posted to what you responded. I simply said it was unfair to characterize the marketplace as greed noting that in 2020 consumers have what they always said they wanted and remain dissatisfied.
I applaud Pluto, Fubo, Sling, and all the others for trying to bridge the gap between Netflix and Comcast.
That said, I would only watch two channels in the Fubo lineup.
Interesting. I didn't know that. But that makes sense given that the Fox RSNs are now owned by Sinclair.
Between YTTV, Fubo, and Hulu Live, all of them are comparably priced (once you pay for a decent cloud DVR and have access to at least 3 simultaneous streams). But they're all missing a few channels. Hulu Live has the fewest but then they have the core Hulu on-demand library, which is pretty great. But if you're not that interested in that, then it makes no sense to have Hulu Live. In that case, YTTV would seem to offer the best overall value for most folks.
I'm not sure what the typical Fubo subscriber looks like. Fubo started out mainly targeting sports fans but then they never had the ESPN channels. Now they're getting them but they've lost the Fox RSNs, many Fox locals, CNN, plus TBS and TNT, which carry a decent amount of sports. If you're willing to spend over $60 on a streaming cable TV package, you probably want your major locals, live sports, and cable news channels. And all things considered, either YTTV or Hulu Live looks like a better deal for most folks.
Reviving this discussion from many months ago, I just signed up with Fubo TV since they are the only one of two streaming services I'm aware of that carry my local RSN NESN. I signed up for the cheapest $60 plan, meaning only a 30 hour DVR. I was hoping that the Roku device would be as good as it looks above in writing, but I find it also has some issues.
Although it does have thumbnails on finished recordings, there are no thumbnails on a live show or while a recording is in process. I personally like to chase a game so I can skip the commercials. So, that means, in most cases, I still have no thumbnails.
Also, when you mentioned the fast forward and rewind speeds, I was thinking this was an editable skip. But I now see exactly what you mean. The 1X, 2X, 3X, etc. correspond to the 10 sec, 20 sec, 1 min, etc. Unfortunately, the D-Pad skip is only 10 Seconds forward and back. That means 18 clicks for a 3 minute commercial! The TiVo Stream does have a 20 sec replay button and the D-Pad has a 15 forward skip and back, as you say.
Unless I'm missing something, with the Roku, I do not see the start times of the recordings. I do see that with the Firestick. Unfortunately, it seems the apps are all different, and it makes it very difficult to navigate when switching devices.
Here is a support letter I sent them today:
We ditched the Apple TV, wouldn't stay connected even with Ethernet. Got a Samsung smart TV and remote was awful! No Rew/FF control and Fubo App not as good as on Apple TV. Ended up with the Roku USB stick from Amazon. Perfect! The remotes are voice controlled and can assign channel. Still with Fubo. It's a shame TiVo can't pair this streaming service. It would be a match made in heaven if the TiVo remote could handle the Fubo app.
You just brought up a good point that I forgot about, I can voice command it to forward 3 minutes! Thank-You! Yeah, I don't think TiVo has any interest in adding anymore apps to their TiVo boxes. But, you are right about the Samsung app. What were they thinking?
I can tell you that Fubo TV support is working these issues. You mentioned starting playback of games in progress and catching up; I was having issues with this jumping to end or live and spoiling outcomes on all platforms with exception of Roku. Not that Roku was superior; I could only buffer like 3 minutes of the content at a time, though I was more than an hour delayed from live.
So skipping commercials was not an option. This is what Fubo refers to Instant DVR. If you've not seen anything like then maybe that's fixed by now? (I'm also referring to quoted reply below).
For reasons above and timely convenience, I suspended my Fubo account and went to YouTube TV on the CCGTV YTTV discount promo; when Google had the recent outage, they appear to have restarted my promo from beginning after I asked for the credit offered to those experiencing the outage.
Since this Fubo TV Instant DVR issue wasn't yet fixed when I suspended, I've lost contact with the progress but the following addresses that concern and possibly yours. They are working this, they say. (Fubo response is in quotes below).
"We are so sorry for the delay on getting back to you. We are experiencing higher than normal contact volume.
Our engineers have issued a response to your concerns:
We are working to get more thumbnail previews on more platforms and channels, however this feature is limited right now. With that being said, it is available on most channels.
The Apple TV platform has the most support as of now.
We actually have this function on live streams with the instant DVR feature (when you playback a recording that is still airing live), however it works better after the recording is finished.
We understand also that getting used to the Siri remote can be a drag, but right now we support this way the most.
Apologies for the limitation.
Also, we are working on a "Follow Team" for sports record option very soon, so hopefully that comes out in the coming months.
Lastly, for the instant DVR fix, we are hoping to have a fix in the next app version coming out in the coming week, so we think that will resolve the timeline/instant DVR overflow issues.
We appreciate your understanding!"
(Note: the thumbnail issue with Apple TV is that the Siri remote is required for it; thumbnail view sadly isn't compatible with Logitech harmony hub and remote use in Fubo TV instant DVR or DVR playback. What adds to this frustration is that scrubbing with the Siri remote is too quick on the frame advance, requiring challenging fine motor skills. I see this with YTTV as well but thumbnail view isn't limited to Siri remote in YTTV.)
It's too bad none of these services offers to "TiVo out" commercial breaks. I've seen Hulu live TV do something similar with some ad breaks: a single skip on the Apple TV would jump to content resumption. But not all ad sessions are marked to do this. As I recall, this was only available would delayed from live while recording was still in progress. It's been a while for me.
I like that key play catch up feature for games in YTTV but wish it included more key plays. Skips too much action. Cloud DVR has potential but has a long way to go.
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Thanks for your input! I have had some issues where it says it can't play from the beginning, and it almost seems like it is recording things with odd hours that appear to be corrupt. And it doesn't seem to like a lot of trick play during "Instant DVR", which makes that "feature" useless. If I do lose games I'm counting on, I will definitely be out of there quickly! My problem is that no one is carrying my RSN now except for Fubotv and AT&T. I might have to go direct to the NHL app with a VPN.
OK, I figured out why I wasn't expecting the voice remote to work for FF/RW. It does not work on Samsung or Amazon Firestick 4K. It DOES work on the Roku and the TiVo Stream 4K!
Have you taken a look at channels dvr?
Automatic Commercial Skipping
Recordings get their commercials indexed, so commercials are automatically skipped.