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Old 11-25-2013, 01:15 AM   #151
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I thought it was a decent wrap-up of the RJ story.

We all knew it would turn out not to be Bertram, that meant it had to be one of the other "dead" guys. While my money was on Partridge, McAllister fit the role well enough. He had a little bit of a creepy vibe to him. I felt his portrayal at the end was reasonable well acted. I'm satisfied and ready to move on.

As far as not learning how he knew about the list, I don't mind that. The character of Jane didn't need to know, so we don't need to know.

I just hope TygerTyger / The Blake Society is done also. RJ/McAllister said he was the Blake society. Hopefully it dies with him, all the key players are done, and we can move on with new interesting stories. In my gut, I kinda doubt it though.
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:04 AM   #152
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Pretty lame anticlimactic ending to the RJ saga. If indeed it is the end.

I just don't feel that RJ was charismatic enough to have so many followers. And in the end the character was very shallow... they didn't have any sort of back story on him, what made him tick, how he rose to "power." It's like pulling a mask off a superhero (or in this case villain) and he's just a guy.

To be fair, I didn't watch much at all last season, so I might have missed something along those lines.
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Old 11-25-2013, 04:06 AM   #153
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To be fair, I didn't watch much at all last season, so I might have missed something along those lines.
Nope. Just as lame as you said.

I've come to the conclusion that it is nearly impossible to have a TV series with an intricate multi-season story arc that comes to a satisfying conclusion. The only exception I can think of in the past several decades is Babylon 5.

For some reason, TV writers just cannot (or do not?) plan ahead. Maybe they think long-term planning is a waste of time because the networks will probably force changes in any long-term plans (or just cancel the series before it reaches the long-term)?

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Old 11-25-2013, 06:28 AM   #154
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Nearly 5.5 seasons. After more than 5 years of puzzling about Red John, that lame episode is the resolution? No explanation for why so many people adored him? No explanation for how he knew the list of suspects except, "I have real psychic powers"?

What a letdown.
What a letdown indeed.

It's almost as if they were just as tired of it all as we were.
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Old 11-25-2013, 06:55 AM   #155
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My money was on Partridge being RJ.

As for not finding out the why, where, etc behind RJ, in real life we don't always hear what caused these crazed lunatics to do what they do, so I am alright with it not being all wrapped up with a cute little bow.

Jane was carrying that bird around all day. I bet he needs a new jacket! And they patted down Jane for a gun, but didn't notice a live pigeon?

Jane could have at least told Lisbon who RJ was. As far as they know, it was Bertram. Will they figure it out, when someone stumbles upon McAllistar's body, that since they thought he was dead, that he is RJ?

What becomes of the the lady from the chapel that walked away, and of all the other Blake Society people? Will they continue looking out for one another? Do they know that RJ was the head of the Blake Society? Or is the group autonomous enough to keep on functioning without a leader?

I bet the show does not get renewed. They have wrapped up the main story and will now show us the aftermath. I would be happy with it not continuing after this season is over.

Plus (Casting Spoiler):

Spoiler:
Owain Yeoman and Amanda Righetti are leaving the show anyway after this season.

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Old 11-25-2013, 07:02 AM   #156
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Spoiler:
Owain Yeoman and Amanda Righetti are leaving the show anyway after this season.
Not even
Spoiler:
after. They're gone almost now. Apparently, when the show comes back next week after a two-year gap, they've left CBI and started a private detective agency. So they'll be available for guest appearances, but not in the regular cast any more.

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Old 11-25-2013, 08:31 AM   #157
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I wonder if the CBI will be reinstated?
I thought the emptying of the CBI offices was a bit over done.
I could see taking the records etc, but the desks as well?
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Old 11-25-2013, 09:31 AM   #158
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I was holding out for Stiles, who would have been the least ridiculous of the suspects.
Agreed. He was they only one of the final suspects charismatic enough to be Red John. Plus, unlike McAllister, Reed Smith, and Ray Haffner, he'd been in the show all along, instead of a one-shot character before this season. Choosing him or Bertram, or even Brett Patrtidge, would have given the impression that the show has had a goal all along. Instead, they just pulled Red John's identity out of a hat.
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Old 11-25-2013, 10:10 AM   #159
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Choosing him or Bertram, or even Brett Patrtidge, would have given the impression that the show has had a goal all along. Instead, they just pulled Red John's identity out of a hat.
Perhaps the reason I'm satisfied it was McAllister is because I never expected anything other than to pull RJ's identity out of a hat.

After watching the entirety of Lost without learning a thing in the finale, after watching the entirety of Battlestar Galactica ("They have a plan") without them having a plan, ..., my expectations for long-term TV planning are quite low.

I find it telling that so many people would have been satisfied with RJ being Timothy Carter back in the S3 finale, a character we had never met before. Someone whose backstory and motivation we did not know.
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Old 11-25-2013, 10:23 AM   #160
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I find it telling that so many people would have been satisfied with RJ being Timothy Carter back in the S3 finale, a character we had never met before. Someone whose backstory and motivation we did not know.
Back then, though, it hadn't been dragged out and teased for years. I think at that point it would have been appropriate for it to be an ordinary, somewhat nebbishy guy whom nobody had ever noticed before.

And I wouldn't be surprised if they thought he was Red John when they did that episode, and then changed their minds over the break.
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Old 11-25-2013, 10:29 AM   #161
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I wonder if the CBI will be reinstated?
I thought the emptying of the CBI offices was a bit over done.
I could see taking the records etc, but the desks as well?
According to various sources on the Internet:

Spoiler:
CBI is no more. They are done with that set, so they really did tear it down.

The show picks up to years later and shows where everyone ended up.

VanPelt and Rigsby have a PI agency together.

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Old 11-25-2013, 12:16 PM   #162
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The only exception I can think of in the past several decades is Babylon 5.
And that's because that was the only show where the whole five year story was fully mapped out before they even shot a single frame of film.
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Old 11-25-2013, 01:19 PM   #163
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Back then, though, it hadn't been dragged out and teased for years. I think at that point it would have been appropriate for it to be an ordinary, somewhat nebbishy guy whom nobody had ever noticed before.

And I wouldn't be surprised if they thought he was Red John when they did that episode, and then changed their minds over the break.
Bruno Heller has said he didn't know who Red John was until 2-3 years ago.
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Old 11-25-2013, 01:42 PM   #164
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Bruno Heller has said he didn't know who Red John was until 2-3 years ago.
But does that mean he had no idea before then, or that he finally settled on McAllister?

That RJ-killing season finalé felt "real" to me. I just have a fairly strong feeling that they meant it at the time, and then changed their minds.
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:15 PM   #165
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As for not finding out the why, where, etc behind RJ, in real life we don't always hear what caused these crazed lunatics to do what they do, so I am alright with it not being all wrapped up with a cute little bow.
The problem is that after all this build up, there's nothing special about McAllister that makes me think, "ok, he could be Red John".

The way this whole thing was done, nothing was shown that shows why McAllister is a better choice.
He showed me nothing in the Church scenes.

They could stick Van Pelt in there instead and it wouldn't make any difference.

And they really fumbled when it came to Red John knowing about the list.

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I bet the show does not get renewed. They have wrapped up the main story and will now show us the aftermath. I would be happy with it not continuing after this season is over.
The ratings haven't been very good this season so far but since it does have some problems with the football schedule disruptions, I'd say the jury is still out on whether or not CBS picks it up for next season.

With the next episode titled "My Blue Heaven", my guess is that Jane will start tracking the serial killer "Blue Jim".



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Agreed. He was they only one of the final suspects charismatic enough to be Red John. Plus, unlike McAllister, Reed Smith, and Ray Haffner, he'd been in the show all along, instead of a one-shot character before this season. Choosing him or Bertram, or even Brett Patrtidge, would have given the impression that the show has had a goal all along. Instead, they just pulled Red John's identity out of a hat.
I was thinking that they pulled it out of a certain anatomical area.
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:18 PM   #166
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My wife equated the letdown in learning who Red John is with finally finding out who Deep Throat was. She read books about Watergate for years and then when they finally revealed his ID, she was disappointed. He wasn't even ever mentioned in any of the books she read as being a possible suspect.
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:20 PM   #167
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Way back when he killed RJ on the season finalé was a great episode. It was as if they didn't think they were going to get a new season, so they wrapped it up in that final episode.

And once they learned they were renewed, it became a scramble to start over.

I was disappointed in the 2nd killing of RJ. Maybe it was the hype, maybe the loose ends, but it just didn't give me a satisfied feeling in the end.

I too wouldn't mind if they ended the show at the end of the season.
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:24 PM   #168
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That RJ-killing season finalé felt "real" to me. I just have a fairly strong feeling that they meant it at the time, and then changed their minds.
I think the same. In fact, I am probably not remembering correctly, but I thought I remembered some comment by the showrunners that implied that he really was RJ.

It certainly seems like they changed their minds. Which is too bad, because he could have been a more satisfying RJ, at the time, than McAllister after another 2.5 seasons.

The writing this season has been terrible. Even discounting the choice of RJ, many of the episodes this season had multiple major plot points that just did not make sense. It reminds me of the final season of Dexter, where multiple seasons of mostly good writing suddenly became awful.
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:35 PM   #169
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And once they learned they were renewed, it became a scramble to start over.
I don't think there was ever any doubt that the show would go on (it's always done well in the ratings, hasn't it?). I suspect that either the writers or the network decided when they were planning the next season that without Red John, there was no show, so the Red John they killed couldn't be the real thing. Retroactively.

That's my hunch, anyway. Either they killed him and then got cold feet, or they killed him and the network balked.
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:37 PM   #170
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At last. With the Red John silliness out of the way, the show can focus on its real strength: Simon Baker's charming arrogance.
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Old 11-25-2013, 02:42 PM   #171
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Interview with the showrunner:
http://tvline.com/2013/11/24/the-men...ff-mcallister/

I feel the same as many of you. After so many years of hype, after dozens of episodes where Red John is portrayed as some amazing behind-the-scene Svengali, as a Killer who can get his followers to also kill ala Manson... he ends up being this nondescript sheriff from Podunk County.

When we were being setup to believe Bradley Whitford was RJ, he at least had a persona of mystique about him, so one could at least imagine him as RJ (plus, BW is easily a strong enough actor to pull it off).

This was...

Meh.
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Old 11-25-2013, 05:11 PM   #172
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Interview with the showrunner:
http://tvline.com/2013/11/24/the-men...ff-mcallister/

I feel the same as many of you. After so many years of hype, after dozens of episodes where Red John is portrayed as some amazing behind-the-scene Svengali, as a Killer who can get his followers to also kill ala Manson... he ends up being this nondescript sheriff from Podunk County.

When we were being setup to believe Bradley Whitford was RJ, he at least had a persona of mystique about him, so one could at least imagine him as RJ (plus, BW is easily a strong enough actor to pull it off).

This was...

Meh.
Exactly. I think I missed the first season of this show (just watched episode 1 last week).

Was it ever answered WHY Jane's family was killed??

What you called the "Podunk Sheriff" doesn't seem to have the brains or the charisma to be committing crimes all over the place (and still, I ask, ??WHY??), hold down a full-time job, and get everybody in the universe to follow him.

Don't you have to be like a John Kennedy or an Elvis Presley ... you know charisma with a CAPITAL *C*.

This show reminds me of Bones and Crossing Jordan and Castle ... lead character has major psychiatric issues and probably should not be in his/her job. That's probably why I stopped watching all of them.

The Mentalist season pass will probably go into the trash soon too. They're getting rid of two characters, changing another character drastically if you can believe the previews, plus all those other people that got killed off. Ain't too much left of the show ... is there??

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Old 11-25-2013, 05:29 PM   #173
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Was it ever answered WHY Jane's family was killed??
Jane went on TV and gave a very scathing, belittling profile of Red John. Killing his family was retaliation.
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Old 11-25-2013, 05:29 PM   #174
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Was it ever answered WHY Jane's family was killed??
Yes, more or less. Jane offended RJ on TV.
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Old 11-25-2013, 06:52 PM   #175
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What you called the "Podunk Sheriff" doesn't seem to have the brains or the charisma to be committing crimes all over the place (and still, I ask, ??WHY??), hold down a full-time job, and get everybody in the universe to follow him.
He did an excellent job of hiding in plain sight, didn't he?

I think people really aren't giving the McAllister character enough credit. There's no reason why he has to be a good sheriff. It's not necessarily in his best interest to be so. He doesn't have to be good at solving crimes. The goal of a serial killer would be to blend in. It would be to appear average in every respect. Mediocre. Fly under the radar. Think of him like a dark "Columbo". Appear bumbling to the observer, yet be brilliant in secret.

As far as "why?", why does any serial killer kill people? It's a psychological defect, a compulsion. Obviously the character enjoyed manipulating people. He treated life like it was a game. He repeatedly won, kept taking risks, until finally he took one risk too many and lost. He could have killed Jane years ago, and eliminated the threat.

ETA: I'm surprised I seem to be the only one who doesn't passionately hate this ending. Of the suspects, McAllister isn't a bad choice. I'd might even have to call him my second favorite after Partridge.
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Old 11-25-2013, 07:34 PM   #176
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He did an excellent job of hiding in plain sight, didn't he?

I think people really aren't giving the McAllister character enough credit. There's no reason why he has to be a good sheriff. It's not necessarily in his best interest to be so. He doesn't have to be good at solving crimes. The goal of a serial killer would be to blend in. It would be to appear average in every respect. Mediocre. Fly under the radar. Think of him like a dark "Columbo". Appear bumbling to the observer, yet be brilliant in secret.

As far as "why?", why does any serial killer kill people? It's a psychological defect, a compulsion. Obviously the character enjoyed manipulating people. He treated life like it was a game. He repeatedly won, kept taking risks, until finally he took one risk too many and lost. He could have killed Jane years ago, and eliminated the threat.

ETA: I'm surprised I seem to be the only one who doesn't passionately hate this ending. Of the suspects, McAllister isn't a bad choice. I'd might even have to call him my second favorite after Partridge.
Agreed
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Old 12-02-2013, 09:04 AM   #177
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Well 2 years have officially passed and things are kind of "meh" at this point.

The minute he met the American lady I knew something was up with her and I was right. I guess based on next week previews all is well in the world of Jane again and he's still up to his usual shenanigans.
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Old 12-02-2013, 09:41 AM   #178
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So, "Mentalist 2.0" is going to be what "Veronica Mars Season 3" would've been, only with Simon Baker instead of Kristen Bell? I'd prefer Kristen.

And it looks like they are going with the love triangle between Jane, Lisbon, and Agent Fischer. BLEAH.
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Old 12-02-2013, 11:02 AM   #179
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"I signed a napkin". I wonder how they will get around that part of the agreement?
Obviously, Agent Fischer will have something to do with that.
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Old 12-02-2013, 11:12 AM   #180
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Disappointed as everyone else about the Red John identity, but I was already pre-disappointed when the list of 7 was confirmed as containing the real RJ. So, separating that part of the story, I actually thought the last episode was fairly satisfying from the "good guy gets his revenge on the bad guy" angle.

And a reboot of the show, a big shakeup like they're doing? We'll see, but I think I like it. Any show gets old, and something like this is necessary, or you should just wrap it up anyway.

I knew after a couple scenes that the woman was probably a plant. A lot of the story was pretty predictable, but they have to go through it to get where they're going, and I thought it was a decent change of pace. We'll have Jane annoying the new bosses in no time, and that should be fun. I just wonder if there will be a new long term story arc like RJ again.
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