4 Lights Flashing on Bolt

Discussion in 'TiVo Bolt DVR/Streamer' started by JOSHSKORN, May 14, 2016.

  1. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    Are you sending the 4TB that failed in for warranty replacement (or maybe Toshiba does refunds, I forget)

    If your other 4TB fails, you might want to do a dd_rescue copy from one 4TB drive to a warrantied 4TB and see if you can recover (prior to sticking a 500GB drive in the TiVo, which would cause your shows on the 4TB to be unusable)

    I was able to survive a 750GB HD failure and 1TB HD failure on my original S3 OLED by doing this cloning and having dd_rescue substitute zeros for bad sectors it couldn't read. I would have a few shows that wouldn't play back completely, but 99% of my shows were saved.
     
  2. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    I can't speak for every drive and each manufacturer has their own nuances when reporting SMART data, but in my experience, the errors are usually remapped on the fly. Once you start seeing "pending" errors, something has gone wrong and the on-the-fly remapping isn't working or working well anymore, possibly because the space it has reserved for remapping has been exhausted by past error remapping.
     
  3. aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    My 4TB drives were pulled out of enclosures. So there is no warranty on them. The one I had an issue with doesn't work now anyway. It spins up for a few seconds then spins down. I don't know if it became that way in the TiVo or afterwards. Since when I was carrying it over to my PC to test it, I dropped it and it hit the metal support of some shelving. I see no physical damage, but I have no idea if I caused the spin up issue or it was already there.

    I tried the Toshiba 1TB drive that came with my PS4 PRo. And it worked fine in the Bolt, but it would make a sound every few seconds that was annoying to me. A sound that the 4TB drives and 500GB A/V drives didn't make in the Bolts. So I just put back in one of the four 500 GB A/V drives I had lying around from other Bolts. I only use this Bolt for news and sports so 500 GB seems to work. But if My other 4TB drive dies, I will need to purchase a 2TB drive from somewhere.
     
  4. CoxInPHX

    CoxInPHX COX Communications

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    Is the Toshiba - 3.0TB MQ03ABB300 HDD having problems also?

    Has anyone upgraded to this drive since 20.7.2
     
  5. genebopp

    genebopp Member

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    I put a Toshiba 3.0TB MQ03ABB300 in a bolt in on May 30. It is currently running perfectly. So it started with something less than 20.7.2 but did upgrade without me noticing at all. I hope that helps.
     
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  6. Barrister

    Barrister Barrister

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    I am a new owner of a 500GB Bolt through the premier upgrade program allowing transfer of my lifetime service and have not yet opened the unit to put it in service. I bought it fully intending to upgrade it to the Toshiba 3.0TB MQ03ABB300 right away. However, now it appears that the Toshibas are failing also. I will say that I have read all 15 pages of this thread on the same day, and the most common denominator has been flashing lights after a Tivo system update. At this point I am going to take a wait and see. Two questions I have are: 1) is the WD drive in the 3TB Bolt available online separately, or manufactured specifically for TiVo, being available only to TiVo and 2) does anyone know the exact HDDs used in the Weaknees upgrade kits and whether they are failing, because they should be subject to the same problems.
     
  7. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    Not sure which specific posts you are reading, but many of the "flashing lights right after update" posts were regarding a special non-standard config where people ran a sata cable from the motherboard to an esata enclosure. Once they eliminated the esata portion by using a long sata cable direct to drive, things worked again. Also many people using that config were doing so to run 3.5" drives. If you are talking about just 4 flashing lights, with no update involved, usually those were with seagate drives with SMR technology.

    The drive they use in the Bolt+ is WD30NPRZ which is hard to locate and relatively expensive, but weaknees does carry.

    WD30NPRZ 3TB 2.5" Western Digital Laptop Hard Drive - TiVo Part - WeaKnees - the DVR Superstore
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2017
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  8. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    I tabulated the reported failures on this thread back to around page 12 (May)

    4 esata -> sata recovered

    4 Toshiba 2.5" fail

    9 Seagate 2.5" fail

    Given the Toshiba has been the most recommended drive (meaning the number of installs is probably much higher) 4 fails is not that high. There were 9 Seagate fails with probably much fewer installs (because everyone got concerned with SMR drives)

    As I posted in a different thread, industry average failure rates for 24/7 usage are likely in the 1-5% range. If you have 3% failure and 1000 units, that is 30 failures. If you have 100 units and 5 failures, that is 5% failures. If you just look at the raw 30 reports without knowing how many units, it may look like the 1000 unit brand is failing more often, but in reality the 5 failures represent a higher percentage.

    The reality is you are going to see noticeable # of drive failures in 24/7 usage situations for any drive if you have enough units. Industry average is probably around 1-5%. You can guesstimate the # of installs and see if you feel the reported failures is extraordinary, or just ordinary.

    IMO given the Toshibas have been the recommended drive for a while, with the Seagate drives being out of favor due to SMR concerns, the Seagate SMR failures are extra-ordinary given the number of units installed is probably significantly less than the Toshiba.

    guykuo - esata -> sata = recovered
    tivobw - esata -> sata = recovered
    bilj65 - esata -> sata = recovered
    Jimbo687 - esata -> sata = recovered

    slicer - Toshiba 2.5" = fail
    TydalForce - Toshiba 2.5" = fail, Western Digital 2.5" = failing
    sastexan - Toshiba 2.5" = fail
    fis - Toshiba 2.5" = fail

    ClaytonK - Seagate 2.5" = fail
    aaronwt - Seagate 2.5" = fail
    FreydNot - Seagate 2.5 = fail
    Lenarro - Seagate 2.5" = fail
    tivobw #2 - Seagate 2.5" = fail
    tivoboy - Seagate 2.5" = fail
    krazyboy13 - Seagate 2.5" = fail
    mb117 - Seagate 2.5" = fail
    rburriel - Seagate 2.5" = fail
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2017
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  9. tivobw

    tivobw Member

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    You can add me to the list of folks with a failed Seagate 2.5". Mine failed in September of 2016. Thread - 4TB 2.5" drive for Bolt
     
  10. sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    Done. I left the esata -> sata entry there because I think you have one using a Rosewill enclosure also. If not, let me know and I'll update.

    4 Lights Flashing on Bolt
     
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  11. Oct 1, 2017 #291 of 598
    husky55

    husky55 Member

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    TydalForce - Toshiba 2.5" = fail, Western Digital 2.5" = failing. The failing WD 20NPVZ which is as close to the 3 TB Tivo OEM as possible, is a shocker!!!!
     
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  12. Oct 2, 2017 #292 of 598
    tivobw

    tivobw Member

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    That's right! I moved to the external Rosewill enclosure after the Seagate died.
     
  13. Oct 6, 2017 #293 of 598
    tivoboy

    tivoboy Member

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    Well, woke up this am to have the dreaded four flashing lights horsemen of the apocalypse. This was a 3TB Seagate (upgraded at birth) bolt that has been running fine about 1 year. Nothing really seemed to be wrong going into this event. Drive was about 25% full. Didn't have any stutters.

    I've tried unplugging it, taking out the cable card, disco coax and networking. Let it sit. Tried plugging it in again, still four flashing lights. It start with TIVO and never gets farther than that.

    Is there a list of things to try? If this is a drive failure, it would be the first in nearly 17 years. (well, there WAS A beta H10-250 that failed, but that was a bit to be expected in that history) ;-)

    update: Is there some sort of kickstart that one can employ? Also, for people who have had the issue and somehow resolved it, did you leave the unit plugged in or unplugged? Any reason NOT to leave it plugged in? I had it unplugged about 2 hours, disco'd everything and have tried plugging it back in with just power but we've got just the four blinking lights seem more like drive activity lights than anything else
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2017
  14. Oct 6, 2017 #294 of 598
    sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    BTW which drive brand/model did you install in your TiVo?

    IMO 4 flashing lights is most likely drive failure (at least from TiVo's standpoint, not necessarily from a PCs standpoint). The only time people have recovered is those who did an external sata->esata custom config. There was a software upgrade that broke that but they were able to recover using a longer direct SATA cable.

    I wouldn't really run any of the kickstarts. I would take out the drive and run diagnostics from a PC.
     
  15. Oct 6, 2017 #295 of 598
    tivoboy

    tivoboy Member

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    any suggestions from the forum about best way to test the drive with a mac? Hate the reboot and setup the PC just for this. ;-(
     
  16. Oct 6, 2017 #296 of 598
    sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    You didn't post what drive brand you have. Western Digital has there DLG for Mac available.

    Software and Firmware Downloads | WD Support
     
  17. Oct 6, 2017 #297 of 598
    tivoboy

    tivoboy Member

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  18. Oct 6, 2017 #298 of 598
    sfhub

    sfhub Well-Known Member

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    Look on seagates site for seatools or equivalent for mac. I don't remember what they call it now.
     
  19. Oct 6, 2017 #299 of 598
    atmuscarella

    atmuscarella Well-Known Member

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    I think we have determined that pretty much all the larger Seagate drives use SMR tech. Even if they replace it under warranty I am not sure I would use the replacement drive in your TiVo.
     
  20. Oct 6, 2017 #300 of 598
    aaronwt

    aaronwt UHD Addict

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    Even the smaller Seagate drives use SMR now.
     

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