Bolt and Mini setup help

Discussion in 'TiVo Help Center' started by hoopster3, Mar 5, 2017.

  1. Mar 5, 2017 #1 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    Getting ready to ditch DirecTV and go with an HD antenna and some streaming services. I already bought a Tivo Bolt and a Mini. My problem comes in when I think about the install and all the articles I've read.

    My modem is on the 1st floor and doesn't have access to the Bolt in the basement and I probably could run an ethernet cord to the Mini but it will he difficult. I have read so much about MoCA and PoE that I'm lost. Many of the info I've read pertain to things that worked before the Bolt came along.

    My hope was to have the Bolt connect wirelessly and run an ethernet cord to the Mini. After reading more, I don't think that's possible now. In plain English can someone tell me the best way to connect everything? I have no idea if my home is setup for MoCA.

    Also, is the point where my internet comes into my house in a coaxial cable the point of entry? Any help would be greatly appreciated!
     
  2. Mar 5, 2017 #2 of 148
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Yes, that's your cable provider point-of-entry.

    How do you plan on connecting an antenna to the BOLT? Will you be using an in-room antenna, or locating the antenna elsewhere and routing the signal via coax to the BOLT? As an OTA and cable Internet user, the main thing to be avoided is mixing your OTA antenna and cable signals on the same coax lines.

    As for networking, MoCA just passes network signals over coax lines, but those coax lines do need to interconnect and extend to the locations where you want connectivity. Do you have coax outlets in each room...
    • Cable modem/router location? (An obvious 'yes')
    • BOLT?
    • Mini?
    ... and how many coax outlets per room (in case you need 2 separate runs in the modem or BOLT location)?

    Also, do you know whether these runs connect, or could? (The modem line and your DirecTV lines obviously aren't connected currently, but do they all route through some central junction such that they *could* connect, if/when needed, post-DirecTV?)

    Lastly, for now, can you provide the model number of your cable modem? (Needed to determine MoCA compatibility.)
     
  3. Mar 6, 2017 #3 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    I plan on connecting an in room antenna to both the Bolt and Mini. If reception isn't great, I'll look at other options. I shouldn't have cable signals running through my coax, should I? I don't plan on having cable.

    I do have coax outlets in each room now, as that is how DirecTV is setup. All those cables are routed through the basement where the Bolt will be. The modem and both Tivos will have their own outlet.

    I'm not sure if all the coax routes through the same place or not. I know that my current setup has the main DirecTV DVD where the Mini will go and the smaller repeater DirecTV is in the basement. They both connect through coax and work well. My hope is everything is already setup and good to go....but with my luck I'm betting it won't work that way.

    Mediacom modem model: TC8715
    Router model: Netgear WNDR4000

    Thank you for the help!
     
  4. Mar 6, 2017 #4 of 148
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Only the BOLT will require the OTA antenna signal. The BOLT handles all tuning duties, including for the Mini, and streams the content to the Mini over the network -- thus the need for a high bandwidth network connection between the BOLT and Mini(s). The Mini only requires a wired network connection to the BOLT, either Ethernet or MoCA (or a mix of both, if needed).

    As far as determining what type of antenna you may need, several websites aim to help with that:



    Hmmm... per this User Guide, the TC8715 appears to be a MoCA-capable gateway. However, if the modem is configured in bridge mode, in order to use the Netgear as your primary router, the modem's MoCA functionality is unusable. (It's also possible that your cable provider wouldn't allow enabling the MoCA feature in the gateway.) I'll proceed assuming the MoCA network will need to be established via some other device.
     
  5. Mar 6, 2017 #5 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    Thank you for that new information. I guess I can take an antenna back. Are you saying I'll need one cord (Ethernet or MoCA) that goes from the Bolt to the Mini? Or is there a way to tie in MoCA with my already in place coax cables?
     
  6. Mar 6, 2017 #6 of 148
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    Maybe, it all depends on how you're able to get the MoCA signals to each required location -- and largely dependent on the coax runs available to work with.

    It sounds to me like you have the possibility of three different, totally isolated coax segments:
    • cable provider Internet connection directly to cable modem
    • in-room antenna connection directly to BOLT
    • existing DirecTV coax lines
    If the DirecTV lines connect to all 3 rooms (modem, Roamio, Mini) then the MoCA network can be established on the DirecTV coax lines, once DirecTV is offline. You'd just need a MoCA adapter at the modem/router location to establish the MoCA network (connected to a LAN port on the router and via coax to what was the DirecTV outlet for the room), switch the main DirecTV splitter to a MoCA-rated splitter, and place a "PoE" MoCA filter and 75-ohm terminator on the input to the splitter.

    Your setup sounds similar to this other recent example...

    CABB & OTA - Copy.png
    ... though you'd want to use an antenna/satellite diplexer at the BOLT location, rather than a MoCA adapter, to deliver just the merged MoCA and OTA signals to the MoCA-capable BOLT's coax port, and configure the BOLT as a MoCA client. (The diplexer's "VHF/UHF" antenna port would be connected to the antenna feed, and the "SAT" port to the coax outlet connected back to the "MoCA" coax lines (formerly the DirecTV coax lines).

    e.g. ...
    diplexer connections.png

    ... resulting in:
    CABB & BOLT-OTA.png

    NOTE: Optional network switch pictured at BOLT location, per >this<.​

    edit: p.s. See here for MoCA-related parts.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2017
  7. Mar 6, 2017 #7 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    Would a TiVo Bridge help me out? If so, where would I install it and what else would be needed?
     
  8. Mar 6, 2017 #8 of 148
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    I'm not sure you've read all the posts; I also just posted an update to the last.

    edit: p.s. The "TiVo Bridge" is just the retail product name for TiVo's rebranding of the Actiontec ECB6000 standard MoCA 2.0 MoCA adapter (a.k.a. Ethernet-to-Coaxial Bridge).
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2017
  9. Mar 6, 2017 #9 of 148
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    The BOLT and Mini won't be directly connected to each other; they each just need to be wired to your network, and they'll communicate with each other over your home network. And you'll be using your coax cabling and a MoCA adapter to get each device bridged via coax over to your Ethernet LAN.
     
  10. Mar 6, 2017 #10 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    I must not have refreshed before typing my last response, so I didn't see your post.

    Trying to digest all this info and visualize how it will be setup. Now I've just learned the word "diplexer". I'm assuming this is needed so I can run my antenna signal and internet to the Bolt as it only has one coax input?

    The 1st illustration you posted has me confused as well. I don't know what all those components are. Specifically the device connected to the PoE 4x label. By the looks of it I'll need a PoE, bridge and a diplexer. Is that right?

    The junction box is throwing me for a loop. Do I need one of these as well? So I'll need to run coax from the junction box to each Tivo? I was hoping my exsisting coax setup would work but now I'm not sure....
     
  11. Mar 6, 2017 #11 of 148
    krkaufman

    krkaufman TDL shepherd

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    "4x" indicates a simple 4-way coax splitter (ideally right-sized for your setup and upgraded to a MoCA-rated splitter), and "junction box" is merely a holdover from the example diagram.
     
  12. Mar 6, 2017 #12 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    Here a picture of where everything comes into my house. A coax comes from here to both my current DirecTV receivers and to my modem. Does this help in anyway?

    [​IMG]

    Is this where any MoCA connections would go? Or do I have to do that after my internet connection?
     
  13. Mar 6, 2017 #13 of 148
    fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Hi,
    Not sure if it helps, but your TV's are now connected to the 4 outputs of the green Directv spitter, it's input is connected to your Directv dish. That splitter should be replaced with a MoCA optimized one. My guess is that the red 3 way is likely your internet providers connection to your cable modem. Hard to say what that red 4?way is with one coax connected to...do you have an antenna somewhere. The links below should be a good source for anything you might need except for the MoCA adapters/MoCA "bridges"
    Cable and Satellite Tools - Distributor of Tools for CATV, Satellite, Home Theater, Security, Telecom
    Holland DPD2 2 Amp Satellite Diplexer
    Cable and Satellite Tools - Distributor of Tools for CATV, Satellite, Home Theater, Security, Telecom
    Holland 3Ghz F81
     
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  14. Mar 6, 2017 #14 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    Thanks for the response and the links. Would those products be better than what I could get on a run to Best Buy?

    No antenna currently connected, so not sure what that red device is for.
     
  15. Mar 6, 2017 #15 of 148
    fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Better both techically and financially.
     
  16. Mar 6, 2017 #16 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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  17. Mar 7, 2017 #17 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    Never heard back but I went ahead and ordered those items. Do I also need a Tivo Bridge?
     
  18. Mar 7, 2017 #18 of 148
    fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Better to have and not need then to need and not have.
    You should study those excellent diagrams provided by kaufman and figure out which fits your situation, it is hard to do this by remote without complete information.
    Having said that you will need to figure some way to get internet to your Bolt (and not via wireless) and this is the real "trick" to getting an OTA setup working so it is Ethernet or MoCA. You also need to figure out how to prevent the MoCA signals from going out over the antenna connection...this is where the diplexer and or MoCA filter may come in.
    If you can get Ethernet from your router to the Bolt, you can use your Bolt to create the MoCA network. If you can't get Ethernet to the Bolt, you will have to figure out how to get a MoCA adapter connected to the common coax (with the Bolt and minis) and an Ethernet connection from the adapter/bridge to the router. In that case, you would just use the Bolt to connect to a MoCA network. Sorry I forget the Bolt's new wording for the MoCA connection.
     
  19. Mar 7, 2017 #19 of 148
    hoopster3

    hoopster3 Member

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    Does the Bridge have to be connected after the modem or can it be installed before and then go to the modem?

    I ask because my point of entry is in the basement, but my modem is located a floor up. If I could install the Bridge at the PoE it would be much easier instead of up to the 1st floor and then back down to the basement.
     
  20. Mar 7, 2017 #20 of 148
    fcfc2

    fcfc2 Well-Known Member

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    Without knowing how your coax / internet wiring is layed out any answers I can give are just optional guesses....which tire me out.
     

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