Direction of the new Tivo company-a considered perspective

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by imsai, Dec 3, 2016.

  1. Dec 3, 2016 #1 of 43
    imsai

    imsai Budding TivoHead

    4
    1
    Dec 16, 2014
    Sandy Eggo,...

    Advertisements

    I was recently asked to take a customer survey, and this is what I wrote after some thought (and a little research).
    What do you think?

    ---
    Since the merger with Rovi, Customer support has fallen a lot, and reliability of the devices as well. The New Tivo company seems to be counting on the luster of old days to carry them through, when in truth it is now a second class product in terms of reliability, and 3rd class in terms of support. I feel it is not really a Support representative problem, it is the culture change at Tivo and the results of a change in direction of management decisions there, in spite of the 2011 MS of "leading provider of technology and services for advanced television solutions, including digital video recorders and in the future non-DVR set-top boxes and connected televisions." The transformation of the MS into "being a leading provider of software technology of visual media." has lost sight of one important facet of your former MS. Service. The bedrock that has sustained your company for many years and is the bedrock of many successful companies today. This is where the new Tivo, in my opinion, is going wrong. And it will cost this company its future. I hope this changes, that Tivo realizes that as a service company, service should be back prominently in the Mission Statement and that they fall short of setting an inspirational MS when trying to be just "a leading provider", rather than, say, strive to be "THE leader in providing service and customer-intuitive innovation in the area of the software technology of visual media". Service and availability to customers is one area where Tivo needs to regain ground. Reliability is another. The phasing out of services for older units and the loss of strategic partnerships with, say, Amazon Prime is yet another. In my opinion, Tivos should be intuitive and easy to operate, with easy expansion into added services. The addition of more pictures and active consultation with Tivo servers at the cost of reliability of service does not, in my opinion, come as a net gain. When I see the spinning ring more and more and services down, broken or wrong more and more often, when I see "20 minute wait times" turn into multihour waits without a fix or ETA at the end, when as a California OTA user I see stations from Buffalo NY added to my lineup, and changes every 3 days on average for months, I find it Tivo more frustrating to use and start thinking more of alternatives.
    ---
    Thoughts, anyone?
    Please note: I have been a loyal multiunit customer of Tivo for quite some time now, have recommended them to friends, coworkers, and family. I own several Tivos now, and partner one with a NAS for backup. Basically, I have liked using Tivos for a long time.
     
    sharkster likes this.
  2. Dec 3, 2016 #2 of 43
    dlfl

    dlfl Cranky old novice

    9,021
    778
    Jul 6, 2006
    Dayton OH
    This statement makes me think of a soft-hearted nanny entering a room of children who are fighting and tearing up the furniture and saying: "Oh children we really must stop this rowdy behavior. It just isn't befitting good breeding". TiVo management already knows everything you say, although your picture of the good old days of great support doesn't ring true to me -- how far back are you going for that scene?

    I think either one of two things must be true:
    1. TiVo does really care but they are reeling from problems related to the Rovi guide data "upgrade" (LOL), which management (in typical fashion) failed to anticipate.
    (Or)
    2. TiVo doesn't really care about stand-alone TiVo box business.

    In either case you're not telling them anything that will change their behavior, IMHO. They already know what you're telling them.
     
    jrtroo and BBHughes like this.
  3. Dec 3, 2016 #3 of 43
    atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

    6,948
    611
    Oct 11, 2005
    Rochester NY
    To many words for my liking. At the end of each survey I simple tell them the most important thing they can do is fix the guide data.
     
  4. Dec 3, 2016 #4 of 43
    Series3Sub

    Series3Sub Well-Known Member

    1,490
    131
    Mar 14, 2010
    Well, I am no longer recommending TiVo to others, and I used to quite a bit. Since Rovi took control, TiVo has gone downhill very fast and with great pain to the customer. My recommendation to others is as follows:
    1)For cable DVR: Just take the sorry cable co DVR. At least they will support or replace it far easier than dealing with TiVo, costs next to nothing up front, and that cable co DVR is now at least as reliable as TiVo's of today under Rovi. The very high investment in TiVo hardware (DVR's, Mini's, Stream) just can be justified for the an experience that is as least as bad or even worse than your cable co DVR.

    2)For OTA: Just get the Channel Master DVR+, which used to be the inferior experience because TiVo today is a mess with unreliable EPG, and other features--like networked DVR's--that don't always work like they are supposed to and used to, and all this for a sizeable investment in $$. While the CM alternative has only 2 tuners, may cost more $$ upfront if you want them in more then one room, at least you have reliability, adequate features, and even some new features added that mean you get something far better in return for your money than with, now flaky, TiVo that either misses recordings or records nothing because the One Pass tried to tune to one of the the voluminous out of market TV channels/stations that it adds to Your Channels.

    And my latest frustration with TiVo is that none of my S4-S5 DVR's network connect to my S3's. Now I have to try to fix that, if it can be fixed post Rovi purchase.
     
  5. Dec 3, 2016 #5 of 43
    driverseven

    driverseven Tivo Bolt

    52
    2
    Oct 11, 2007
    Westchester, NY

    Advertisements

    I have been a Tivo customer for over 10 years. I've bought 3 and for many years, we had 2 Tivo HD boxes operating in the house.

    I am very sorry that I am probably coming to the end of my days with Tivo. It makes me sad, because I love using Tivo. When the first of of the 2 HD boxes died, even though I had 10 months left on my annual service plan, Tivo refused to provide a transition plan. I'd have to start over with a new plan, basically throwing away $85. So we got a cable DVR for that one.

    Now, the second Tivo HD is starting to die (pixelation is starting to appear, indicating a hard disk about to fail) and I really don't like my choices. The white Bolt is just ugly. I'm not going to put a white box in my TV unit where I have to look at it while watching TV.

    And my only choice is a $500 bolt. That's ridiculous. I don't need 6 tuners or that much storage. I'm willing to spend $200 on a Tivo box and pay the annual service; and I would have bought additional minis to replace the 2 other cable boxes. But a $600 outlay? That's asking too much.

    I really hate to switch to the cable DVR but Tivo's product lineup is very poor right now
     
  6. Dec 3, 2016 #6 of 43
    thyname

    thyname Well-Known Member

    1,234
    139
    Dec 26, 2010
    N. Virginia
    You do realize that a Bolt 500 gb has a MSRP of $199, and can be often bought for $150 or less, right?

    P.S. Reading your post, it appears that you have not been in touch with Tivo since your HD boxes, ten years (or so) ago
     
  7. Dec 3, 2016 #7 of 43
    thyname

    thyname Well-Known Member

    1,234
    139
    Dec 26, 2010
    N. Virginia

    So, wtf are you still doing here? Take your ****** S3 boxes and go away.
     
    mchief likes this.
  8. Dec 3, 2016 #8 of 43
    alexb

    alexb Active Member

    436
    58
    Jan 4, 2003
    Kirkland, WA
    the rest of us don't care, i just became a TiVO customer and think the Bolt+ is awesome.
     
  9. Dec 3, 2016 #9 of 43
    Bigg

    Bigg Cord Cutter

    7,395
    808
    Oct 30, 2003
    Hartford-...
    I love my TiVo, but I think that the DVR segment is already far less relevant through no fault of TiVo. Streaming is taking over, and I find more and more time spent on my Roku versus my TiVo. I just got a Roamio OTA, which is a neat box, but your average user isn't doing OTA anyway, and most OTA users don't want to shell out the bucks for the Roamio OTA. That being said, I still think it is their best product, as cable companies can't just shut it out of their systems.

    TiVo is becoming less relevant in the retail space due to aggressive bundling of DVRs, the impending IPTV transition on cable-based MSOs, and TiVo getting shut out of DirecTV 10 or so years ago, and then DirecTV deliver a product that was basically almost a decade old when it came out in the THR22, which amounted to an HR10-250 with a larger hard drive, an MPEG-4 decoder, and a SWiM tuner, and is nothing like the Roamio or Genie.

    As far as what TiVo does today, other than the Rovi guide data mess (the guide data was a mess before, but now it's a lot worse), the software and service is pretty good. My Premiere XL4 started off as a slow as molasses 4-tuner DVR, and now is a whole-home system that can stream to 3 Minis at once with Dynamic Tuner Allocation, and is significantly faster than when it was new (it's the only product I can say this about in my memory). My Roamio OTA is even snappier, has a great OTA tuner in it, and upgrading it's hard drive was a breeze. The DVR might be dying, but it is going out in style with TiVo.
     
  10. Bigg

    Bigg Cord Cutter

    7,395
    808
    Oct 30, 2003
    Hartford-...
    Basically you don't want to PAY for the current flagship TiVo products? Buy a used Premiere 4 or XL4 or something. Or live life on the Edge and get a Roamio OTA and get a CableCard bracket for it. I think the market TiVo is in is disappearing as a whole, but within that market, as long as it survives, TiVo is KING.
     
  11. imsai

    imsai Budding TivoHead

    4
    1
    Dec 16, 2014
    Sandy Eggo,...
    The $500 white Bolt is NOT your only option.
    You can:
    1) Do a fix/upgrade on your HD. You'll need a 2TB or under sata drive (not "advanced" formatting) and some savvy, or a friend or hireable other person with said savvy. I've done that before.
    2) buy a used working Tivo (maybe with Lifetime!). You could get a S3 (mine has an OLED screen showing shows it is recording-wish I had it on the Roamio) or another HD, upgrade to a Premiere or a Roamio (I favor the Roamio "Basic" (not OTA) for my OTA/cable needs).
    3) Find a non-Tivo solution you favor.
    4) Buy the Bolt. Paint it your favorite color (I like "stone" paint for some of my computers), being careful not to paint over any vents. This may void the warranty, although I can't see how Tivo could argue it.
    5) Buy the Bolt, deal with the whiteness.
     
  12. Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

    27,636
    9,204
    Jul 28, 2005
    It's too bad you weren't in the market a year ago, when TiVo had its base Roamio unit, just like the Roamio OTA but which worked with OTA or cable, at $200 (and could be found in stores for $50-$75 less); TiVo even had it on promotion with lifetime for $400, if I'm recalling the figure correctly.

    By the way, to some other posters, why is it if someone posts a comment critical of TiVo pricing or offerings at this forum commenters so often go on the attack? Really? It's someone else's view, which the poster is just as entitled to as you are to your own . . . . IMHO.
     
    weaver, slowbiscuit and mschnebly like this.
  13. driverseven

    driverseven Tivo Bolt

    52
    2
    Oct 11, 2007
    Westchester, NY
    Exactly -- my point was that the current Tivo product selection is weak and the reason I took the time to post it is that I have spent a lot of time and money on Tivo over the years and I am disappointed with the current direction of the company.

    I wish I had the choices you're describing now. I did look into making an upgrade a year ago when the last unit died, but they didn't provide a mid-year transfer of the annual fee. Even thought I was 2 months into an annual subscription, their policy is that I had to pay an annual service fee on a unit that was dead.

    I could have just gone away quietly. 10 years ago when I started with Tivo I was one of the people recommending it to everyone. The software interface is genius. I really regret that there are such weak hardware choices today. Since the original poster decided to make his point as an open letter, I thought posting my issue here would help it be heard by people that actually can make a difference. A long shot, I know. It pains me to give up on Tivo.

    Fortunately, a cable DVR is just a rental. Unlike Tivo, I don't need to pony up $650 to try it out. If Tivo's product line improves, I'd love to return. I really hope it does.
     
  14. thyname

    thyname Well-Known Member

    1,234
    139
    Dec 26, 2010
    N. Virginia
    You guys keep talking about a $500 Bolt. Bolt is $200 or less.

    Read his post. He was willing to pay annual fees on top of the $200
     
  15. thyname

    thyname Well-Known Member

    1,234
    139
    Dec 26, 2010
    N. Virginia
    Bolt is $200 or less:

    Buy Now

    You said you are willing to pay $200 on a TiVo box AND pay the annual service.

    So go ahead and buy it. What's up with the whining?!?!

     
  16. driverseven

    driverseven Tivo Bolt

    52
    2
    Oct 11, 2007
    Westchester, NY
    My problem with the $200 Bolt is that it's white which is the worst possible choice they could have made for a device that needs to be visible within eye shot of your TV

    Maybe you're willing to accept any choice that Tivo management makes, I'm not. Go ahead and attack someone else who comes on here because they have been a loyal customer for over 10 years and don't like the current product choices. Go head and support Tivo management as they continue to drive down revenues -- 5 straight years of sales declines. I'm clearly not the only consumer with money to spend who doesn't like my choices.

    MarketWatch.com Mobile
     
  17. thyname

    thyname Well-Known Member

    1,234
    139
    Dec 26, 2010
    N. Virginia
    Now you were bringing up white color of Bolt. Really?

    Your first post (post #5 quoted above) said nothing about white color. Just complaining about the $500 price or $600 price (you probably looked at the Bolt+, and had no idea about the 4-tuner Bolts).

    You specifically mentioned that you would be willing to pay $200 and do the annual service. You said you don't need the six tuners and the big recording space.

    When I brought up the pricing on the regular Bolts, which by the way is exactly what you said you were willing to pay, you are now refusing to buy because of color.

    You are clearly coming here to ***** for no reasons or for some unknown reasons. Why? Your logic does not make sense.

    As for "loyal customer ", you have not bought a TiVo in ten years. What changed now from your perspective? Same reason(s) that you have not upgraded your TiVo during these 10+ years.

    While I completely agree with most observations from the OP, stupid and pointless comments from people like you make me mad. Go away from these forums. There is clearly no reason for you to be here.
     
  18. Anotherpyr

    Anotherpyr Active Member

    456
    123
    May 6, 2015
    I can't imagine Rovi doing anything to improve the customer experience. They've been part of the drm, content provider side of the coin that they're more about making the people tivo pissed off happy than making the user experience better.
     
  19. Mikeguy

    Mikeguy Well-Known Member

    27,636
    9,204
    Jul 28, 2005
    1. driverseven indeed specifically raised the white color issue in his original post--you must have missed it.
    For some reason, in your quoting back driverseven's original post, you specifically deleted that section.

    2. Perhaps you are having a bad morning, but would you please stop the name-calling and personal attacks? There simply is no need for that, simply because you disagree with another's appropriate expressing of his/her views. Instead, you might even be able to educate the person, as you also tried to do.

    3. I do agree that the Bolt seemingly is a great machine and option in and of itself, including price-wise (apart from color, heh-heh; and while I appreciate TiVo's attempt at fashion with the Bolt shape, I can see why some would find it off-putting and/or inconvenient). For me, though, it just gets, in typical TiVo fashion, heftily expensive when a lifetime subscription is added--always a TiVo issue for me. But much more affordable, and a deal, with a Cyber Monday promotion, a short form of price diversification. And fortunately, as an OTA guy, I've been able to take advantage of TiVo's current Roamio OTA promotion, a truly stellar deal and price diversification of TiVo's lineup (albeit temporary), as well as a 10-year loyalty offer from TiVo last year, another price line-up diversification.
     
    slowbiscuit and mschnebly like this.
  20. slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

    4,583
    571
    Sep 19, 2006
    In the ATL
    Who pissed in your Wheaties? Lighten up man, this ain't a fanboi forum. People have a right to gripe.
     
    weaver and Mikeguy like this.

Share This Page

spam firewall

Advertisements