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Old 01-31-2015, 11:43 PM   #1
leo38cheng
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NYC Verizon Fios - Tivo Roamio Plus - Tivo Mini - Asus RT-AC66U router

Noob Here =)

Just got FIOS installed today and was wondering if someone can answer some questions I may have.

I currently have 2 phones lines with FIOS, TV Package and 75/75 Internet Speed. *ONT to Router via CAT5e*

I was given an Actiontec router from Verizon FIOS and 5 STBs.

*Things I do not care losing: *On-Screen Caller ID , VOD, PPV*

*I really need the TV Guide / Program Listing Data/Feature*


I have the following questions:
1. If I buy 1 Tivo Roamio Plus and 4 Tivo Minis , will I be able to cancel the 5 STB from verizon and save money each month. All I have to pay is for 1 Cable card -- is that correct?

2. Is there a way to use my own Asus router -- along with the Tivo Roamio + Minis?

3. If I use my own router -- will I lose some TV features? If so, what will I lose?

4. At 1 Tivo Roamio Plus + 4 Tivo Minis -- how many shows can I record at once?

5. Attached is what I think my final setup should look like. *Can someone advise if it will be possible, and if I am missing anything. Do I need to change anything in the any of the routers to make this work?


THANKS for all your help!!!
-Leo

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Old 01-31-2015, 11:46 PM   #2
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Old 02-01-2015, 12:57 AM   #3
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Roamio Plus/Pro has 6 tuners using only 1 cable card. Mini does not have any tuners. You would only use those features you mentioned, ppv, VOD, on screen CID. Minis connect by ethernet or MoCa (ethernet via coax). Fios supplied router/modem has MoCa capability, otherwise you need a MoCa adapter at the router. Mini and Plus/Pro has built-in MoCa.

Tivo supplies its own guide through Tribune Media not through the cable company.

If you want VOD, PPV, you would need at least a cable box to another TV or input.

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Old 02-01-2015, 01:45 AM   #4
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1. Correct. (plus whatever service you choose for the Roamio -- monthly or lifetime.)

2. Yes, but see below regarding your diagram.

3. Tivo provides their own (generally more accurate) guide data. But you lose VOD and caller ID with Tivo. PPV is still doable but you have to call in to order.

4. Six. The Minis borrow tuners when live TV is being watched on them. But if the tuner is needed for a recording, it'll put a prompt on the Mini and give you the option of cancelling the recording, or let it reclaim the tuner to continue the recording as scheduled.

5. Per your diagram, to my knowledge you can't have both coax and ethernet active at the same time on the ONT unless it happens to be a Motorola 1500G or Alcatel-Lucent 821 ONT. In the case of TV, the coax is always active so in either case it might save you a headache to use the Actiontec (via coax) as the primary router, and put your Asus in bridge/switch/extender/AP/whatever mode (cat5 from Actiontec).

Also, the cat5 between the Plus and 1st floor switch is unnecessary since the Plus (and Minis) will get their network connections over coax (moca) from the actiontec router.


Last edited by BigJimOutlaw; 02-01-2015 at 02:48 AM.
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Old 02-01-2015, 01:58 PM   #5
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Hi,

Thanks for all the response. But I have additional questions:

PPV, VOD, On-screen Caller ID is not important to me. Since TV listings are provided by Tivo - is there any other reason why I need the Actiontec router in my diagram?

Will the entire house system still function without the Actiontec router? I want to be able to use my own router in conjunction with the Tivo Roamio Plus and Tivo Mini(s).

I just checked my ONT system and it does indeed have both COAX and CAT5E installed. The CAT5E is going straight from ONT to Actiontec Router.

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Old 02-01-2015, 02:23 PM   #6
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The actiontec router can create a moca network (networking over coax) that the Roamio and Minis can all take advantage of.

But if the ethernet port is still active on the ONT you can try taking the actiontec out of the picture entirely, if you prefer, and let the Roamio create the moca network. That will require the ethernet connection as you have it in the diagram.


Last edited by BigJimOutlaw; 02-01-2015 at 02:36 PM.
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Old 02-01-2015, 02:30 PM   #7
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In a system with no Verizon video equipment, and Internet supplied via Ethernet, there is no need for the Actiontec router.

The guide contents should be essentially unchanged, BTW -- Verizon switched to using Tribune (TiVo's guide data provider) a while back.

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Old 02-01-2015, 02:48 PM   #8
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*Thanks!

So just want to confirm:

*If there is NO verizon video equipment being used --- there is NO need for Actiontec router BECAUSE the Tivo Roamio Plus can create the MOCA environment?


*Does my diagram work as well if I choose to go that route?

Any IP settings I need to be aware of? *thanks!

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Old 02-01-2015, 02:58 PM   #9
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*Thanks!

So just want to confirm:

*If there is NO verizon video equipment being used --- there is NO need for Actiontec router BECAUSE the Tivo Roamio Plus can create the MOCA environment?


*Does my diagram work as well if I choose to go that route?

Any IP settings I need to be aware of? *thanks!

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Old 02-01-2015, 03:30 PM   #10
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I have fios in Rockland County NY I returned all my fios equipment except for the router. From my ONT I only have coax going to the router. I am using a romeo plus w/4 mini's all connected via moca. Not a problem all works great.

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Old 02-01-2015, 06:55 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leo38cheng View Post
*If there is NO verizon video equipment being used --- there is NO need for Actiontec router BECAUSE the Tivo Roamio Plus can create the MOCA environment?
Correct

Quote:
Originally Posted by leo38cheng View Post
*Does my diagram work as well if I choose to go that route?

Any IP settings I need to be aware of? *thanks!
Should work fine. There were some folks who were having issues using a Roamio through switches, but I think they're an exception to the rule and it should be resolvable if it happens. I'm not particularly knowledgeable about switches.

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Old 02-02-2015, 01:33 PM   #12
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There were problems with TiVo and "green" switches that turn themselves off when a port isn't active. I don't know if that was ever resolved in an update.

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Old 02-28-2015, 11:15 AM   #13
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Hi crew - is there anyway to use verizon fios with tivo roamio and tivo mini WITHOUT using the verizon fios router.

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Old 02-28-2015, 11:17 AM   #14
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Reason I am asking is because i couldnt get my tivo roamio activated until I connect my verizon router into the coax splitter.

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Old 02-28-2015, 11:27 AM   #15
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internet connection?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leo38cheng View Post
Reason I am asking is because i couldnt get my tivo roamio activated until I connect my verizon router into the coax splitter.
It sounds like you needed the MOCA provided by the VZ router so the Roamio had an internet connection via the coax. You can provide connectivity either by ethernet or wifi in place of MOCA but the TiVo does require an internet connection via one of those methods. The mini doesn't support wifi, so you would need either MOCA provided by the VZ router (or a MOCA adapter) or an ethernet connection for that too.

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Old 02-28-2015, 11:38 AM   #16
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It sounds like you needed the MOCA provided by the VZ router so the Roamio had an internet connection via the coax. You can provide connectivity either by ethernet or wifi in place of MOCA but the TiVo does require an internet connection via one of those methods. The mini doesn't support wifi, so you would need either MOCA provided by the VZ router (or a MOCA adapter) or an ethernet connection for that too.

By my understanding was that still tivo roamio plus is moca built in i didnt need the verizon router.


What im basically trying to do is to not use verizon router at all but it seems like there no way around it.

Is that correct?

I was to use my asus as my primary router since i have ethernet coming in from ont.

Thanks

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Old 02-28-2015, 12:27 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leo38cheng View Post
By my understanding was that still tivo roamio plus is moca built in i didnt need the verizon router.


What im basically trying to do is to not use verizon router at all but it seems like there no way around it.

Is that correct?

I was to use my asus as my primary router since i have ethernet coming in from ont.

Thanks
The Plus does have MOCA built in, but it needs a source of internet connectivity. It can get that in one of three ways, ethernet, MOCA or wifi. For the MOCA to work on the Plus, you have to bridge your internet source (the ONT) to MOCA. The VZ routers do that. If you don't use the VZ router, you can use a MOCA adapter to connect your router to the coax, or even use a reconfigured VZ router to do it. There are instructions at DSL Reports, http://www.dslreports.com/faq/16626 , and the other FAQs would be helpful in understanding the issue.

Another alternative is to utilize the Plus' internal ethernet/MOCA bridge. If you connect the Plus via ethernet, it can create the MOCA network needed by the Minis. Unfortnately, it cannot bridge Wifi to MOCA.

In summary, the TiVo needs an internet connection, which you have to provide by ethernet or MOCA. The VZ router performs that task since their STBs also utilize MOCA.

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Old 02-28-2015, 03:12 PM   #18
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So i can connect my tivo roamoi plus vis ethernet and the minis via coax and dont need to use the verizon router?

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Old 02-28-2015, 05:15 PM   #19
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So i can connect my tivo roamoi plus vis ethernet and the minis via coax and dont need to use the verizon router?
Yes, that is correct. As long as the Roamio has internet access (via ethernet) then it can distribute that internet connection to the Mini's via MOCA.

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Old 02-28-2015, 06:24 PM   #20
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I finally am able to use my own router and TiVo seems to be working (So right now I'm not on Verizon's Actiontec router)

BUT I actually want to have the Verizon Actiontec router act as a moca bridge backup. Is that possible?

Basically right now my ont is connected to my asus router and my TiVo is working via coax switch.

What I want to do is connect the Actiontec to my asus via Ethernet and then run a coax from my switch to the Actiontec (moca) -- (please tell me if i'm wrong) but this way the Actiontec can get internet from my asus and give it via coax to the splitters (tivos)

If this works .. can someone tell me exactly how to config my Actiontec router.?

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Old 02-28-2015, 06:45 PM   #21
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There isn't really a "backup" option, in that there can only be 1 moca host.

What you can do is create a double-bridge with the actiontec and your own router, where your router is the primary one but the actiontec serves the moca.

It's a little tricky but to do that you would follow the instructions carefully for Option 5:

http://www.dslreports.com/faq/16077

If you do this, disconnect the Roamio's ethernet connection. It would be a moca client just like the Minis.

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Old 02-28-2015, 07:15 PM   #22
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thanks but option 5 is for coax to ont right?

I have cat5 to ont...

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Old 02-28-2015, 07:24 PM   #23
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Our setup is exactly what the OP is looking for. We have FiOS TV, 75/75 Internet and phone. The Internet comes in on ethernet to a Asus RT-N66U router. The TV comes in on coax and the phone connects to our regular POTS wiring.

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Old 02-28-2015, 07:32 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leo38cheng View Post
I finally am able to use my own router and TiVo seems to be working (So right now I'm not on Verizon's Actiontec router)

BUT I actually want to have the Verizon Actiontec router act as a moca bridge backup. Is that possible?

Basically right now my ont is connected to my asus router and my TiVo is working via coax switch.

What I want to do is connect the Actiontec to my asus via Ethernet and then run a coax from my switch to the Actiontec (moca) -- (please tell me if i'm wrong) but this way the Actiontec can get internet from my asus and give it via coax to the splitters (tivos)

If this works .. can someone tell me exactly how to config my Actiontec router.?
Using an Actiontec router as just a MOCA bridge is possible, but configuration can be tricky. I'd just keep the Actiontec router as a backup. Besides, if the Roamio fails, having MOCA won't be much help since the Roamio has all the tuners.

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Old 02-28-2015, 08:53 PM   #25
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Using an Actiontec router as just a MOCA bridge is possible, but configuration can be tricky. I'd just keep the Actiontec router as a backup. Besides, if the Roamio fails, having MOCA won't be much help since the Roamio has all the tuners.

Hi Diana... Thanks for the response.. May i ask if you're using the verizon router with your tivo boxes and minis?

If you are - how are you configuring your actiontec

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Old 03-01-2015, 12:19 AM   #26
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I think the Verizon FIOS is a combination router and cable modem with Moca. A normal setup would be a cable modem to a separate router.

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Old 03-01-2015, 09:41 AM   #27
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ActionTec as bridge only

I also have the setup you describe and have used it with and without the actiontec router. I have ethernet in from ONT to an Asus router. I then have ethernet to the Roamio Plus. I can then turn on MOCA bridging on the Roamio and the minis work properly. I ended up disabling the MOCA bridging on the Roamio though and added the ActionTec router back into the mix to just be a wifi and MOCA bridge. This is completely unnecessary but I figured having another wifi AP for coverage and taking the bridging load off the Roamio couldn't hurt.

It isn't really very hard to setup the ActionTec to do this function. All you do is plug the ethernet into one of the LAN ports (not the WAN) and connect the coax. Then make sure to DISABLE DHCP on the ActionTec. Then it will just be a dumb bridge. Your ASUS modem will do the real work of giving the devices an IP, do NAT translation and routing the traffic to the internet. I had it setup this way for my Verizon STBs to work before I even had a Roamio/Mini setup.

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Old 03-01-2015, 10:23 AM   #28
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I think the Verizon FIOS [Actiontec] is a combination router and cable modem with Moca.
It's not any kind of cable modem. The Internet side of Fios doesn't use cable TV tech. (The TV side does, however.) The Actiontec is just a router with MoCA. You can just as well hook it to the ONT via Ethernet (if the ONT is set to provide Internet that way), or you can connect any router directly to the ONT via Ethernet.

And no, the ONT doesn't take the place of the cable modem, either. Different tech, different approaches, not directly comparable.

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Old 03-01-2015, 11:27 AM   #29
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I also have the setup you describe and have used it with and without the actiontec router. I have ethernet in from ONT to an Asus router. I then have ethernet to the Roamio Plus. I can then turn on MOCA bridging on the Roamio and the minis work properly. I ended up disabling the MOCA bridging on the Roamio though and added the ActionTec router back into the mix to just be a wifi and MOCA bridge. This is completely unnecessary but I figured having another wifi AP for coverage and taking the bridging load off the Roamio couldn't hurt.

It isn't really very hard to setup the ActionTec to do this function. All you do is plug the ethernet into one of the LAN ports (not the WAN) and connect the coax. Then make sure to DISABLE DHCP on the ActionTec. Then it will just be a dumb bridge. Your ASUS modem will do the real work of giving the devices an IP, do NAT translation and routing the traffic to the internet. I had it setup this way for my Verizon STBs to work before I even had a Roamio/Mini setup.

Can you explain a little more about your setup?

1. So you are saying your Asus router goes straight to ONT and the actiontec connects to your Asus via Ethernet?

2. You actiontech is also connected to your splitters via coax

3. Your roamio is connected via cox or ethernet??

4. Your minis are connect via moca (coax) with the above setup?

*thanks!!!

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Old 03-01-2015, 12:59 PM   #30
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Funny... I have exactly the same equipment. I got FiOS at a time when the S3 didn't get along with it very well at all and MoCA was an issue, so I've never had MoCA in my house, nor have I ever had Verizon's router.

My setup is ethernet from the ONT to the RT-AC66U. From there, 5e runs to the office and entertainment center. For a while, I had baluns on the TiVo and a TV in the kitchen to run an A/V signal to the kitchen but decided to put a Mini in the kitchen instead. So, I removed the baluns on the 5e between the entertainment center and the kitchen. Now, I have the 5e from the router to the entertainment center run into a USB-powered switch. The TiVo plugs into the switch as does the 5e to the kitchen. The switch is powered by one of the TiVo's USB ports.

Works great.

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