AV Receiver dropping audio when using Tivo menus.

Discussion in 'TiVo Coffee House - TiVo Discussion' started by nuraman00, Oct 6, 2020.

  1. Oct 6, 2020 #1 of 36
    nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Dec 28, 2012

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    I set up my AV Receiver for the first time on Sunday.

    I kept having a problem where if I'd use the Tivo navigation to FF or REW, and I'd push those navigation buttons quickly, then the home theater would lose sound when I would push play again. I'd either have to turn the receiver off, then on again. Or I'd have to switch source inputs on the receiver, then back to the Tivo source input again.

    The same thing happens if I hit the Tivo button to bring up the main menu, and stay on there for some period of time.

    Why does this happen? It's annoying. If this continues, I'd rather just play Tivo through my TV speakers.

    So my AVR displays these things when INFO is pressed:

    Source
    Sound
    Signal
    MultEQ
    Dynamic Volume

    When things are proper from my Tivo, the Sound is "DD + DSur".

    The Signal is "Dolby Audio - DD".

    When the sound goes away, the Sound is "Stereo".

    The Signal is "PCM Zero".


    Doing more trial and error with the settings, these settings seemed to reduce the amount of times the audio was lost:

    Settings-->Audio-->Restorer: High

    Restorer AVR-S750H

    Settings-->Audio-->Audyssey:

    Audyssey® AVR-S750H

    MultEQ: Reference

    Dynamic EQ: On

    Dynamic Volume: Heavy

    Settings--Video-->HDMI Setup:

    ARC: Off (since my TV doesn't have it)

    This made the audio loss a lot less frequent. I could hit Tivo button, or use the FF or REW buttons, a lot more times, before audio was lost.

    It would still happen a little bit, though.

    Then I went into the Tivo audio settings, and turned off the Tivo sound effect sounds.

    After that, when my AVR would lose audio, I could restore it without changing inputs, by hitting the volume up or volume down button on the AVR remote. So the audio was still being lost, but it seemed like it could be restored more easily by changing the volume, rather than changing source inputs.

    Does anyone know why this happens, and how I can fix it?

    I think it has something to do with how pressing the Tivo button, or using the FF or REW arrow buttons, want to change the input to PCM Stereo. And if that happens enough times, the audio gets lost some of those times.

    But what's the solution?
     
  2. Oct 6, 2020 #2 of 36
    nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Dec 28, 2012
    I called Denon, my AV Receiver manufacturer.

    They said it's a common problem with DVRs or cable boxes that try to play their own sounds. They said sometimes, the sound doesn't switch back.

    They said a work around would be to do this:

    * Connect Tivo back to TV.

    * Use optical out from the TV.

    I did that, and selected the TV/Audio input on my receiver. That input on my receiver is for the optical input connection. I don't hear anything from my receiver, only from my TV speakers.

    (They also said to keep an HDMI out connection from my receiver to the TV. But that doesn't seem to add much, and now I have to use 2 HDMI inputs on my TV, whereas before I had to use one. Since now they said to connect both the DVR, and the AVR, to the TV.

    (I also have other things connected to my TV's other HDMI Inputs, but I don't want to create an extra HDMI connection to my TV, with this whole setup.)

    @slowbiscuit (since you use an optical connection).

    For now, I went back to connecting my Tivo to my AVR, and going from HDMI Out on my AVR to my TV.

    I'm also keeping the optical out from my TV to the receiver connected, but for now I don't think it's doing anything.
     
  3. Oct 7, 2020 #3 of 36
    keithg1964

    keithg1964 Ragonk

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    I have my Tivo connected to my Denon AVR-S650 with none of those issues using HDMI cables. The receiver shows DD all the time. I do not get the Tivo Sound effects since it is dolby. If I switch the Tivo to PCM then I get the sound effects, but the sound sucks. I would reset the receiver to default and swap the HDMI cables.
     
  4. Oct 7, 2020 #4 of 36
    keithg1964

    keithg1964 Ragonk

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    Also I have been routing my Tivos thru receivers for a long time, and have never seen or heard of the issues you are seeing.
     
  5. Oct 7, 2020 #5 of 36
    nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Thanks. What do you think I should do? Should I return it and try a different model?

    On top of that, I can't return it cleanly. Yesterday, the flap of one of the optical ports got jammed inside the port. I can't fix that.

    I mean, I could "try" to return the receiver to Costco, and hope they don't catch it, but that's not an honest thing to do.
     
  6. Oct 7, 2020 #6 of 36
    nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    And it's good to know you're using a similar model of receiver as I am, as you have the S650. Mine is the S750H, so the behavior should be similar.

    So just to make sure my setup is the same, I have:

    HDMI from Slingbox to "Cable/Satellite" input on Denon. (The Slingbox is connected to my Tivo).

    HDMI from HDMI Out on Denon, to TV.

    And this was added yesterday, to try something else:

    Optical out from TV to Denon.

    Other than not having a Slingbox, and probably using the HDMI from your Tivo directly, is your setup the same?

    I'm fine with not getting the Tivo sound effects. I just don't want the audio to drop so often, when I use the Tivo menu or use the FF or REW navigation through a recording or live TV.
     
  7. Oct 7, 2020 #7 of 36
    nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    One last thing I'm going to do before I call Denon again, is to make sure my optical cable works, in case they want me to use that.

    I'll try connecting my PC to my receiver via the cable, or my portable CD player to the receiver.
     
  8. Oct 7, 2020 #8 of 36
    nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Dec 28, 2012
    And Denon has more limited customer support hours right now, because of the pandemic. They're not open on the weekends, which makes things more difficult.

    I don't want to send my receiver in to them to have them repair the optical port just yet, because I also am evaluating my speakers to see if I want to keep them. I have 30 days to decide if I want to keep the speakers. I have about 22 days left. I don't want to lose 2 - 3 weeks of that time because my receiver is being sent to Denon to repair the optical port.
     
  9. Oct 7, 2020 #9 of 36
    keithg1964

    keithg1964 Ragonk

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    I do not have an slingbox. I would remove it to test.
     
    kpeters59 likes this.
  10. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Thanks. The Slingbox just lets me remotely access my Tivo. It mirrors exactly what's on the Tivo.

    Before, I had my Tivo to the Slingbox, and Slingbox to the TV. No issues during the 2 years since I've had that setup.

    Now with the receiver, in theory I'd just be changing 1 thing with the Slingbox going to receiver.
     
  11. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Can you post your settings for these from your Denon? If it's easier, maybe post a screen shot. Whatever's easier for you.

    Settings-->Audio

    Settings--Video-->HDMI Setup:
     
  12. keithg1964

    keithg1964 Ragonk

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    Both set to default. I have not seen or heard of anybody having this issue. I really think the issue is with the slingbox or bad receiver.
     
  13. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Dec 28, 2012
    I tried connecting directly from Tivo to receiver. Same issue.

    It's easy to reproduce, I just hit the Tivo button a few times, and one of those times, the sound will drop out.

    Sometimes I can fix it by changing the volume on the receiver. Then the sound will come back.

    But other times, I either have to change inputs on the receiver, or turn it off or on.

    On another issue, I tried my Toslink cable from my PC to my receiver, I can't hear anything. So I've tried the Toslink cable from my TV to the receiver; from the Tivo to the receiver; and from my PC to the receiver. No sound. And I tried both optical ports on the receiver. Either the ports are bad, or the cable is bad.

    And as I mentioned, optical port # 1 is jammed anyways, that needs to be fixed either before I return or exchange it.

    I'm calling Denon again now. I had to wait on hold for 48 mins yesterday.
     
  14. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    So just to confirm, you use your Tivo remote a lot (navigating the menus; navigating FF or REW in recordings) and the sound on your receiver never drops out completely?

    Also, when using your TV speakers, do you normally have it play the Tivo menu and navigation sounds?
     
  15. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Dec 28, 2012
    What model Tivo do you have? I have a Premiere XL4.
     
  16. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    After a long support call with Denon:

    * Couldn't resolve the audio drop-off issue via HDMI.

    * When I also mentioned the problem I was having with not hearing anything via optical either, we went to the input assignment menu. Under the optical input names ("TV/Audio", "Media Player"), HDMI was selected as the source.

    I couldn't change it to optical.

    We reset the input assignments to factory default.

    I then saw OPT as the output for those to optical input names. I then also manually set them to digital. (Other options are Auto, or HDMI).

    After doing that, I could finally hear audio from my PC to the receiver.

    Then, after hanging up, I connected the optical from my TV, to the receiver. It worked, but said it was in Stereo.

    Which I kind of expected, since people told me in another thread that would happen. They said some TVs convert it to stereo. I know I have my TV audio settings to Dolby Digital too (the settings directly on my TV, not my Tivo).

    I then connected the optical from my Tivo, to the receiver. Thank goodness I got a model with optical out, all of those years ago in 2012.

    I could then hear audio when I went to the digital optical input on my receiver. It would always say Dolby Digital Surround. Not only that, but I could hear the Tivo menu sound affects too!

    So this seems to be a working solution for me.

    Now, what I'm also trying is this: Tivo connected back to receiver for video, but optical input for audio.

    I'm going to see if there's audio loss issues. What I've seen so far is that sometimes there's a 2-3 second delay after pressing a Tivo menu button, from when audio resumes. But that's not as bothersome as audio being lost completely.

    I don't get the Tivo menu sound effects though.

    If I experience audio loss, or the delay gets too annoying, I'll go back to the Tivo being connected to the TV, and then using the receiver only for the optical input.

    I do have to get that optical port # 1 fixed though, it's jammed. When I'm sure I plan to keep this receiver (at around the 30 day mark), then I'll get it fixed.
     
  17. keithg1964

    keithg1964 Ragonk

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    Feb 2, 2006
    Texas
    Have you tried different cables? It should work with HDMI via the receiver. It may be bad receiver.
     
  18. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Dec 28, 2012
    Thanks. I just tried switching both cables (From Tivo to HDMI input on receiver, and out from receive to the TV).

    Same result, audio drop out when frequently using the Tivo remote.
     
  19. mrsean

    mrsean Active Member

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    May 15, 2006
    New Jersey
    This definitely a problem caused by the 2020 Denon receivers no matter how much they want to deny it. I recently replaced my 5-year-old S910W that started failing with an X3700H and I experienced some of the same audio dropout and HDMI handshaking issues that are resolved by either going back to LiveTV on Tivo or power-cycling the receiver. I had none of these problems using the same cables with the S910W so Denon needs to stop playing the blame game and get it's act together.
     
    nuraman00 likes this.
  20. nuraman00

    nuraman00 Member

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    Thanks for sharing. It helps put things into perspective, since you've had a receiver before. This is my first. So if this didn't happen in previous ones, then yeah, it seems like something is off with newer models.

    And going back to Live TV on the Tivo, or turning the receiver on or off, aren't really good solutions either. Too annoying and disruptive.
     
    mrsean likes this.

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