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Old 10-01-2015, 09:19 AM   #1
kbmb
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Odd Audio Dropouts

I cannot explain or figure out what is happening.....here's my setup:

Comcast Cable
Roamio Plus HDMI into Yamaha Receiver HDMI into Samsung TV
Roamio Basic HDMI into Samsung TV

Recorded MARVEL the other night on the Plus. During the show, there were times where the audio would cut out and back in. Note, I've seen this before mainly on ABC shows in the past. It's real easy to see/hear the cutout because it's going through the receiver. Definite audio drop and the lights go out on the receiver.

There was a specific 20 second block of the show where there were multiple dropouts. Here's where it gets weird.....I can, not every time, but I can back 8 and get either the dropouts to not re-appear, or be more/less during the same time. So during a 5 second block.....I might hear 2 quick dropouts.....back 8 and next time I might hear 3, or none.

Here's what I did to test things and why I'm baffled:

- swapped with a new HDMI cable between the Tivo and Receiver (still dropouts)
- swapped with a new HDMI cable between Receiver and TV (still dropouts)
- bypassed the receiver and used new HDMI from Tivo to TV (still dropouts although they are harder to hear)
- played the show on the Basic over the network (ethernet) (still dropouts)
- transferred the show to PC and used DSD to make it an MPG (can't hear any dropouts on the PC)

The things that are puzzling are

- if the dropouts where recorded, then they should occur every time played in the same spot no?
- since they don't occur exactly the same each time, I thought it was equipment related
- but if it's equipment, why would I still hear them on the Basic playing over the network

Any help or ideas would be greatly appreciated.

-Kevin

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Old 10-03-2015, 05:58 AM   #2
kbmb
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Just an update, saw the dropouts on a recording of the Tonight Show, so it's not just ABC. Again, I was able to rewind and have the dropout not happen.

-Kevin

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Old 10-03-2015, 06:31 AM   #3
JARON46
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I have had the same issue with my Roamio Plus the sound gets warbled and I can back it up a few seconds and the sound clears up.

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Old 10-03-2015, 08:06 AM   #4
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Just an update, saw the dropouts on a recording of the Tonight Show, so it's not just ABC. Again, I was able to rewind and have the dropout not happen.

-Kevin
I get one every few hours. I blame it on a crappy DD 5.1 hardware/software. They never happen when viewing DD 2.0 or DD EX or when watching a streaming movie on Amazon (which is DD+ 5.1). Just as an experiment, drop to PCM for a day to see if they disappear.

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Old 10-03-2015, 09:24 AM   #5
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I get one every few hours. I blame it on a crappy DD 5.1 hardware/software. They never happen when viewing DD 2.0 or DD EX or when watching a streaming movie on Amazon (which is DD+ 5.1). Just as an experiment, drop to PCM for a day to see if they disappear.
So would it be hardware even when in home streaming to my other Tivo? Which hardware at that point....the Plus (where it's coming from) or the Basic where it's playing?

My Dad mentioned he's been seeing more and more with his Basic.

-Kevin

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Old 10-03-2015, 09:44 AM   #6
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I thought the problem was coming from the originator (either Charter, or the station) since it doesn't happen every day, and there are long periods between the times it happens. My AVR is a Denon.

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Old 10-03-2015, 09:50 AM   #7
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I thought the problem was coming from the originator (either Charter, or the station) since it doesn't happen every day, and there are long periods between the times it happens. My AVR is a Denon.
I thought so too, until I rewound and saw that it changes on playback.

-Kevin

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Old 10-03-2015, 09:59 AM   #8
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I thought so too, until I rewound and saw that it changes on playback.

-Kevin
I agree. Sometime is so quick that the LEDs on my AVR don't even blink. Sometimes it's just long enough to make them blink. I watched a lot of older shows on the CW for a while that were DD 2.0 and never had a dropout. While it's possible this is a rare item, this is not the first time it has been a topic either.

This summer I spent many hours listening to playback on headphones, which are PCM, and never heard a dropout.

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Old 10-03-2015, 10:01 AM   #9
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I agree. Sometime is so quick that the LEDs on my AVR don't even blink. Sometimes it's just long enough to make them blink. I watched a lot of older shows on the CW for a while that were DD 2.0 and never had a dropout. While it's possible this is a rare item, this is not the first time it has been a topic either.
That's where I notice it most.....being hooked up through a receiver, it usually makes the cutout more noticeable. When I bypassed the receiver, I had to really pay attention to notice it in most cases.

-Kevin

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Old 10-04-2015, 02:05 PM   #10
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Audio dropouts here with stock roamio plus

I recently started having audio dropouts too. My AVR shows the DD stream disappearing briefly. I'm guessing there is a problem with recent software update. I hope Tivo will fix it soon as it is really annoying.

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Old 10-04-2015, 02:18 PM   #11
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I recently started having audio dropouts too. My AVR shows the DD stream disappearing briefly. I'm guessing there is a problem with recent software update. I hope Tivo will fix it soon as it is really annoying.
First, you should switch to PCM for a day to eliminate hardware. Second, it may be worse starting with 20.5.2, but I've seen it for a year or more. I started seeing it on my Mini with 20.5.2, but I'm not sure why. If you have a drop, then rewind, and replay doesn't have it, it's not from your content feed, it's from the TiVo output. Or so I would speculate.

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Old 10-04-2015, 02:29 PM   #12
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Maybe it's the same audio issue as this: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...ighlight=audio

I have the problem now and again from just hitting PAUSE, and then after resuming it has no audio for a short period of time.

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Old 10-07-2015, 09:12 PM   #13
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First, you should switch to PCM for a day to eliminate hardware. Second, it may be worse starting with 20.5.2, but I've seen it for a year or more. I started seeing it on my Mini with 20.5.2, but I'm not sure why. If you have a drop, then rewind, and replay doesn't have it, it's not from your content feed, it's from the TiVo output. Or so I would speculate.
So last night's Fresh off the Boat had a ton of audio glitches early on. Rewinding didn't change anything this time and when I switch to PCM.....it actually got worse. Guessing this was the feed or signal this time.

-Kevin

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Old 10-08-2015, 11:39 AM   #14
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So last night's Fresh off the Boat had a ton of audio glitches early on. Rewinding didn't change anything this time and when I switch to PCM.....it actually got worse. Guessing this was the feed or signal this time.

-Kevin
TIVO is aware of the issue and are working on a resolve.

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Old 10-08-2015, 12:12 PM   #15
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TIVO is aware of the issue and are working on a resolve.
Interesting. Is this from a tech support ticket you have open?

-Kevin

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Old 10-08-2015, 12:56 PM   #16
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Interesting. Is this from a tech support ticket you have open?

-Kevin
Spoke to csr today and was told this is a problem with signal from OTA being to low TIVO tuners should be in the 80 plus signal strength was told to try getting amp to see if fixes issue. They also said it could be hdmi cables.


Last edited by mickinct; 10-08-2015 at 01:26 PM.
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Old 10-08-2015, 12:57 PM   #17
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Spoke to csr today and was told this is a problem with signal from OTA being to low TIVO tuners should be in the 80 plus signal strength was told to try getting amp to see if fixes issue.
So that wouldn't be my issue since I'm cable and the signal is 98-100%.

-Kevin

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Old 10-08-2015, 01:45 PM   #18
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It's IMPOSSIBLE for a Roamio doing OTA (antenna) to get a signal level higher than 72 on any channel! At least so far, not sure if a newer firmware will ever fix this.

That's been hashed out in another thread, and absolutely proven. If the Tivo CSR told you you have to get over 80 on an antenna signal, he's full of *****. He's quoting cable signal levels, NOT OTA.

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Old 10-08-2015, 01:52 PM   #19
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It's IMPOSSIBLE for a Roamio doing OTA (antenna) to get a signal level higher than 72 on any channel! At least so far, not sure if a newer firmware will ever fix this.

That's been hashed out in another thread, and absolutely proven. If the Tivo CSR told you you have to get over 80 on an antenna signal, he's full of *****. He's quoting cable signal levels, NOT OTA.
That is what I told him, and when you check the signal on the channel to see the strength it is higher. Sometimes I get a 80 plus but in a different screen it shows max 72, confusing, if you do a channel scan I see higher numbers.

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Old 10-08-2015, 03:11 PM   #20
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That is what I told him, and when you check the signal on the channel to see the strength it is higher. Sometimes I get a 80 plus but in a different screen it shows max 72, confusing, if you do a channel scan I see higher numbers.
When viewing the signal with Settings, Account & System Info, TiVo box Diagnostics you see it after the AGC circuit has settled down the signal. Use the Settings, Channels, Signal Strength test and you will see a peak then it settles on 72.

The diags are broken or at least not to be trusted.

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Old 10-08-2015, 03:23 PM   #21
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When viewing the signal with Settings, Account & System Info, TiVo box Diagnostics you see it after the AGC circuit has settled down the signal. Use the Settings, Channels, Signal Strength test and you will see a peak then it settles on 72.

The diags are broken or at least not to be trusted.
Very odd my 35$ homeworx never had this problem......

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Old 10-08-2015, 03:29 PM   #22
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Based on what I saw last night, I'm thinking it was the broadcast since I couldn't get it to go away when I rewound.

Marvel which came on after was fine.

I seem to have the most issues with ABC programs. I'm going to keep trying the rewind or rewind and switch to PCM.

@JoeKustra - if I do encounter this again.....and I'm able to rewind and get it to go away....that means it wasn't the broadcast. So then if I can switch to PCM and rewind and not hear it, you are saying it might be the DD in the TiVo itself?

And RS corrected errors shouldn't cause something like this correct? Only if there are RS UNcorrected? In general my signal levels are 98-100% and a SNR of 38-40dB.

-Kevin

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Old 10-08-2015, 03:52 PM   #23
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Based on what I saw last night, I'm thinking it was the broadcast since I couldn't get it to go away when I rewound.

Marvel which came on after was fine.

I seem to have the most issues with ABC programs. I'm going to keep trying the rewind or rewind and switch to PCM.

@JoeKustra - if I do encounter this again.....and I'm able to rewind and get it to go away....that means it wasn't the broadcast. So then if I can switch to PCM and rewind and not hear it, you are saying it might be the DD in the TiVo itself?

And RS corrected errors shouldn't cause something like this correct? Only if there are RS UNcorrected? In general my signal levels are 98-100% and a SNR of 38-40dB.

-Kevin
HAS anyone reported that the new BOLT has this issue??

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Old 10-08-2015, 04:06 PM   #24
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Based on what I saw last night, I'm thinking it was the broadcast since I couldn't get it to go away when I rewound.

Marvel which came on after was fine.

I seem to have the most issues with ABC programs. I'm going to keep trying the rewind or rewind and switch to PCM.

@JoeKustra - if I do encounter this again.....and I'm able to rewind and get it to go away....that means it wasn't the broadcast. So then if I can switch to PCM and rewind and not hear it, you are saying it might be the DD in the TiVo itself?

And RS corrected errors shouldn't cause something like this correct? Only if there are RS UNcorrected? In general my signal levels are 98-100% and a SNR of 38-40dB.

-Kevin
Two things. If it's not there with a rewind it's not part of the incoming data stream. Therefore it's from the TiVo.

My Roamio does not count RS Corrected. My SNR is 35 or 36 with a signal of 87 or 90 (respectively). All channels. A Premiere next to it has both type of errors and signals from 75 to 95. On my Roamio the OOB SNR is 388 dB. On my Premiere it is 2 dB.

I never use PCM. That's just a guess. I can live with the small dropouts.

How to test error counters: go outside, open the box and disconnect the feed. Reconnect and check the numbers. I have a cable modem. It has errors also, but only on one channel.

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Old 10-08-2015, 04:12 PM   #25
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Two things. If it's not there with a rewind it's not part of the incoming data stream. Therefore it's from the TiVo.

My Roamio does not count RS Corrected. My SNR is 35 or 36 with a signal of 87 or 90 (respectively). All channels. A Premiere next to it has both type of errors and signals from 75 to 95. On my Roamio the OOB SNR is 388 dB. On my Premiere it is 2 dB.

I never use PCM. That's just a guess. I can live with the small dropouts.

How to test error counters: go outside, open the box and disconnect the feed. Reconnect and check the numbers. I have a cable modem. It has errors also, but only on one channel.
Thanks Joe. Any correlation to this seemingly happening more on ABC recordings? The type of broadcast 1080i or 720p? Something the Tivo just doesn't like in the broadcast?

Overall the dropouts have been happening for over a year. It wasn't until a month or so ago that I even tried to rewind and see if it would go away. That's when I saw the MOST of the time it does go away randomly.

I can live with a single dropout or two. But sometimes over the course of a 30 minute show we could get 10+ dropouts.

-Kevin

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Old 10-08-2015, 04:26 PM   #26
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Thanks Joe. Any correlation to this seemingly happening more on ABC recordings? The type of broadcast 1080i or 720p? Something the Tivo just doesn't like in the broadcast?

Overall the dropouts have been happening for over a year. It wasn't until a month or so ago that I even tried to rewind and see if it would go away. That's when I saw the MOST of the time it does go away randomly.

I can live with a single dropout or two. But sometimes over the course of a 30 minute show we could get 10+ dropouts.

-Kevin
I seldom watch ABC but it does have my lowest HD bit rate. I never noticed it when wearing headphones this summer, which comes from the A/V that is always PCM. I very seldom hear it on recordings, if ever. Until 20.5.2 I never had the issue on my Mini. But that's not something I can really test.

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Old 10-08-2015, 08:58 PM   #27
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Watched a couple shows tonight, most fine. Only audio dropout was at the beginning of Modern Family.

So, this was a typical dropout.....I could rewind and sometimes it would go away. Sometimes it wouldn't, or even get worse.

I then switched to PCM from DD. What's interesting is with PCM, instead of full dropouts, it's like most of the dialog around the dropout areas is slightly garbled.....almost like they are talking underwater slightly. With PCM it always happened.

I'm wondering now if what is recorded is what PCM is showing.....the slightly garbled audio.....with DD, as it's reading it sometimes it drops the audio out completely for a second?!? Could the root cause be the actual program?

-Kevin

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Old 10-08-2015, 09:17 PM   #28
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So one thing I'm going to try for next week is to set up the recordings on two different stations at the same time. Being in southern NH we get both the Boston ABC and our local ABC.

I'm going to record on the Boston ABC on the upstairs TiVo and I'm gonna record on both the Boston and local ABCs on the downstairs TiVo to to see if there's any difference.

-Kevin

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Old 10-14-2015, 09:29 PM   #29
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So I recorded Marvel on both ABC stations I have access too. I did notice that the typical Boston recording had an audio glitch that I could again rewind and get it to either go away or reappear.

However, the local NH station did not have the same glitch. It only had one very minor dropout that was always there, even with a rewind.

I'm still baffled. For now I think I'll switch my ABC recordings to the local affiliate and see how it goes. It seems there is something with the Boston feed that has these glitches that sometimes the TiVo can recover, and other times it can't.

-Kevin

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Old 10-15-2015, 06:16 PM   #30
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HAS anyone reported that the new BOLT has this issue??
I have a Bolt an I am experiencing the same problem. I output the tivo to a Yamaha receiver and then a Panasonic Plasma TV. I have tried the same things mentioned in this thread with no change. This is the first Tivo I have had with this type of problem. I skipped over the Roamio series so I cannot speak for these. It is not occurring so much that it takes anything away from watching but as mentioined it is more noticiable because you visually see the receiver display blink. Having read this thread it does seem like abc is the biggest culprit. I hope there is a software fix for this but first Tivo has to admit to a problem.


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