DIY 10TB Roamio

Discussion in 'TiVo Upgrade Center' started by jmbach, Nov 17, 2018.

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  1. cenright

    cenright bone

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    Did that first based on your suggestion. Multiple passes still result in just 1 block transfer error. Boots up fine like before, but kickstart 58 hangs on software update screen. Trying the mfscopy of that rescue to a 5tb to see if it boots there. If that fails, can mfsadd just be done on a copied drive ? something like this:
    -> dd_rescue from original 3tb to 5tb,
    -> mfsadd -xm 2000 /dev/sdY ( or what parmeters?)
    -> mfsaddfix /dev/sdY

    could that result in successful 5tb?
     
  2. jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

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    You have to limit the mfscopy to the 5TB drive to 4TB image.

    Yes the mfsadd/mfsaddfix will expand the 3TB image cloned to your 5TB drive to use the whole drive for recording.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2019
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  3. BitbyBlit

    BitbyBlit .

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    Newegg has a 10 TB drive here for $160.
     
  4. cenright

    cenright bone

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    Feb 11, 2007
    Thanks, ended up doing the mfsadd/mfsaddfix 3 times on the 8TB (which was a dd_rescue copy of original 3TB) - seems to have expanded to full 8TB and boots fine. fingers crossed....
     
  5. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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  6. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    I'm interested, I ordered a 12TB. Right now I have two Tivos with 8TB drives installed, both on TE3. First is a Roamio Plus. I got to 8TB by cloning a 4TB with recordings in a cloning dock then doing 2 adds. So I am assuming for that one I am limited to 1 more add, 10TB drive max? Second is a Basic Roamio, that one I stared fresh I believe, 8TB created with MFSR. So that one I could go to 12TB doing 3 adds? Can I clone in a dock (assuming the dock can handle a 12TB), then just do 3 adds? I do want to keep recordings and settings on both 8TB Tivos.

    I have a 10TB I may put in the "Plus", that one I assume just clone and do the last available add? No way to use the 12TB in that one assuming I want to keep all the recordings? Am happy these are Roamios, at least can swap drives back and forth without losing anything/everything ;)
     
  7. jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

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    So for the Roamio plus, I need to see the partition layout to see if we can get to 12 TB easily. Run mfsinfo -d on the drive which will show us the partition layout. If it is not, we will need to copy the drive manually and not clone it to get the partitions in the right ordered.

    The other one created with MFSR can easily be updated to 12 TB. In the last update to mfsadd there was a modification to allow for partitions to be coalesced at a later date. This would allow that drive to eventually be expanded up to 20 TB. I am going to modify the current instructions to reflect that.
     
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  8. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks. The 12TB has arrived. I will check the updated/current instructions. Might take awhile, have to find time when I can remove the drives and copy or clone. 8TB takes quite awhile even in a dock, seems to be twice as long in a computer.

    An interesting note, the 12TB is one of those white label reds from an Easystore. Seems there are two models. One actually seems to be a 14TB drive that they firmware modified so you can only use 12TB. That is the one I got, very interesting.
     
  9. jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

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    Interesting, how are they differentiated
     
  10. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    You can tell by the R/N number. For this model # (WD120EMFZ), the R/N # is US7SAP140. The 140 part is what supposedly indicates the size of the drive. Other WD 12TB drives have 120. And an actual sold as 14TB WD has 140. There is some discussion on this at reddit.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2019 at 7:10 AM
  11. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    There was also some speculation that the EMFZ model might be SMR. However WD says their SMR type drives support TRIM. And neither of the white label 12TBs from the easystores support trim so can assume PMR, maybe? WD will not tell consumers directly if a drive is SMR or PMR. However one person wrote to them saying they wanted to use the trim function on an EMFZ drive and how to do it. WD wrote back saying the EMFZ is not an SMR drive so cannot use trim. I also found this very interesting, if ALL WD SMR drives support trim then could test any WD drive to see if it is SMR, including those 2.5" drives (a good amount of Tivo Bolt users were using certain model WD 2.5" drives to upgrade Bolts.) I wonder if the same is true with Seagate SMR drives, they support trim? This could be a great way to test drives for PMR or SMR..............

    From WD website

    "TRIM Command Support for WD External Drives

    WD external SSD drives and WD external HDD drives that have SMR (Shingled Magnetic Recording) drive inside, offer TRIM command support which is enabled by default in Windows 7 and above, designed to maintain the performance of SSD or HDD at an optimal level over the lifetime of the drive."
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2019 at 8:04 AM
  12. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    I will check that once I start work on the upgrades. I can say this, the Roamio Plus was upgraded to 8TB in Jan 2019 using MFST 3.3. I see now there is an MFST 3.32, May 2019? Is that the latest version with the newer mfsadd? If so I'm guessing might not be able to do the clone to the 12TB since the 8TB was created with 3.3 not 3.32 and I already did 2 adds? I may just use the 10TB in the Roamio Plus and use the 12TB in the 8TB basic Roamio which was created fresh with MFSR. Would use MFST 3.32 which would allow up to 20TB in the future?
     
  13. jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

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    Interesting. Wonder if they just deactivated one of the drive heads. Or it could be that quality control is so bad that they need 2 Tb of space to remap all the bad spots on the other platters to give you that 12 TB of space. LOL
     
  14. jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

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    Yes, the latest version has a new switch in mfsadd that forces the partition ordering to be in the correct ordering for future coalescing. On your 8 TB you likely have one pair of partitions in the correct order and another in reverse order. If that is the case, you could clone the drive with your dock, then we would have to manually swap the one pair of partitions about 2 TB in size total. So it might not be too bad.
     
  15. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    Some people were speculating the same thing, remapping bad sectors. Some weighed the drives, the WD120EMFZ weighs more than the other white label 12TB which could be an extra platter. Also may confirm that the WD120EMFZ is indeed PMR, if the other was PMR and the WD120EMFZ was SMR the SMR would probably weigh LESS as it would have less platters?
     
  16. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    I am cloning the Roamio Plus 8TB to the 10TB in the dock now. Will test the 10TB when it is done before doing the add. When I do do the add, can I use 3.32 or do I need to use 3.3 since the drive was created with 3.3? Once I have the 10 working maybe I will mess with the 8 to 12 thing for fun, can take my time since I will have the 10 in there for use in the mean time.
     
  17. jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

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    So the way in which mfsadd adds a pair of partitions depends on the space available. If there is more space than 2 TB available on the drive and you limit the add to 2 TB, it will put the 2 TB media partition in front of the app partition. If there is less space, then it puts the app partition first and assigns the rest of the space to the media partition. The order is only important to coalesce partitions. JMFS coalesced partitions 15 and 16 into 15. This is because the Premiere OS limits the internal drive to 15 partitions. Roamio and later models limit it to 14 partitions. So to add space we use the empty partitions on those models to add space. (Partitions 2 through 7 inclusive which are 6 slots total) By coalescing added partitions, each of those slots can hold 2 TB of recording space for a total of 12 TB of added space.

    The new version of mfsadd has a switch to force mfsadd to always put the added partitions in the correct order.
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2019 at 3:31 PM
  18. tommage1

    tommage1 Well-Known Member

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    Ok, the Roamio Plus 8TB to 10TB clone is complete. Took about 14 hours in a cloning dock. I have the 10TB in the Roamio now, will run it a few days to make sure it is fine. I also checked the 8TB, seems to be in perfect health so the clone should be good. I have not done the add to get the 10TB to it's full capacity yet. I assume these would be the commands? Remember I created the 8TB initially by cloning a nearly full 4TB in a dock, then used MFST 3.3 (not 3.32, it did not exist yet) to do two adds.

    mfsadd -xcm 2040 /dev/sdY
    mfsaddfix /dev/sdY
    Does not matter if I boot MFST 3.3 or MFST 3.32? I did do a MFSINFO on the 8TB. Picture below. I have pictures of the zone maps too if needed.

    Now as for possibly using the 12TB in the Roamio Plus, what would I need to do? Can you tell from the picture? I have the 8TB set aside as a backup for now. Once I have verified the 10TB is working fine I may try the 12TB. You mentioned I might be able to clone the 8TB to the 12TB then manually move partitions around? Then do the adds to get it to 12TB? The 8TB is nearly full so I want to make sure the 10TB is working well before I do anything risky to the 8TB. Glad this is not a Bolt project........

    One more thing, when I ran fdisk -l to find the drive letter I got PAGES of 500MB things. Have never seen that before, is that normal for a drive expanded with MFST 3.3?
     

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    Last edited: Dec 5, 2019 at 11:02 AM
  19. jmbach

    jmbach der Neuerer

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    The new commands are only in the latest version of MFSTools. Run mfsinfo -d on the drive and it will show partition data as well. That is what I need to see for the 12 TB upgrade.

    The new version of Linux on the ISO creates all those little partitions. Use lsblk -o name,size to see the connected drives.
     
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  20. jeffsinsfo

    jeffsinsfo Member

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    Oct 15, 2005
    San Francisco
    I wonder if anyone can help steer me in the right direction. I am trying to use the MFSTools ISO on a flash drive to clone/expand my original 3TB Roamio drive to a WD Red 6TB. The boot process starts (I see a flash screen where I select the MFS tools, though I'm not sure why it's listed twice -- once with FailSafe at the beginning) but ultimately gives an error message "Failed to find MBR device." If I let the computer sit, it seems to go through a few different attempts to reboot though most of what is on the screen doesn't seem significant to me. My computer eventually restarts.

    I saw on another thread here that someone else mentioned having this problem with the ISO file and used the rar file instead, but I have no clue how to do that.
     

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