Cablevision granted waiver; can encrypt basic in one area

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by bicker, Jan 8, 2010.

  1. Jan 8, 2010 #1 of 98
    bicker

    bicker bUU

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    The findings of the FCC:
    So the FCC is saying here that it is reasonable to consider 99% such an overwhelming portion of the whole, that the potentially-negative impact of the change on the remaining 1% is insufficient to constitute a reason to preclude the waiver. They are also implying that the potentially-negative impact of the change on subscribers who have one STB or CableCARD, but perhaps have other outlets in use without STB or CableCARD, is insufficient to constitute a reason to preclude the waiver. This makes it clear that the FCC acknowledges the difference between a first outlet and additional outlets, and essentially places regulatory obligations onto suppliers principally on the first outlet.

    Here the FCC is making clear that mitigation of the change can be quite limited, yet still be considered sufficient. There is no allusion here that the change will not adversely affect some customers, nor any allusion that mitigation associated with such adverse affects would be permanent.



    http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-10-34A1.txt
     
  2. Jan 8, 2010 #2 of 98
    dylanemcgregor

    dylanemcgregor Well-Known Member

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    That's too bad. I'm moving into a Cablevision neighborhood and had planned to subscribe to basic since it specifically seemed you wouldn't need a cable box. Oh well, I've been doing OK with IPTV for the last couple of years won't be that hard to keep that going...it might even be possible for me to get OTA at the new place which will make cable even less essential.
     
  3. Jan 8, 2010 #3 of 98
    daveak

    daveak Series 3 Novice

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    If they do it once, they will do it again. Cable cards or nothing.
     
  4. Jan 8, 2010 #4 of 98
    MickeS

    MickeS Active Member

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    So, in short, customers who currently use a digital receiver without CableCARDs (a 3rd party recorder or a TV, essentially) are the only ones who will be affected by this?
     
  5. Jan 8, 2010 #5 of 98
    lew

    lew Well-Known Member

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    Bicker--I didn't read the entire decision. It sounds like Cablevision will be allowed to encrypt broadcast stations. Is there something buried in the report that suggests otherwise?


    MickeS--This request was made prsuant to Cablevision converting to 100% digital. The result of this decision will affect adversly affect any customer using an analog tuner. It will affect anyone using a clear QAM tuner (in a computer).
     
  6. Jan 8, 2010 #6 of 98
    bicker

    bicker bUU

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    That is exactly what the waiver allows -- it is really the whole point of the waiver.

    The regulations already on the books, prior to this, already allowed that. I know, because two of our providers here in Burlington have already done it. Rather, the "result of this decision" is really just about encryption.

    Definitely.
     
  7. Jan 8, 2010 #7 of 98
    zalusky

    zalusky Well-Known Member TCF Club

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    Start getting those antennas ready.
     
  8. Jan 8, 2010 #8 of 98
    schwinn

    schwinn Member

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    Now that the waiver is granted, what would make sense is to see how many existing customers "suddenly need" DTA or cable boxes for their TVs. That would confirm whether the 99% number they quote is actually true or not. (Needless to say, I don't believe it... and they don't provide their source of that information.)

    Of course, something tells me they won't collect this data... and no one will ask for it anyway. Who needs follow-through and accountability anyway?
     
  9. Jan 8, 2010 #9 of 98
    bicker

    bicker bUU

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    You misread the order.
     
  10. wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Well-Known Mumbler

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    Outrageous. :mad:
     
  11. dstoffa

    dstoffa Member

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    Why so? In urban NYC, do you realize how many cable drops cannot be disconnected, and persons in those dwellings are received 'free' broadcast basic?

    From what I've read, if you currently subscribe to Broadcast Basic Only:
    You will get up to 2 cable-card or STBs free for 2 years.

    If you subscribe to a digital cable package with an additional analog outlet, you will get:
    One additional cable-card or STB free for 1 year.

    If you are a qualified low-income subscriber to only Broadcast Basic, you will get up to two cable-cards or STBs free for FIVE years.

    If you subscribe to Broadcast Basic ONLY, and have a device with a Clear QAM tuner (i.e. - HDTV or Tivo), they will give you up to 2 cable cards or 2 STBs free for TEN years.

    Seems as if 99.44 percent of the people who will get screwed are those who aren't paying for the service.
     
  12. ZeoTiVo

    ZeoTiVo I can't explain

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    that is kind of the whole point. You have devices that can map the clear QAM to guide data for the actual channel and you effectively had the cable company supply free HD service for a basic tier price as enforced by law.
    The waiver seems like valid reasoning to me in order to reverse that mistake in the law. Let those that want in unencumbered go OTA instead.
     
  13. MickeS

    MickeS Active Member

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    But 100% digital is already allowed everywhere. Like you say, it seems to affect anyone using a "clear QAM tuner". Which, basically, is close to nobody.

    I know we on the board here were hoping for TiVo to create a way to do manual (or automatic) channel mapping of QAM channels, but TiVo obviously have shown no interest in spending time and effort on that.

    I'd say that estimating that 1% of users use clear QAM directly into computers and TVs and are affected here is probably an overstatement. I don't LIKE this, but in terms of the effect on users, this is probably barely noticable.
     
  14. MickeS

    MickeS Active Member

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    The only difference that I can see is that they need to get a CableCARD now (which obviously right now is a problem in much of the affected electronics, except for TiVo, Moxi and a few more). Unless Cablevision prohibits them from getting that without signing up for a "digital tier" of some kind?
     
  15. MickeS

    MickeS Active Member

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    While I loved that the cable companies were not allowed to encrypt the basic channels (I got the unencrypted HD like that for a short while myself), it does seem a bit unfair to force them to do so. I wouldn't use the word "mistake in the law", as I can see some valid reasoning for it. But I can also see why cable companies believe they shouldn't have to do it.

    Since "basic" service here now costs $23/month, I'd hardly call that "free HD" though!
     
  16. Brainiac 5

    Brainiac 5 New Member

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    What was the mistake? Do you mean getting over-the-air HD channels for just the price of basic cable? That wasn't a mistake.
     
  17. bicker

    bicker bUU

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    That would not be permitted, given the circumstances.
     
  18. mattack

    mattack Well-Known Member

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    The Moxi does allow clear QAM remapping though..
     
  19. steve614

    steve614 what ru lookin at?

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    Currently the cable companies have no control over how many outlets a user might have because of the QAM tuners in TVs and other devices.
    A cable subscriber can essentially pay for 1 outlet, and later split the incoming cable and feed as many TVs in the house they want.
    The cable companies want to treat each TV as an outlet and this encryption waiver allows them to do that.
    So, you want cable on 5 TVs? You have to pay for 5 outlets.
     
  20. wmcbrine

    wmcbrine Well-Known Mumbler

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    ...which doesn't make it a mistake. Cable companies want per-outlet pricing, certainly. That doesn't mean they're entitled to it. I share lew's bafflement at ZeoTiVo's comment.
     

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