Can Tivo itself be used as a Moca bridge for other devices?

Discussion in 'TiVo Help Center' started by bensonr2, Jan 5, 2017.

  1. Jan 5, 2017 #1 of 58
    bensonr2

    bensonr2 Member

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    I am moving into a new home next month, and am planning out my networking and Tivo setup for the home.

    I want to install a Moca bridge where I will have the router and cable modem installed.

    I know from their I can connect all my Moca enabled Tivo devices to the network simply via coax.

    The question is, can I use my Roamio Pro and or my Premiere XL4 to bridge the network to a network 4 port switch to connect my other networked entertainment devices? Basically in the hopes of avoiding needing to purchase more Moca bridges.
     
  2. Jan 5, 2017 #2 of 58
    slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    Yes, I do that on my Roamio to bridge a coax wireless router (former Verizon FIOS Actiontec model that I got cheap on fleabay) to my internet router. And any device attached to it.

    You don't need a MoCA bridge at your router/modem port, in other words - the Roamio will bridge all coax devices to all ethernet simply by attaching it to both networks. Assuming everything on your coax and ethernet can talk to the Roamio, that is.
     
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  3. Jan 5, 2017 #3 of 58
    bensonr2

    bensonr2 Member

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    Thanks for the information. That's not a bad idea but I don't think it will work in my situation. I'm not planning on installing a Tivo where the modem and router will be installed.
     
  4. Jan 5, 2017 #4 of 58
    cobcwc

    cobcwc New Member

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    I believe it will work (see below). I've been meaning to try it myself, just haven't had a chance yet.
     
  5. Jan 6, 2017 #5 of 58
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    ^^^ What cobcwc said ^^^

    MoCA - simple cable setup.png

    Noting that this is NOT officially supported by TiVo; nevertheless, plenty of people are doing just what you described in the OP. (As the quoted text states, the Ethernet connection to the isolated switch must be made *after* the MoCA client setup on the DVR is completed.)

    e.g.
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2017
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  6. Jan 6, 2017 #6 of 58
    ragu0012

    ragu0012 Member

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    I found this thread because I think I'm trying to accomplish the same thing.... I just need to know what kind of hardware I now need at a minimum. I have the Moca network activated through my Motorola/Arris SBG6782-AC cable modem/router. I have the filter attached at one end. My TIvo minis work at various coax outlets.

    Now I essentially want to connect wired internet on my desktop computer in the basement. What device do I need to connect to the coax outlet there to run ethernet to the PC? (I currently run coax from the outlet to a mini in that same room, so I would prefer to continue doing that plus add the ethernet, with a splitter?)

    Any help is appreciated.
     
  7. Jan 6, 2017 #7 of 58
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    If that were a MoCA-capable TiVo DVR down there in the basement, instead of a Mini, you *would* be trying to do the same thing; unfortunately, a Mini lacks the bridging feature of the MoCA-capable DVRs {BOLTs, 6-tuner Roamios & 4-tuner Premieres}.

    What you'll need to do, instead, is install a MoCA adapter in that basement location, with the help of a MoCA-compatible splitter (e.g.) to get the coax to both the adapter and the Mini. (see NOTE below*) You'd then either connect the MoCA adapter's Ethernet port directly to the PC or to a network switch, if there are multiple devices you want to connect. If you *do* go with the Ethernet switch approach, you could skip the additional coax split and instead connect the Mini to the Ethernet switch, along with the PC -- reconfiguring the Mini for an Ethernet connection (noting that the Mini's Ethernet interface is Fast Ethernet, 100 Mbps, while its MoCA 1.1 interface rates 140-170 Mbps).

    * NOTE that if you acquire a MoCA adapter with a 2nd coax "TV/RF Out" port, you could not use this port to daisy-chain the Mini via coax for MoCA connectivity as the "RF/TV Out" port on a MoCA adapter does NOT pass MoCA signals, at least not without severe, MoCA-inhibiting loss.​

    As for which MoCA adapter to buy, per its product page, the SBG6782-AC is a "MoCA 1.1 Access Point." Normally, buying MoCA 2.0 adapters wouldn't provide any benefit over MoCA 1.1 adapters in terms of improving MoCA throughput to your router & Internet, since a pair of MoCA nodes would communicate at the fastest spec supported by *both* nodes, MoCA 1.1 in this case; however, since most MoCA 1.1 adapters only include Fast Ethernet interfaces, throttling the MoCA 1.1 140-170 Mbps speeds down to Fast Ethernet's 100 Mbps when the traffic is bridged, the Gigabit ports on MoCA 2.0 adapters would at least allow for maximum MoCA 1.1 throughput. Of course, if your basement PC only has a Fast Ethernet interface (like the Mini), then this difference is moot.

    See >this post<
    for some MoCA adapters from which you could choose. Sporting MoCA 1.1 and a built-in Gigabit Ethernet switch, the Verizon MI424-WR Rev.I router, which can be reconfigured as simply a MoCA adapter (w/ wireless access point, if desired) might be of special interest to you, if you're up for a marginal bit of extra configuration (and eBay bargain hunting).

    (edited to correct MoCA adapter criteria paragraph that had ignored adapter Ethernet interfaces; later edited to add caution regarding MoCA adapter pass-through port; fixed missing close-quote on "MoCA 1.1. Access Point," and added capitalization)
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2017
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  8. Jan 7, 2017 #8 of 58
    ragu0012

    ragu0012 Member

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    Wow thanks for the extremely helpful reply. I am going to try and nab a MI424WR Rev I on ebay. Is there already a post detailing how to reconfigure it? Thanks again.


     
  9. Jan 7, 2017 #9 of 58
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Ah, an adventurous soul. Yeah, there's instructions somewhere about; should be able to find & link 'em before you have the device in hand.
     
  10. slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    You don't have to connect the Tivo directly to the router if you can extend your ethernet to another room with a switch.
     
  11. slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    http://support.actiontec.com/doc_files/Configure_MI424WR_as_a_LAN_MoCA_Bridge.pdf

    These things are cheap and rock-solid when used as a coax to LAN bridge. They can also act as wireless APs with MoCA to extend your wireless (albeit at 2.4Ghz 802.11g speeds).
     
  12. krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Thanks for that link, fastbiscuit~!

    Also, the "Rev.I" identifier is key, both to get the Gigabit Ethernet ports (so you're getting the max MoCA 1.1 throughput) but also to get the Wireless-N upgrade -- though you're likely right re: the single band (2.4GHz) aspect; I can't find any mention of frequencies supported, so I'm taking it to mean just 2.4. Those needing more would likely want to upgrade to a MoCA 2.0 adapter/wireless extender.

    Actiontec datasheet (Verizon datasheet)
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2017
  13. ragu0012

    ragu0012 Member

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    Got one on ebay, followed some instructions, and it seems to be working! (as i am typing this from that PC)
    Thanks everyone!

    One quick Q -- now that I have this hooked up, can I replace my Arris SBG6782-AC with a different router and separate modem? or are both needed to get MOCA out of each coax outlet for my tivo minis?


    (speed test gives me 119 Mbps download, 5.61 Mbps upload, which is precicely what i currently pay for, so I am very please with the speed from the MI424WR Rev I router used as MOCA gateway)
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2017
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  14. slowbiscuit

    slowbiscuit FUBAR

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    Yep, I run a separate router and modem with my MoCA setup. You only need one MoCA bridge, doesn't matter where it's connected on your ethernet as long as it can talk to the router.
     
  15. krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Great to hear! (though typing a forum post is likely a bit less bandwidth-taxing than this week's college football nat'l championship game)

    You *can* replace the SBG6782-AC, so long as you replace all its required functionality... with combo devices or standalones. Your current cable gateway is your cable modem, firewall, router and both wireless and MoCA access points.

    So, if you want to replace the SBG6782-AC with a separate cable modem and wireless router, you *will* need to pickup another MoCA adapter for installation at the modem/router location, in order to establish your MoCA network. (see)

    That's fortuitous. That's a minimum of 19 Mbps better than you could have gotten with an older standard MoCA 1.1 adapter with just Fast Ethernet (100 Mbps) ports. However, if you're now also considering an upgrade of your gateway and end up needing to add another MoCA adapter to provide the main MoCA bridging function, the MI424-WR Rev.I's do provide a cheap MoCA solution... but a pair of MoCA 2.0 adapters would give you a bump in bandwidth between your PC desktop in the basement and the router. Whether you *need* any more speed than the Rev.I's offer is the question.

    If you had a couple PCs, you could use a tool such as iPerf, jPerf or LAN Speed Test to test the actual bandwidth over your MoCA segment, between your typing location and the router, removing the Internet bottleneck from the equation.
     
  16. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    One other option, replace the Arris SBG6782, with a standard cable modem and then use a Verizon G1100, dual band AC, MoCA 2.0. Just connect the Ethernet from the cable modem to the WAN Ethernet on the G1100.
    verizon g1100 | eBay
     
  17. ragu0012

    ragu0012 Member

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    So is this true?

    Or this?



     
  18. krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Slowbiscuit's comment is accurate; mine assumed Ethernet access to your router was only available at the router location.
     
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  19. ragu0012

    ragu0012 Member

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    Do you know how to configure my MI424-WRI for a wireless access point in addition to moca adapter? Following whatever instructions I can find to do so (naming SSID and password same as I did on my primary router, and DHCP already being disabled from moca config,) it ends up making the internet not work when connected to that wifi network.



     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2017
  20. fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Assuming you have MoCA configured on the Tivo DVR, your connection to your 2nd router (assuming it is correctly configured as an AP only) should be via the Ethernet on the Tivo DVR to one of the LAN ports on the AP.
    If you are having trouble, the most likely source of error is the AP configuration.
    EDIT: To test your AP configuration, try to make a direct Ethernet connection to the AP Lan from one of the Ethernet ports on the primary router....yes temporarily move it to the primary router's location.
     

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