Directv Possibly going back to Tivo HD DVR

Discussion in 'DirecTV TiVo Powered PVRs & Receivers' started by raven540, Feb 16, 2007.

  1. Mark Lopez

    Mark Lopez Just click ignore

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    :rolleyes: Well, seeing how long the HR10 has been around (and Tivo itself) and the bugs and lack of features it still has, I don't think you have anything to be complaining about about.
     
  2. bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    Exactly. NDS didn't really work out for DirecTV and they dumped them for the HR20/HR21 models and did it themselves. And all under "Murdochs watch". I see the NDS FUD thrown around so much. DirecTV could have easily went back to Tivo a couple years ago after they dumped NDS but they didn't for whatever reason.
     
  3. Sir_winealot

    Sir_winealot Seenyer Member

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    Your opinion means so much to me, I appreciate your input.

    Other than attempting to incite more arguing, what exactly was the point of posting such a comment? What did it add to the conversation?

    You obviously take offense to my posting my personal experience with the HR20 ...and you've made clear your feeling of disdain for what you call "TiVo zealots," so why exactly are you here?
     
  4. MichaelK

    MichaelK Active Member

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    There’s various theory’s on the net why tivo and directv parted ways.

    A few I’ve read:
    1) Directv wanted to have more control over the user, like the ability to force viewing of certain commercials if the advertiser paid more. Tivo refused so directv went their own way.
    2) The numbers, although tiny per box (at less than a buck a box), still add up to staggering numbers when you see how many people take a DVR, and to compete with cable’s 2 way abilities they will need to get an even higher percentage of dvr’s out there. So quickly it becomes like 100 million a year. So why wouldn’t directv try to save themselves that money if they think they can do a ‘good enough’ job to keep most people. And from the sound of this thread many think the directv flavor is “good enough” and some even think it’s better.
    3) Even assuming one doesn’t think directv can do a good enough job and nothing compares to tivo that makes a problem. Directv’s customers at that point are more wed to tivo then to directv. So tivo has some huge power. What happens when you get 50%+ of your subs with tivo and then tivo says they want 5 bucks a box or we go to Comcast and advertise to everyone that you should get cable instead of Directv? It might make sense then to kick tivo to the curb ASAP and attempt to cripple them so in the long term they can never get the upper hand over you.

    Could be any combination of the 3 or probably bits of those 3 and another handful of things that when taken together just made sense to the people in charge to ditch tivo.
     
  5. bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    I think it's a combo of all three plus some other stuff we obviously don't know about. I remember reading a few years ago that DirecTV was a bit nervous over having people loyal to Tivo first and then DirecTV. As you say, that puts them in a vulnerable position. Before the DVR explosion is the time to nip that in the bud so that your customers are loyal to you and your programming first and that is what they did.

    There has been no vast migration of customers away from DirecTV over the past couple years due to no Tivo so their strategy has obviously worked. Subs keep going up, churn is down and now more people have their own home grown DVR then Tivo. They have no need to go back to Tivo to save a few thousand people that are loyal to Tivo first. There is nothing wrong with someone being loyal to Tivo first, but to DirecTV that sub isn't as valuable as a sub loyal to DirecTV first.
     
  6. Cudahy

    Cudahy New Member

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    Cudahy,...
    I asume their research has told them how many of the SD & HD tivo customers might be lost if they don't offer them an option as they go to HD. Even if it's only a couple hundred thousand(out of 2 1/2 million?) it's obviously in the mutual interest of both to reach an agreement. We're still talking millions of dollars.
    Haven't seen a word on Malone taking over(it was supposed to happen in August-September). The only indication is a couple of top Directv execs quitting.
     
  7. MichaelK

    MichaelK Active Member

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    so it's a couple hundred thousand. Tivo doesn't likely give them updates for free anymore. So there's a cost to directv to get an upgrade. For Directv the math is simple- if the cost for the upgrade costs more then their subscirber acquistion cost of the amount of subs they will lose then you let the tivo folks leave. I think their sac is like 600 a sub? So lets say it costs them 200,000 subs that means it will cost them 12,000,000 to replace those subs. Is a deal with tivo going to cost them 120mil or less- that's the question.

    I suppose it's a bit more complex becasue tivo subs have an ongoing cost to directv in the 1 a month per box they pay tivo- so if a software update keeps 1 million people on tivo (the 200,000 diehards plus 800,000 others) then it cost directv a million a month. If they factor that in then it basically means tivo has to do the upgrade for little and even then after a while of people sticking to tivo it costs directv money every day.

    I personally thought their churn would go way up but it seems not. So in the end it's simple math and tivo basically costs them an arm and a leg over time and robs them of any ability to get more money out of subs with addtional HD fees, or VOD charges that new boxes might allow them. So in the end I think tivo being a house brand just makes no sense unfortunately.

    Now there are still ways to make the math work if tivo is an optional add-on like comcast and cox are trying....
     
  8. HiDefGator

    HiDefGator New Member

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    Almost all of the active DirecTivo's are SD units. Most of the owners have no idea that Directv and Tivo are no longer partners. Until they buy a new TV and need to upgrade their DVR, they could be using those DTivo's for several more years. The churn, if there is any, will be spread out over many years.
     
  9. bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    Guys like RS4 are sure silent about all the problems the latest Tivo (standalone) upgrade has caused. I thought Tivo was perfect and didn't have any bugs, especially after 8 years in the business? Hmmmmmmm... ;)
     
  10. terpfan1980

    terpfan1980 It's Just TV TCF Club

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    He's too busy enjoying his dual buffers that are recording nothing because some user in the house cancelled the recordings.
     
  11. Cudahy

    Cudahy New Member

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    Cudahy,...
    I forgot to mention, MichaelK, that a 2 to 3 dollar a month extra fee for those that choose Tivo would probably have to be part of the deal. Not a big deal to anyone who has become a Tivo fan.
     
  12. 20TIL6

    20TIL6 BaDoop BaDoop BaDoop

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    Yeah, the latest standalone upgrade on the S3 and HD units has caused a whole bunch of problems. Problems like multi-room viewing, TiVoToGo, and eSATA. I don't think the HR20 has ever experienced, and might never experience problems like MRV and TTG.
     
  13. Sir_winealot

    Sir_winealot Seenyer Member

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    Wow, I guess "Team HR20" is having a slow day today. :rolleyes:
     
  14. bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    And with all that lots of problems. At least according to the forum right here. Or are you going to tell me that isn't representative of the Tivo users experience with the upgrade? :eek: Hmmmmm, boy that sounds familiar. :p
     
  15. bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    Yea, it's a bit boring speculating on the next 5-10 HD channels that will probably be added tomorrow. :cool:
     
  16. BlackBetty

    BlackBetty I

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    :up: :up: :up:
     
  17. 20TIL6

    20TIL6 BaDoop BaDoop BaDoop

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    I have (2) S3 units and (1) HD unit. Comcast with cablecards and everything. I went through the last two upgrades (9.1 to add Rhapsody, then 9.2 to add eSATA, progressive Unbox, and MRV, TTG).

    I experienced no problems with either upgrade. None.

    And this week, Comcast just added 10 or so HD channels to my lineup. CNNHD, AEHD, NFLHD, FOODHD (ahh, FOOD in HD), HGTVHD, etc, etc.

    They really should build a community forum for you DTV guys.
     
  18. BlackBetty

    BlackBetty I

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    +1
     
  19. SullyND

    SullyND L: 31-14 (10-2) TCF Club

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    LMAO They should, some of them have even 'gone their own way' only to seemingly get lost on their trip.
     
  20. bonscott87

    bonscott87 Done.

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    See, you're not getting the tongue in cheek here.

    See, people may post here that they have an HR20 and have had no problems. But all that is attacked with constant reference to all these problems people have. Mention that people have problem with Tivo and it's blasphemy.

    So now a Tivo upgrade has problems for many people but it gets glazed over "but I don't have any problems". So it's ok for people to have a problem with Tivo but not ok for people to have problems with the HR20. :rolleyes:

    Coffee - meet black kettle. :cool:
     

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