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Old 07-03-2014, 11:30 PM   #1
Darichard
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Done with TiVo

Preface: I've had a TiVos since 2001. I had a couple of original TiVo. I had two or three DirecTiVos. I had a TiVo HD. And perhaps another couple in there over the years. The point is, I'm a long time and loyal TiVo customer.

The other day my HD locked at the startup screen. Almost certainly a bad hard drive, or perhaps a bad power supply. I considered fixing it, then considered my time constraints, and decided to buy a Roamio. I figured I get the latest version and can fix my HD when I have more time.

The Roamio got here with no issue. I was first a little surprised when I went to activate it and I had a wait a few hours. I thought previous TiVo activations were immediate. But perhaps not. I wasn't in a hurry to watch TV, I just prefer to have things done. No worries.

A few hours later the TiVo was working just fine. I checked online and it said I activation was still pending. Again, no worries. I went to de-activate my old TiVO. I could not find a way to do so. I check the online help, which explains very clearly how to do so. But no, I could find it. Hmmmm....

The next day I started an online chat with TiVo. (Note that the chat instructions clearly state that you can't cancel your account via chat.) The nice person on chat would not help me. When I asked why, he told me that he can't de-activate via chat. He then told me is states this clearly. I told him it does not, and that de-activation is not the same as cancelling. He politely told me he could not help me and that I needed to call.

Now I'm annoyed. Don't tell me the chat instructions say what they don't say. I'm neither blind nor hard of reading. So I call and get a very nice woman to help me. She starting to go down her "Oh no... I'm sorry to hear you're de-activating" speech when I cut her off and told her my HD was dead.

She said "ok" and proceeded to help me. She informed me that I would be billed for the HD through the end of the month. I was calling on the 2nd of the month. She told me that's their policy. Hmmmm...

So I explained to her that I've had TiVos for 13 years. I explained that as soon as I noticed my HD was dead I immediately bought and activated a new TiVo. I explained that I had no idea when my HD died, as I haven't used it in about 2 months. It could have been dead for most of this time. No matter - I'm not asking for anything back. The unit is dead. I have a new one that's already activated.

She was completely unemphatic. She was polite, but really didn't care. When I told her this was likely going to result in me returning my Roamio, she seemed equally unconcerned.

What the heck is going in with TiVO. It's not the money that's the issue for me. It could be $2 or it could be $50. What kind of idiotic company thinks it's reasonable to charge a customer for service they can't possibly use? If I hadn't activated a new TiVo I could almost, maybe, kinda see their point. And I told her this.

The Roamio looks like a very nice device. I've enjoyed every TiVo I've ever had. I just don't think this is a company I want to do business with. I'll be exercising my 30-day return policy on the service and will return my device.

MythTV or Windows Media Center won't be a TiVO, but it'll be good enough.
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:05 AM   #2
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I admit, my sympathy is entirely with the TiVo reps here, even just hearing one side of the story. You clearly want TiVo not to follow their policies, which are publicly stated in their user agreement with you - you must call to cancel (you deactivate hardware, you cancel service), you pay for the upcoming month, and you get no refunds (except for the initial 30 day period).

Or do you feel that you don't have to obey the agreement - it's only TiVo that must obey?
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:11 AM   #3
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I admit, my sympathy is entirely with the TiVo reps here, even just hearing one side of the story. You clearly want TiVo not to follow their policies, which are publicly stated in their user agreement with you - you must call to cancel (you deactivate hardware, you cancel service), you pay for the upcoming month, and you get no refunds (except for the initial 30 day period).

Or do you feel that you don't have to obey the agreement - it's only TiVo that must obey?
Obey? Really? I made no agreement with TiVo that I would call them to cancel. And I did not cancel. I deactivated a dead device.

My issue has nothing to do with TiVos policy. My issue has everything to do with their business model. I'm sure many, like you, are fine with it. I'm voting with my wallet.
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:16 AM   #4
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Really? It's in the user agreement that you agreed to when you run guided setup. You do admit that you agreed to the policy, don't you?

Quote:
Term and Termination

This agreement applies from the date when you accept it and continues until terminated by either of us. We may immediately suspend your account and/or terminate this agreement for your breach of this agreement. All sections of this agreement that by their nature should continue (such as the “Dispute Resolution” section) will survive termination.

You may cancel your account or a subscription to the TiVo service by calling customer service at 1-877-367-8486. Cancellation will not entitle you to any refund (including of any subscription fees), and may be subject to an early termination fee in some cases (see the “Early Termination Fee” section for more details).

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Old 07-04-2014, 12:36 AM   #5
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So long and thanks for all the fish...

Yet another "loyal customer" that only embraces the stereotype that comes with people who call themselves "loyal customers".

Unless there are some other major mitigating factors involved here, that were not shared, I say I'm unsympathetic. I don't see any loyalty, just a sense of entitlement.

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Old 07-04-2014, 12:42 AM   #6
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Is this a joke or is the OP just trolling?
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Old 07-04-2014, 02:08 AM   #7
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Is this a joke or is the OP just trolling?
I am not trying to make fun of your post, but what makes a post called just trolling.

I do agree the OP is way off base or left out something important, just saying he will go to WMC is the joke.
This is another case of monthly customers not paying attention to what their paying for, that's why Lifetime Service is so great, you never get charged for something your not using anymore, and don't have pay attention to any TiVo charges as there will be non for service. Done with the TiVo, sell it on E-Bay and get back some or all or your original Lifetime payment.
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Old 07-04-2014, 02:36 AM   #8
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I am not trying to make fun of your post, but what makes a post called just trolling.

I do agree the OP is way off base or left out something important, just saying he will go to WMC is the joke.
This is another case of monthly customers not paying attention to what their paying for, that's why Lifetime Service is so great, you never get charged for something your not using anymore, and don't have pay attention to any TiVo charges as there will be non for service. Done with the TiVo, sell it on E-Bay and get back some or all or your original Lifetime payment.
By trolling, I mean his entire story sounds unbelievable and therefore likely never happened. A 13-year TiVo customer who has had multiple TiVos over the years and has apparently been happy with them. He recently bought a brand new Roamio and also is happy with it, but he is going to send it back and give up on TiVo forever all because TiVo is following the terms of service he agreed to and won't prorate his cancelled monthly service fee of what, $10? The story makes no rational sense and hence it just feels fabricated to me.

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Old 07-04-2014, 09:34 AM   #9
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Yet another "loyal customer" that only embraces the stereotype that comes with people who call themselves "loyal customers".

Unless there are some other major mitigating factors involved here, that were not shared, I say I'm unsympathetic. I don't see any loyalty, just a sense of entitlement.

Don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya.
Please tell me where I demonstrate a sense of entitlement? I never said I was entitled to anything. I said I dislike the business model.
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Old 07-04-2014, 09:39 AM   #10
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By trolling, I mean his entire story sounds unbelievable and therefore likely never happened. A 13-year TiVo customer who has had multiple TiVos over the years and has apparently been happy with them. He recently bought a brand new Roamio and also is happy with it, but he is going to send it back and give up on TiVo forever all because TiVo is following the terms of service he agreed to and won't prorate his cancelled monthly service fee of what, $10? The story makes no rational sense and hence it just feels fabricated to me.
Ok. You can choose to not believe my story. The TiVo web site clearly states that I can de-activate online. There's nothing that says you can't de-activate via a chat. Based on the reaction from all of you I'm sure it does state in the terms of service that I'd be paying for partial months of use. The terms of service for my Roamio are irrelevant. I have no idea what the terms of service are for my HD since I signed up in 2008 (approx).

I have not said that TiVo violated any policy. I'm saying I don't want to do business with a company that operates this way.
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Old 07-04-2014, 09:41 AM   #11
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Really? It's in the user agreement that you agreed to when you run guided setup. You do admit that you agreed to the policy, don't you?
Is that the agreement I got in 2008 when I activated my HD?
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Old 07-04-2014, 09:41 AM   #12
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Here's what I take from the OP's story. That Tivo's customer service today is far different from what it's been over the years, and not in a good way. That more recently, Tivo's reps tend to be robotic in their answers or ability to in any way deviate from whatever rules are involved even in circumstances where it would make sense to do such both from the customer's viewpoint and Tivo's.
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Old 07-04-2014, 10:26 AM   #13
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Is that the agreement I got in 2008 when I activated my HD?
Yes.
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Old 07-04-2014, 10:34 AM   #14
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I can understand both sides of the story. But I wouldn't be sending the TiVo back in the case stated. I love TiVo too much to punish myself because I didn't agree on some minor policies. ( they are minor to me anyway. ) But I understand the poster deciding to send the TiVo back, I just think that they will be sorry that they didn't ignore the TiVo business model and continue to enjoy their TiVo instead.

I have done things in the past because I felt that I shouldn't encourage a certain behavior in a company, but was sorry later that I let my emotion deny me the use of their product.
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Old 07-04-2014, 10:40 AM   #15
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Here's what I take from the OP's story. That Tivo's customer service today is far different from what it's been over the years, and not in a good way. That more recently, Tivo's reps tend to be robotic in their answers or ability to in any way deviate from whatever rules are involved even in circumstances where it would make sense to do such both from the customer's viewpoint and Tivo's.
Agreed, and thanks. The Roamio appears to be a great product. I just don't want to support a company that does business this way.
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Old 07-04-2014, 10:44 AM   #16
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I have done things in the past because I felt that I shouldn't encourage a certain behavior in a company, but was sorry later that I let my emotion deny me the use of their product.
Completely agree. There's no question that WMC or MythTV (or whatever I use) won't be nearly as nice as the TiVo. So no question I'm losing something as well.

I won't shop at Wal-mart under any circumstances, for any product, at any price. I'm sure I spend more money by shopping elsewhere. There are several other companies with whom I refuse to do business. As I said above, I'm voting with my wallet.
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Old 07-04-2014, 10:45 AM   #17
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Here's what I take from the OP's story. That Tivo's customer service today is far different from what it's been over the years, and not in a good way. That more recently, Tivo's reps tend to be robotic in their answers or ability to in any way deviate from whatever rules are involved even in circumstances where it would make sense to do such both from the customer's viewpoint and Tivo's.
Yeah, that's my takeaway as well. When I fried a Series 1 or 2 years ago trying to upgrade it, I came clean on the phone with them and asked if there was anything they could do it help and they said no prob despite voiding the official warranty and sent me a replacement. That pretty much sealed the deal on several years of allegiance and I tried to return the favor when Crutchfield accidentally sent me two units and I sent one back. But, across the board, regardless of company, good support is hard to find these days.
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Old 07-04-2014, 11:04 AM   #18
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Completely agree. There's no question that WMC or MythTV (or whatever I use) won't be nearly as nice as the TiVo. So no question I'm losing something as well.

I won't shop at Wal-mart under any circumstances, for any product, at any price. I'm sure I spend more money by shopping elsewhere. There are several other companies with whom I refuse to do business. As I said above, I'm voting with my wallet.
There is nothing you can purchase at Wal-Mart you can't get somewhere else with the same or better quality (and maybe a higher price), but that augment does not work well for TiVo, as there is no comparable product, the best DVR, next to TiVo, would be the MSOs' own DVR, at least you never have to be concerned about service on that DVR.
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Old 07-04-2014, 11:12 AM   #19
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The OP reminds me of this guy:

http://www.businessinsider.com/chine...-wrench-2014-6
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Old 07-04-2014, 11:23 AM   #20
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Done with Tivo
Good bye and good luck, you'll need it.
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Old 07-04-2014, 11:31 AM   #21
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OP - there is life after Tivo. I was a huge fan for years until I cut the cord 3 years ago.
For me anyway MythTV has been more than up to the task. I still like to hang out at TC though :-)
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Old 07-04-2014, 11:40 AM   #22
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You know it's going to be a "fun" thread when the OP includes "loyal customer for X years" in a long rant.

Mediocre (at best) customer service for technically complex devices such as TiVo's is par for the course. I didn't start with TiVo until 2006 with a S2DT model. If there were "good old days" when their CSR's were above average, I missed them -- and customers who got that benefit should just count themselves as lucky.

Good CSR's are like good teachers -- there are only so many of them in the world, no matter what you're willing to invest in pay and training. And for a cost-sensitive product like TiVo's they can't afford to make that investment, even if the right people were available in the labor pool (because they would have to increase the product price too much).
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Old 07-04-2014, 11:40 AM   #23
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Wow that is funny, it is considered a protest in China to smash your own property? Even if that is somehow effective, I am going to choose something else.
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:08 PM   #24
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The TiVo web site clearly states that I can de-activate online.
link?
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:21 PM   #25
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She said "ok" and proceeded to help me. She informed me that I would be billed for the HD through the end of the month. I was calling on the 2nd of the month. She told me that's their policy. Hmmmm...
Saying you called on the 2nd of the month is absolutely meaningless.
Tivo billing is according to activation date, what ever day of the month that is. It is not from the 1st to 30th/31st of each month.
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Old 07-04-2014, 12:54 PM   #26
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I am a 14 year TiVo user and have no complaints about TiVo customer service, never have. In the last few years I have called three times when I purchased used unsubscribed TiVos hoping to get the $99 lifetime deals I see discussed here. Each time I got a very polite CSR and was informed the box didn't qualify. I gave up and purchased used TiVos with lifetime and called again, got very polite CSRs each time and service was quickly in my name and I was off the phone pronto, just the way I like it.

Now I have unsubscribed back ups for parts and shouldn't have to call again for years, if ever. I can't recall a bad experience with TiVo customer service but I understood the terms of the agreements when I signed up. I even got to benefit from the single lifetime service transfer grandfathered in because some people somehow thought a single $200 lifetime purchase would apply to all TiVos for that person's lifetime. I knew better than that but I was happy to get the freebie because others somehow didn't know that was absurd and complained non-stop about it.
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Old 07-04-2014, 04:53 PM   #27
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But, across the board, regardless of company, good support is hard to find these days.
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I knew better than that but I was happy to get the freebie because others somehow didn't know that was absurd and complained non-stop about it.
Been thinking more about this today... perhaps good customers are as rare as good support.
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Old 07-04-2014, 05:24 PM   #28
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I am a 14 year TiVo user and have no complaints about TiVo customer service, never have. In the last few years I have called three times when I purchased used unsubscribed TiVos hoping to get the $99 lifetime deals I see discussed here. Each time I got a very polite CSR and was informed the box didn't qualify. I gave up and purchased used TiVos with lifetime and called again, got very polite CSRs each time and service was quickly in my name and I was off the phone pronto, just the way I like it.

Now I have unsubscribed back ups for parts and shouldn't have to call again for years, if ever. I can't recall a bad experience with TiVo customer service but I understood the terms of the agreements when I signed up. I even got to benefit from the single lifetime service transfer grandfathered in because some people somehow thought a single $200 lifetime purchase would apply to all TiVos for that person's lifetime. I knew better than that but I was happy to get the freebie because others somehow didn't know that was absurd and complained non-stop about it.

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Old 07-04-2014, 11:44 PM   #29
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Been thinking more about this today... perhaps good customers are as rare as good support.
I'd say good customers are even more rare.
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Old 07-05-2014, 02:03 AM   #30
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Preface: I've had a TiVos since 2001. I had a couple of original TiVo. I had two or three DirecTiVos. I had a TiVo HD. And perhaps another couple in there over the years. The point is, I'm a long time and loyal TiVo customer.

The other day my HD locked at the startup screen. Almost certainly a bad hard drive, or perhaps a bad power supply. I considered fixing it, then considered my time constraints, and decided to buy a Roamio. I figured I get the latest version and can fix my HD when I have more time.

The Roamio got here with no issue. I was first a little surprised when I went to activate it and I had a wait a few hours. I thought previous TiVo activations were immediate. But perhaps not. I wasn't in a hurry to watch TV, I just prefer to have things done. No worries.

A few hours later the TiVo was working just fine. I checked online and it said I activation was still pending. Again, no worries. I went to de-activate my old TiVO. I could not find a way to do so. I check the online help, which explains very clearly how to do so. But no, I could find it. Hmmmm....

The next day I started an online chat with TiVo. (Note that the chat instructions clearly state that you can't cancel your account via chat.) The nice person on chat would not help me. When I asked why, he told me that he can't de-activate via chat. He then told me is states this clearly. I told him it does not,
and that de-activation is not the same as cancelling. He politely told me he could not help me and that I needed to call.

Now I'm annoyed. Don't tell me the chat instructions say what they don't say. I'm neither blind nor hard of reading. So I call and get a very nice woman to help me. She starting to go down her "Oh no... I'm sorry to hear you're de-activating" speech when I cut her off and told her my HD was dead.

She said "ok" and proceeded to help me. She informed me that I would be billed for the HD through the end of the month. I was calling on the 2nd of the month. She told me that's their policy. Hmmmm...

So I explained to her that I've had TiVos for 13 years. I explained that as soon as I noticed my HD was dead I immediately bought and activated a new TiVo. I explained that I had no idea when my HD died, as I haven't used it in about 2 months. It could have been dead for most of this time. No matter - I'm not asking for anything back. The unit is dead. I have a new one that's already activated.

She was completely unemphatic. She was polite, but really didn't care. When I told her this was likely going to result in me returning my Roamio, she seemed equally unconcerned.

What the heck is going in with TiVO. It's not the money that's the issue for me. It could be $2 or it could be $50. What kind of idiotic company thinks it's reasonable to charge a customer for service they can't possibly use? If I hadn't activated a new TiVo I could almost, maybe, kinda see their point. And I told her this.

The Roamio looks like a very nice device. I've enjoyed every TiVo I've ever had. I just don't think this is a company I want to do business with. I'll be exercising my 30-day return policy on the service and will return my device.

MythTV or Windows Media Center won't be a TiVO, but it'll be good enough.
Please enlighten me as to the difference.
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